Thread: Mobility in your shop

I just wonder if anyone still has mobility in their workplace. As in lathe work one day, mill work the next, grind, lap, EDM, etc. as required? Seems like a lot of this has gone away.

I do, but thats because I am the only employee, the boss, and the floorsweeper. I was running both the lathe and the mill this evening, and its not uncommon at all for me to be forging with the power hammer in one room, and running the manual mill with the power feed and stops in the back room, taking a break every few heats to increase the depth of cut and switch the direction.
In one day, I might be running the ironworker, mill, lathe, drill press, cnc twisting machine, plasma cutting table, welding, and bending.

In my little repair shop, I can end up running each machine, welding, and doing a carburetor overhaul all in the same day. Sweeping is frequent too.

Right now i am a designer, run some faro arm, and run the stamp machines. At home i design and pay someone else to do the rest of the work, mark it up, and sell it.

I ran my shaper and the horizontal mill today and tomorrow I will finish all the parts on another horizontal mill then polish them all.

Originally Posted by aerodark

I just wonder if anyone still has mobility in their workplace. As in lathe work one day, mill work the next, grind, lap, EDM, etc. as required? Seems like a lot of this has gone away.

I know several companies that do that here. The machinists that can and in fact like to be "rotated" (as it's called here) are much appreciated. Their wages usually reflect this too

Gordon

I try to move around my employees as much as circumstances allow.

All manual machines, turning centers, machining centers, all grinding (surface and cylindrical), heat treating, welding, CAD and CAM on my own, REDM and WEDM, Gear Hobbing and Gear Shaping. I'm sure I've forgotten something... All of the preceding are done on a daily basis.

Reis,

Is work so slow for you? Only a couple weeks ago you had a full time and some partimers.

Whether a lathe operator would LIKE to be put on a MM, as his come to work surprise, I don't know. When I ran machines, I ran one type. I doubt that I would have been qualified to run a horizontal, when I ran Verticals all my time. Did I mention, I was NOT a Machinist, papers and all?

I was a VERY good VBM operator, but I would have sucked as HBM op, without a few weeks training. Lathe as well. DP, I could have probably gotten quickly.

I know that ou can run all your machines well enough to fulfill your contracts. I am doubtful if you can work as efficiently as you did with help. If the money ain't there, though, you gotta do it alone.

I am sorry that things are getting as bad for you as the rest of the country.

George

Originally Posted by gmatov

Reis,

Is work so slow for you? Only a couple weeks ago you had a full time and some partimers.

Whether a lathe operator would LIKE to be put on a MM, as his come to work surprise, I don't know. When I ran machines, I ran one type. I doubt that I would have been qualified to run a horizontal, when I ran Verticals all my time. Did I mention, I was NOT a Machinist, papers and all?

I was a VERY good VBM operator, but I would have sucked as HBM op, without a few weeks training. Lathe as well. DP, I could have probably gotten quickly.

I know that ou can run all your machines well enough to fulfill your contracts. I am doubtful if you can work as efficiently as you did with help. If the money ain't there, though, you gotta do it alone.

I am sorry that things are getting as bad for you as the rest of the country.

George

George, where are you going with that post?

As to "I was NOT a Machinist, papers and all?" then what are or were you? It's not asked as a put down as I've known really good machinists that didn't have the papers.

Originally Posted by aerodark

I just wonder if anyone still has mobility in their workplace. As in lathe work one day, mill work the next, grind, lap, EDM, etc. as required? Seems like a lot of this has gone away.

We do in a sense. We don't rotate our employees, however they do "own" their own "cell" which will include; cutting their own raw stock at a saw; deburring the stock; turning the stock in the lathe; milling the part after; deburring that then sending it off to the next cell or of to assembly...some of us are cross trained on machinery, the leads and myself and some key workers. We don't have too many "parts catchers" in the shop, they don't last long. We often have people running at least two machines simultaneously, and up to 4, which is what i was running before i got moved to EHS.

I had en Emco double lathe, a haas and a lynx single lathe and a Fanuc robomate milling station that i ran. Along with my saw and drill press for doing the finish work as the parts ran. The lathes were at a 3-4 minute cycle times and the mill had a 15 min cycle time. I did that for about 6 years. If you can't juggle, you're out. Thats how our shop goes. So you get mobility in a sense...

Originally Posted by HeavyMetalChick

We do in a sense. We don't rotate our employees, however they do "own" their own "cell" which will include; cutting their own raw stock at a saw; deburring the stock; turning the stock in the lathe; milling the part after; deburring that then sending it off to the next cell or of to assembly...some of us are cross trained on machinery, the leads and myself and some key workers. We don't have too many "parts catchers" in the shop, they don't last long. We often have people running at least two machines simultaneously, and up to 4, which is what i was running before i got moved to EHS.

I had en Emco double lathe, a haas and a lynx single lathe and a Fanuc robomate milling station that i ran. Along with my saw and drill press for doing the finish work as the parts ran. The lathes were at a 3-4 minute cycle times and the mill had a 15 min cycle time. I did that for about 6 years. If you can't juggle, you're out. Thats how our shop goes. So you get mobility in a sense...

With a handle like yours, I just HAD to send you a friendship request. MUYA! \m/

Gordon,

Gimme a dig. I have posted prob That means I did not go throably a dozen or more times that I was a VBM OPERATOR, NEVER a "papered Machinist".

That means I did not go through an Apprentice Course for Machinist. I have run at least a dozen VBM's, from 56" to 16 FOOT, and done well, made good parts, lots of money.

Is that what you want to know, throw a dig into me.

I mention, above that i would not e a very good HBM Op. Did you miss that?

Where I am going is that Ries cannot be all things to all men. He cannot run all his own machines as efficiently as he could with some help, those who run his "twisters", his scroll machines, his whatever else.

Heavy metal Chick is a Corp shill who says she ran a whole bunch of machines at once, when she was on the floor. Now she wants to make rules to make safety Job #1 for other people who have to run 5 or 6 machines at a time.

I am sorry, I am old enough that I had all I could do to make my time on one machine. Over 17 per hour to run one machine well,about 17+ per hour, plus
"bennies", compared to loading and unloading 6 machines, today, for 8 to 10 bucks an hour.

".some of us are cross trained on machinery, the leads and myself and some key workers." That makes me think that the Corp. is worried about a work stoppage, you can do the work if everybody gets too pissed off.

" key workers." 'Nother code word, "We can keep the place running even if everybody else quits."

I hope you get paid LOTS to be what you are, most "Bosses" can barely hit their ass with both hands, if you told them to.. You SOUND as though you know what is going on, but I don't trust you.

George

Originally Posted by gmatov

Gordon,

Gimme a dig. I have posted prob That means I did not go throably a dozen or more times that I was a VBM OPERATOR, NEVER a "papered Machinist".

That means I did not go through an Apprentice Course for Machinist. I have run at least a dozen VBM's, from 56" to 16 FOOT, and done well, made good parts, lots of money.

Is that what you want to know, throw a dig into me.

I mention, above that i would not e a very good HBM Op. Did you miss that?

Where I am going is that Ries cannot be all things to all men. He cannot run all his own machines as efficiently as he could with some help, those who run his "twisters", his scroll machines, his whatever else.

Heavy metal Chick is a Corp shill who says she ran a whole bunch of machines at once, when she was on the floor. Now she wants to make rules to make safety Job #1 for other people who have to run 5 or 6 machines at a time.

I am sorry, I am old enough that I had all I could do to make my time on one machine. Over 17 per hour to run one machine well,about 17+ per hour, plus
"bennies", compared to loading and unloading 6 machines, today, for 8 to 10 bucks an hour.

".some of us are cross trained on machinery, the leads and myself and some key workers." That makes me think that the Corp. is worried about a work stoppage, you can do the work if everybody gets too pissed off.

" key workers." 'Nother code word, "We can keep the place running even if everybody else quits."

I hope you get paid LOTS to be what you are, most "Bosses" can barely hit their ass with both hands, if you told them to.. You SOUND as though you know what is going on, but I don't trust you.

George

George, you can't see it of course but I'm shaking my head in surprise.
i wrote "As to "I was NOT a Machinist, papers and all?" then what are or were you? It's not asked as a put down as I've known really good machinists that didn't have the papers."

Your biggest weakness, and you seem to have several, is that you tend to judge people quickly and up until now you seem to get it very wrong.

Even those members that come right out and say they either don't like me or what I write (sometimes both ) I don't think I insult as much as you do with those you feel are "having a go" at you. The world isn't against you. You certainly seem to feel that it is.

Gordon

Where I work I am one of the few that does run different machines.Hired as a welder I get moved back and forth between welding and the machine shop.I run the lathe,mills
and the usual supporting equipment. They did put me on the cnc lathe when the guy that normally runs it was out on medical,I did ok but It's not my cup of tea.I prefer the manuals and the cnc'ers are fine with that!

Originally Posted by aerodark

I just wonder if anyone still has mobility in their workplace. As in lathe work one day, mill work the next, grind, lap, EDM, etc. as required? Seems like a lot of this has gone away.

Versatility is essential in small shops unless it's a shop that only does grinding, or screw machine work, or similar. Only large shops can afford to have people who do only one thing.

Gordon,

"George, you can't see it of course but I'm shaking my head in surprise.
i wrote "As to "I was NOT a Machinist, papers and all?" then what are or were you? It's not asked as a put down as I've known really good machinists that didn't have the papers."

Your biggest weakness, and you seem to have several, is that you tend to judge people quickly and up until now you seem to get it very wrong.

I am PRETTY SURE I have said that I was an OPERATOR. I RAN a VBM, I NEVER had an Aprenticeship in machining.

But, then, I was hired in when there were 13 thou IN the plant. "You got 2 weeks to learn how to run this machine, can you do it?" "Yes!" "OK, the job is yours for t least 2 weeks. You fuck up too bad,we send you back to where you came from." Not a bad deal, really, you can't cut the mustard, you go back to where you can, after a fashion

You may have people who can, after a fashion, make product on 6 different machines at one time. I do not think you are getting prime product from a multitasker.

Adequate, perhaps, but what do you expect when you want one man to run 6 machines?

Most of you are one man, or one man and possible help, so 6 machines don't affect you. But, you still want to pay someone who COULD run all them conventionals 10 bucks an hour. Hey, more in YOUR pocket, right?

Were I looking for a job, today, I would ask the hourly charge, and what MY share was. If you charge 60 to 100, and I get 10, no, I do not think I am being fairly compensated. I was not a Machinist. Most of my businesses were home improvements, those with employees. 1/3 was material, 1/3 was theirs, 1/3 was mine, and I usually paid out more than that to my help.

I was at all times happy with what I made. As I said, I built a house out of the pocket I put all that money into.

I don't DO any of that stuff, anymore, but I don't think that I was ever as selfish as many of you. Some of you are working strictly in your shop as your sole means of survival. I can actually understand YOU cutting pay to the bone. Them whom have more or less "Hobby Shops", you do some work, when you have some free time, you should not be dicking your help as to wages. AYE would tell most of you to stick it in your ass. I would not work for you.

George

Originally Posted by gmatov

I was at all times happy with what I made. As I said, I built a house out of the pocket I put all that money into.

I don't DO any of that stuff, anymore, but I don't think that I was ever as selfish as many of you. Some of you are working strictly in your shop as your sole means of survival. I can actually understand YOU cutting pay to the bone. Them whom have more or less "Hobby Shops", you do some work, when you have some free time, you should not be dicking your help as to wages. AYE would tell most of you to stick it in your ass. I would not work for you.

George

George, a word of friendly advice which you can take or leave.

When you write something like you just did write it as a word document (or whatever you have on your computer) and count to 10 several times before deciding whether to post or not.

Not too many weeks ago you were close to normal and coherant. If you were a dog I'd suspect you had gotten rabies. To me you're coming accross as a wannabe John Welden but at least he's always (for better or bloody worse ) been consistent. John could insult me (he probably has) and I wouldn't take offense

Gordon

P.S. John, that wasn't an invitation

Time to drag this thread back on track

We dont have mobility in the place I attend, sadly though that also means that no work goes out the door.

Let me explain

My Official job is to program, set and occasionally operate vertical machining centers.
But who makes my fixtures?

Well I do of course... but that involves manual milling, turning, grinding, inspecting

Ok so I do that

But then who writes the milling programs for the mill/turn since none of the turners know howto mill... apart from 1 who sets the citizen sliding head machines.

And then I get dragged away for a quote, or to try and explain trig, or speak with the tooling engineer, or solve an inspection problem.

So we do have that mobility in the factory.... but it only really applies to those with the skills(2 of us)
Everyone else gets their own little corner until they get a problem

Boris

Originally Posted by Boris

Time to drag this thread back on track

We dont have mobility in the place I attend, sadly though that also means that no work goes out the door.
Let me explain
My Official job is to program, set and occasionally operate vertical machining centers.
But who makes my fixtures?
Well I do of course... but that involves manual milling, turning, grinding, inspecting
Ok so I do that
But then who writes the milling programs for the mill/turn since none of the turners know howto mill... apart from 1 who sets the citizen sliding head machines.
And then I get dragged away for a quote, or to try and explain trig, or speak with the tooling engineer, or solve an inspection problem.
So we do have that mobility in the factory.... but it only really applies to those with the skills(2 of us)
Everyone else gets their own little corner until they get a problem

Boris

Boris, I don't get it. Is management satisfied with this condition? Assuming you take a holiday now and then, what happens? Seems to me that someone is just taking too much for granted and has no idea of what is going on.

Just curiosity but is there anyone between you and the owner re responsibility? Who "drags" you?

Gordon