manual,
"I think that the unions have in large part destroyed the title of "machinist" by classifying every position that they can as machinist, so it doesn't have the meaning that it once did.
It is a completely different trade nowadays. "
There are few UNIONS with enough power to "destroy he title of Machinist." There is no such thing any more, and that is because you owners want ignoramuses who have no concept of "machining". . Push a button, put stock in, take parts out.
It is that easy, why pay UNION employee 15 an hour to do what you can pay 7.25 for?
Spinit,
" This way they might use class A,B,C or whatever. I have seen that done. The idea was that A might be the highest paid. Also they might have certain skills listed for each one which encourages a man to get better. I have also seen it done with other workers like welders and so on."
YOU may have seen UNIONS that do so, I never have, and I have only belonged to 3 of them. EVERY Member who was in any class job was paid the same BASE pay as an old timer was. IF I could do m,ore work than a 60 YO could,, I, of course made more money, but that was because we were on an incentive program. I was a better, partly because I was younger, Op, I could outwork all my old teachers. I made more, period.
You people seem to think that everybody you hire has only one pace. You don't pay them to produce. You give them a job, on a CNC, and they can't really be expected to beat the program. So they make 9 bucks, period.
Oh, for Christ's sake, Manual! 7 fucking percent of the other than Gov working pop IS UNION. THAT fucking few are fucking YOU? Open your eyes!!!
7 fucking percent has all you Republicans shitting your pants!
UNIONS have been trying to get Corps to re-instate the apprenticeships. Corps no longer feel that they need trained people. Anybody can punch buttons. Witness most of you.
Spinit,
" Being less dependent upon SS or whatever is a good thing. "
I would bet you that most of those who have paid INTO SS have a better pay back than they have from YOUR pension plan You have a 401. BFD.. My SS is about 2.25 times my pension. For most of us, SS is the biggest part of our income. Is my 401 viable? Yes it is. I got money in there. I take some out, as I have to, every year. I am not as poor as some of you "Owners".
I don't owe on those rental machines, for one thing. Most of you don't even OWN the fucking things. Rental charge is more than you can make off them.
I would hate to try to compete with someone who would cut prices to the bone to keep the knackers away. But you HAVE to. I feel for you. You let your alligator mouth, I can do that, overload your hummingbird ass. You really cannot do that, unless you buy yet another machine.
That is where the manual machinist shines. Yes, I can make that. No, I cannot pump out 1500 per day. I make them one at a time, but they will all be correct. Not a CNC product that 1500 will ALL be fucked up to the same degree.
Tolerances come into play. CNC has them. Good enough. Within tolerance. Machinists, and there are very few, anymore, pride themselves on being dead on.
I am preaching to the Choir. Half of you, or more, are button pushers, 25% or more are laid off and had to try to make a living on your old iron, very few have decent jobs.
George