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Thread: What happened to the pipeline thread?

  1. #21
    Greg White is offline Titanium
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    Them 20,000 jobs are temporary. Water is more important than cheap oil(HA!) let em refine where its at,then we will move it. Only ones gonna get rich are a very very few.aint nobody gonna retire with bennies from that shit work.
    Gw
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  2. #22
    dp
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    I think the pipeline thread is now the Buffet railroad thread. Or should be.

  3. #23
    Richard King is online now Stainless
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    When I started to vote, I voted Democrat because my parents did in my 20's I thought of myself as a independent voter and as I got older I switched to Republican. I think both parties in this country suck and are paid off by someone 99% of the time. I like a good exchange of ideas and have leaned a lot about oil the past week. I stated last week I sat next to a rough neck on an airplane who works in ND on oil wells, who was unemployed carpenter from Ohio and now is making over $2500.00 a week, and works only 2 weeks a month. I bet machine shops, motels, cafes, banks, grocery stores, etc in ND are booming selling to these drillers. 2 years ago they buried a 30" sanitary sewer pipe in our city. It went only 10 miles and the construction took several months (at least 6). Building the Keystone pipeline will take years and create lots of jobs we do not have now. That's the bottom line.
    Here is a good read from PBS (need to wear the bifocals).

    Extreme Oil . The Science | PBS

  4. #24
    dp
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    Even if a ditch were dug the length of the Keystone pipline's proposed run and then filled in it would create jobs - but no profit. So would paying people to dig ditches other people are paid to fill in. Lots of jobs, no profit. The payoff for the pipeline is product. That product is still going to be delivered, but now it is going to be delivered on the surface over rail and highways. Not much changed except the pocket the cash is going to go in.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard King View Post
    My whole point was we need jobs and as our president once said "shovel ready jobs" and those jobs will help our industry again so we can all see pages of help wanted machinists again. I got sick of the thread leaning "left". I saw today on Fox that to move a barrel of Oil down to Houston via the pipeline would cost $5.00 and to move it by rail (Buffet owned rail) it would cost several times that price. Be sure everyone has the barf bag handy tonight when you watch the "State of the Union"...
    Jobs at what cost though? Jobs at any cost? If the claims of the enviromental risks are legitimate then we hurt far far more by granting the pipeling than by losing short term jobs benefit.

  6. #26
    dp
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spud View Post
    Jobs at what cost though? Jobs at any cost? If the claims of the enviromental risks are legitimate then we hurt far far more by granting the pipeling than by losing short term jobs benefit.
    The pipeline is a delivery mechanism. The supply of product still there, the demand is still there, but now it will be transported over rail and tires on the highway. Which is the safer conveyance - hundreds of trains and trucks or a pipe?

    If you missed the hidden message, labor won this one. Chicago style.

  7. #27
    thermite is offline Diamond
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Welden View Post
    I had already made other posts where I point out that conservatives are fucking retards.
    Haven't been there meself, so I'll have to take your word for it as the result of personal experience, John.

    But posting about it HERE isn't the best way to handle such issues.

    What you should do is go down and report it to the local police, submit your anatomy to a 'rape kit' test, then bring them up on sexual assault charges. They may not be convicted, but there'll be at least ONE retard they know better than to go near.

    Bill
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  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by dp View Post
    Not much changed except the pocket the cash is going to go in.
    The players are still making their bets. The cards haven't been shown yet.

    Buffet does have pretty trickey sleeves though, and losta hats!



    Like Bullwinkle, he has a knack for failing upwards.

    Gotta like the delivery flexiblity of rail, even if the tankcar infrastructure is not built out.

  9. #29
    t.jones is offline Cast Iron
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  10. #30
    t.jones is offline Cast Iron
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    Delivery flexability of trains ? I don't know about that. I have a pipeline that delivers gas to my house and shop. The transportation bottleneck that Keystone 2 will replace adds 10$ per barrel to the cost of Canadian oil.---Trevor

  11. #31
    Greg White is offline Titanium
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    I dont think anybody is RUNNING AROUND, aint just it a causual sit in a chair with a pop at your reach,nice music,maybe kids or grandkids in the other room,your best buddy Fido somewhere(prolly the couch)..

    Actually I get more upset at Rommey paying less than 15% tax,money in a Swiss bank,and that Island where super rich put thier money,so as they dont get taxed,RUNNING 4 president,than I do at John swearing.
    I am sure that them rich fockers will change all the laws as soon as the get in office,so as they cant hide thier money,sure of it!yep i am,ha...
    Gw

  12. #32
    thermite is offline Diamond
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    Quote Originally Posted by t.jones View Post
    Delivery flexability of trains ? I don't know about that. I have a pipeline that delivers gas to my house and shop. The transportation bottleneck that Keystone 2 will replace adds 10$ per barrel to the cost of Canadian oil.---Trevor
    And how do we REALLY know the pipeline won't add even more?

    How many state, county, corporate and private interests along the route will hold it up in court on environmental or other economic or regulatory issues? All pain, no gain for most of those along that route, from highways to power lines to .. everything.

    For how many years - or tens of years - might it be delayed? Who pays if/as/when delays and challenges exhaust the initial funding?

    Does it ever even MAKE it to the Gulf Coast? And, if so - at what REAL net cost that must then be amortized per-barrel?

    Who should be trusted to know the answers? Politicians? Big Biz?

    Gotta be kidding either way.

    Bill

  13. #33
    t.jones is offline Cast Iron
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    Pipelines are the preffered method for moving oil all around the world. ---Trevor

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by t.jones View Post
    Pipelines are the preffered method for moving oil all around the world. ---Trevor
    And tankcars double as storage, that you can send to the best market. Pipelines are hard to re-route.

  15. #35
    Greg White is offline Titanium
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    oil tankers seem quite popular,no?
    Homosape e ions need water more than oil,no? thats next decades war,no?
    Gw
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  16. #36
    thermite is offline Diamond
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    Quote Originally Posted by t.jones View Post
    Pipelines are the preffered method for moving oil all around the world. ---Trevor
    We aren't dealing with conventional 'oil' here. It is bitumen. Read this:

    Oil sands - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Extract:

    "The heavy crude oil or crude bitumen extracted from oil sands is a viscous, solid or semisolid form that does not easily flow at normal oil pipeline temperatures, making it difficult to transport to market and expensive to process into gasoline, diesel fuel, and other products."

    Either the pipeline has to be HEATED its entire length, the bitumen must be catalytically 'upgraded' before putting it into the pipeline, or some combination thereof.

    Great deal of water needed, hard to keep the catalysts effective, overall very costly to do all that... and the process of so doing throws off a huge amount of 'greenhouse' gasses before the first barrel is ready to ship - pipeline or 'whatever'..

    And, BTW, if shipped by rail, it need be heated only for loading and unloading. Matters not if it travels in between as a gel. Might even be safer that way. Less risk of spread or fire if there is a derailment.

    Meanwhile, here's an example of what can be expected from the 'greens', who believe they've only won 'round one' of a long fight:

    Obama Said No... | Opinion | The Harvard Crimson

    They will not now roll over and whimper - they'll remain opposed and well organized.

    So keyboarding paleo-facist 'fuck-THEE' fatwahs is not only rude and annoying - it is totally irrelevant.

    As usual.

    Bill

  17. #37
    Solar71 is offline Titanium
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    The more I think about it the more I feel my mind changing on the subject.

    If Canada is willing to pay the US billions of dollars to pipe and refine there dirty oil, thats fine with me. As long as the route does not go over any aquafiers. All they have to do is reroute the pipe a little bit to steer clear of it. If they do that, then im ok with it. It really does not matter if we get that oil or not, its going on to the open market.

    In my opinion, the more oil on the open market the better. More supply can only equal lower prices. Its only when supply runs low that the price goes up right?

    So maybe Obama should approve the pipeline with an agreement to reroute it over land that is not so important to us.

    BAM!!! billions of dollars, and a few thousand jobs to boot...

    PS : My only worry would be the extra sulfer being pumped into the air... I guess there is no way around that.
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  18. #38
    Richard King is online now Stainless
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    Here is a "editorial" from a Houston Newspaper that looks like it's a daily newspaper and not some online rag.

    Keystone pipeline delay is the wrong call - Houston Chronicle

    We all (PM'ers) have our views....it doesn't seem many of us will change our minds.

    We all want to help each other in our industry, we can all drop this thread and go back to machine shop talk...

  19. #39
    thermite is offline Diamond
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard King View Post
    We all (PM'ers) have our views....it doesn't seem many of us will change our minds.
    Many of us may well do as more, and better vetted, info is dug out.

    We all want to help each other in our industry, we can all drop this thread and go back to machine shop talk...
    Seconded.

    Not because it isn't important.
    Just because it is now plenty 'visible', lots of folk BESIDES Big Gov and Big Biz are watching, challenging, seeking answers, and will continue to.

    Meanwhile - none of 'em are doing OUR jobs or paying our bills....

    Bill
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  20. #40
    Richard King is online now Stainless
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spud View Post
    Jobs at what cost though? Jobs at any cost? If the claims of the enviromental risks are legitimate then we hurt far far more by granting the pipeling than by losing short term jobs benefit.
    This is your opinion and other Green looking people. I have a different opinion. Moving by pipeline is far safer then by tanker ships, rail and truck the experts say in all these pro and con articles. I read everyone's articles they post here, pro and con, do you?

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