Way oil pump

JP Machining · Nov 7, 2016

My 05 Vf4 way oil pump seems to be acting up. Anyone know if there is a motor kit or something? It pumps fine by manual activation but seems the motor is not activating it.

mkd · Nov 7, 2016

so you are getting a low lube/pressure alarm?
on older models, if machine doesnt see pressure over a certain time it will trip alarm

IronReb · Nov 7, 2016

JP Machining said:
My 05 Vf4 way oil pump seems to be acting up. Anyone know if there is a motor kit or something? It pumps fine by manual activation but seems the motor is not activating it.

Your going to shit your pants if it is a part like the spindle oil coolant pump. Couldn't buy JUST the faulty pump, had to buy the whole unit, $700 worth.
If your oiler is bad it will much worse.

You really need to check the voltage at the pump and make sure its getting power.
My VF2 wasn't working, it was a bad connection at the umbilical chord going into the main electrical cabinet.

If you find that it is indeed the pump let me know.
I pulled a Bijur oiler off of a 2007 Mazak that had been FUBARED.
If it would work on your machine Im sure I could get boss to sell it at half list price.
Boss would want cash on delivery but I am sure if for some reason it did not work you just ship it back for a refund.

ewlsey · Nov 7, 2016

On a Haas, the lube pump only runs when the spindle runs. You will not be able to see the plunger move. Just put a dial indicator on top of the plunger and see if it's moving with the spindle running.

You machine looks for a pressure switch. If it does not see it in a certain period, it will set an alarm. Those linear guide machines use very little oil.

It should be a Bijur pump. Parts should be available.

IronReb · Nov 7, 2016

Hopefully you will get lucky and source parts straight from Bijur

JP Machining · Nov 7, 2016

Yes I get low lube pressure alarm. I go to back of machine and gauge above pump shows 0 psi. I can manually pull up on the knob and the gauge goes up to 40+ and then slowly bleeds down just like its supposed to. I'll have to look into power getting to it tomorrow. I think I saw something about running a MDI command for 5 rpm spindle speed and then the pump should be powered.

ewlsey · Nov 7, 2016

You can MDI any speed you want. Unlike every other machine, the Haas oil pump only runs when the spindle is on. I don't know why every other machine pisses oil all over while it's just sitting there (Okumas do something similar when the servos power down on a timer).

It's just a tiny gear motor. Check the switch also. Usually they just leak oil, but occasionally they fail to work at all.

eaglemike · Nov 8, 2016

Low pressure alarm doesn't necessarily mean it's not working. The system is supposed to hold pressure for a certain amount of time when the plunger drops. If there is a leak in the system, or pressure falls too quickly, it can cause this alarm. Techs have also told me it can be a bad pressure sending unit.
As above, put an indicator on the plunger to see if it's moving.

ewlsey · Nov 8, 2016

Yes, I leak can cause the issue. If you have a stuck metering unit it will fail to build pressure. But, you should see oil running all over.

JP Machining · Nov 8, 2016

Ok, started machine up this morning and started spindle warmup, paying attention to lube pump gauge every few minutes. The pump is being actuated by the motor, so that works, must just be falling pressure to fast. I'll have to dig into it farther when I get some time in a day or 2, and for now just deal with the alarms and make sure its still pumping once in awhile.

Where is the metering valve, or do you mean the metering orifices on each rail truck and ball screw?? I would think if they were plugged it would be too high pressure for too long, not drop in pressure. Looking more like cracked line or something maybe.

ranchak · Nov 8, 2016

My guess is you have a leaking or broken oil line.

haastec · Nov 8, 2016

JP Machining said:
Ok, started machine up this morning and started spindle warmup, paying attention to lube pump gauge every few minutes. The pump is being actuated by the motor, so that works, must just be falling pressure to fast. I'll have to dig into it farther when I get some time in a day or 2, and for now just deal with the alarms and make sure its still pumping once in awhile.

Where is the metering valve, or do you mean the metering orifices on each rail truck and ball screw?? I would think if they were plugged it would be too high pressure for too long, not drop in pressure. Looking more like cracked line or something maybe.

First, make sure the pressure switch is toggling in diagnostics to verify that it is working correctly.
If the pump is working correctly but your line pressure drops to soon, do not wait long to fix as this means something is not getting lubricated.

Yes, there will be a metering orifice at each rail truck and ball screw.

JP Machining · Nov 8, 2016

Checking things out while running. With the gauge at zero the low lube diagnostic bit is 1. If I go and manually actuate pump and gauge shows 50 psi, the low lube bit still shows 1.

Machine was sitting for a few weeks whiel I was running lathe and plasma etc, maybe the pressure sensor is stuck? Where do i find it to try and clean it?

ewlsey · Nov 8, 2016

It should be on the main line from the pump to the first distribution block. A new one is maybe $50. It looks like a oil pressure switch from an engine. In fact, you could likely find something at the auto parts store that would work, but the Haas part is pretty reasonable.

I'm sure it should be normally open, so it should be 0 with no pressure and 1 with pressure.

Check the switch with a meter though because you could have a wiring issue (unlikely though since it would have to short to power).

JP Machining · Nov 8, 2016

Just double checked how long it takes to leak down. If manually actuated it goes to 60 psi, and takes 6 minutes to get down to 5 psi. That seems like that is probably normal so thinking I dont have a broken line. Will have to dig into the switch some more.

haastec · Nov 9, 2016

JP Machining said:
Just double checked how long it takes to leak down. If manually actuated it goes to 60 psi, and takes 6 minutes to get down to 5 psi. That seems like that is probably normal so thinking I dont have a broken line. Will have to dig into the switch some more.

Sounds like a bad switch.

As a side note, check the filter for the lube line, silver housing next to the lube pump. It has a stone type filter in it. Check the filter and housing to see if it has a bunch of sludge built up in the bottom. If there is no or minimal sludge, clean and reinstall the filter. If it has a lot of sludge, I would find time to clean and purge the lube lines then check each metering orifice to make sure lube is flowing at each point. Check the lube tank for sludge also. The orifices can become clogged which means something is not getting the proper lubrication it needs to be happy. Your 6 minute cycle sounds okay though.

david n · Feb 20, 2017

JP

So was it the pressure switch? Mine is pretty much doin the same thing. Diagnostic bit is at 1 all the time. Pump seems to be pumping. Holds pressure.

JP Machining · Feb 20, 2017

Seems to be. I should probably find a part one of these days. If you find a part number let me know.

machineit2 · Feb 20, 2017

Put a camera on it and record for about a half hour or so. It moves so slow that you will not be able to see it. You will probably fine the pressure switch is bad. That is what I found when I recorded mine. The switch is about $3.00 at NAPA. It is just a standard oil pressure switch.

Mike

friesen · Feb 20, 2017

Most haas IO is pulled up, so a 1 means disconnected I am fairly sure. I put a piece of tape on my oiler just to be able to watch/confirm oil use.

Way oil pump

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