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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewlsey View Post
    Plenty of US companies successfully manufacture products in other countries. US auto makers have been building cars in Mexico, Canada, England, Australia, Korea, Japan, China, Brazil, etc. for decades. Other US companies like GE, Cat, John Deere, Apple, etc have been making products abroad for nearly as long as they have been in existence.

    Plenty of US companies manufacture everything overseas...

    yup.
    Cat has over 20 factories in China. Ford has had factories in Mexico for almost a hundred years. Lincoln Welders and Kohler, both "american" brand names trusted for above average quality, have successfully made product in China FOR China for a long time, and, as mentioned above, Buick, along with Cadillac, both make and SELL a lot of cars in China as well- I think more than USA, even for Caddy. Cadillac sold 15,000 cars in September in the USA, and 17,000 in China.
    Cadillac Global Sales Rise 16.5 Percent in September

    and check out the picture of the pretty Cadillac factory in Jinqiao-
    Cadillac Shanghai China Plant | GM Authority
    versus the US factory in Detroit-
    Dead Cadillac Plant's Empty Land Will Soon Be Rebuilt - Curbed Detroit
    you will notice a difference in a mere glance.

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    Just for some imperialist giggles, check out this picture of those primitive Chinese workers welding in the Cadillac factory in China- you will note they are not wearing shoes, or welding hoods.
    https://www.automationmag.com/media/...ghai-3-WEB.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by gustafson View Post

    US cars have been metric since the early 80's if not before[my 1982 Dodge was metric, so that is my frame of reference]
    Yes, the 80's were a cross over time. New designs were in metric, but any cars using "legacy" parts still contained the imperial parts that were old designs. I remember having to have two wrench sets out to work on my parent's and my 80's cars. I think pretty much all the legacy parts were gone by the 90's. I recall them being pretty pure metric from a fasteners stand point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    Just for some imperialist giggles, check out this picture of those primitive Chinese workers welding in the Cadillac factory in China- you will note they are not wearing shoes, or welding hoods.
    https://www.automationmag.com/media/...ghai-3-WEB.jpg
    Total disregard for the worker safety

    Ironically, automation is one of the key points in allowing manufacturing to be easily installed and utilized in a location far from home.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy2 View Post
    Total disregard for the worker safety

    Ironically, automation is one of the key points in allowing manufacturing to be easily installed and utilized in a location far from home.
    also ironically, China is eating our lunch when it comes to automating factories, because for the last ten to fifteen years, skilled labor in particular has been getting 10% and 15% a year raises. Imagine that in the USA- where wages have been flat for over 20 years- shit, I would be making a hunnert dollars an hour!
    And, while hiring a bunch of teenage girls for peanuts sounds good- its actually not a very efficient way to do anything but the most unskilled work- many never come back from the Chinese New Year vacation, or only work one year, and, due to the longstanding 1 child policy, there are actually fewer young people than you would think in a country of 1.5 (plus or minus a few hundred million rounding error) Billion people.

    unskilled labor factories have been leaving China since 2008- in that year, 100,000 factories in South China went under, and most re-opened in Vietnam, or Bangladesh, or Cambodia, instead.

  7. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeaMoss View Post
    Buy something from the 60's ... Galaxie, Mustang, Camaro, SS 396 Impala, E-Type, Mark II, Alfa ... or a 52 Buick or a 48 Caddy. Just about any of them will be better than the new shit. Air bags are for sissies

    I'm a car guy, have owned about every muscle car out there starting with the 63 Tempest at age 15 and LS7 cars, six packs, Stangs, many T/As and such.
    ( should have packed some of them in a nitrogen bag with today's prices)
    A few imports, Jags and Lotus.
    All nice to reminisce but they can't hold a candle to today's econo cars in driveability.
    Really ... the 396 SS Impala or the E-Type? Collector for sure but not nicely behaved cars.
    One can not turn, the other can not accelerate. Both of which I have had and liked but we tend to judge our old lovers differently.

    I get the love we hold for old stuff and do have that nostalgia for cars in my past but push a new vette to the edge and it is just .... better at everything.
    Yes, I hold a soft spot for the LS-7 Chevelle, Tri-power vette, Six-pack Cuda, the T/As and even my go cart Delorean but they really are poopy autos now.

    We have come so far in cars, most people would hate any premium 60-70s car as a daily driver.
    Nice to show but in all, a piece of shit now.
    Bob

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces View Post
    There's a guy near me has a new red " Mustang ", 5 litre. As far as I know it's a right hand drive. Sounds great but he must have his own oil well in the back garden.

    Regards Tyrone.
    The loud pedal is directly connected to the fuel tank sending unit on those cars....

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamm View Post
    Yes, the 80's were a cross over time. New designs were in metric, but any cars using "legacy" parts still contained the imperial parts that were old designs. I remember having to have two wrench sets out to work on my parent's and my 80's cars. I think pretty much all the legacy parts were gone by the 90's. I recall them being pretty pure metric from a fasteners stand point.
    It's kind of still a mess. I know Ford was still using engines like the 300 I6, 302, and 351 V8 up to 96 or so. Those motors were all inch fasteners except for most of the fuel injection and emissions systems there were designed in the 80s and used metric.

    The 7.3 diesel engines were mostly inch and used until 2004.

    Certain things are still inch sizes due to SAE standards that go way back. Like all seatbelt anchor bolts are 7/16 threads, even the Japanese and European models. Lot's of bell housing and flywheel bolts are also inch due to SAE standards.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    NO thanks, been there, done that, and lay in the gutter changing 20 dollar generators every 10,000 miles.
    Good, more for me ! Although all the ones I like are expensive now 64 Galaxie 500 at the top of the list, small block and, now that there's no drive-ins, bucket seats. Remember when the cup holders wore poodle skirts ? Do you still keep it in second and fourth ?

    But I gotta ask ... what were you driving that you had to lie in the gutter to change the generator ? I've never seen one, even on the ghastly e-type, that you didn't attack from above.

    And even in 64, Fords had alternators ...

    My cheap used 2008 Mazda 3 hatchback, with good tires, outperformed my Camaro by about double ...
    I see you're not a donuts guy I hate front drive. Absolutely hate it.

    btw, I was stuck with a Honda Accord (or maybe it was a civic ? they all look the same) for a couple months once ... got to where I could change the head gasket in an hour and a half. Did it three times before I got my own car back and returned the stinking Honda.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ewlsey View Post
    It's kind of still a mess. I know Ford was still using engines like the 300 I6, 302, and 351 V8 up to 96 or so. Those motors were all inch fasteners except for most of the fuel injection and emissions systems there were designed in the 80s and used metric.

    The 7.3 diesel engines were mostly inch and used until 2004.

    Certain things are still inch sizes due to SAE standards that go way back. Like all seatbelt anchor bolts are 7/16 threads, even the Japanese and European models. Lot's of bell housing and flywheel bolts are also inch due to SAE standards.
    True, it is amazing how long some legacy designs can hold on in the auto world. I suppose the GM V8 engines didn't go metric until the Gen 3 engines came out in the mid-nineties.

  12. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeaMoss View Post
    Good, more for me ! Although all the ones I like are expensive now 64 Galaxie 500 at the top of the list, small block and, now that there's no drive-ins, bucket seats. Remember when the cup holders wore poodle skirts ? Do you still keep it in second and fourth ?

    But I gotta ask ... what were you driving that you had to lie in the gutter to change the generator ? I've never seen one, even on the ghastly e-type, that you didn't attack from above.

    And even in 64, Fords had alternators ...


    I see you're not a donuts guy I hate front drive. Absolutely hate it.

    btw, I was stuck with a Honda Accord (or maybe it was a civic ? they all look the same) for a couple months once ... got to where I could change the head gasket in an hour and a half. Did it three times before I got my own car back and returned the stinking Honda.
    I am guessing you dont own any right now. 20/20 hindsight, and blissfullly blurred memories. I had several Falcons, all had generators, and regardless of where I was when I wrenched em, the damn things had an incredibly short lifespan, as did the drum brakes, the transmissions- hey, since you dont live in the USA, maybe you havent noticed- but there are no more transmission shops on every corner. When I was growing up, there were dozens of tranny rebuild places in every city- because US slushboxes of the fifties and sixties were complete pieces of shit. I had a fair amount of $299 rebuilds done- and they lasted maybe 50k.
    I have driven 3 or 4 Hondas, along with some Mazdas and Nissans, to 200k miles, without a single transmission failure.
    In fact, I have never had the head off a single Honda in probably 600k miles of various Hondas.
    My guess is you are talking about something like a 1970s Civic.
    Dude- the world has changed.

    Anybody who actually buys cars, and drives em a lot, and isnt still waking up every morning in 1972, will acknowledge how much better built modern cars are.
    Donuts? Serio? You are turning donuts in China? Why do I doubt this?
    The current state of congestion, and traffic cop tolerance for "childish pranks" in the USA, for, say, the last 30 years, means that the ability to spin donuts, outside paid track time, is just not a big concern for current car buyers in the USA.

    I buy cars to drive em, not to fix em. Modern cars dont break much. I like that. I have changed my share of clutches, rebuilt my share of carburators, breathed my share of brake pad dust, swapped my share of water pumps, and patched rust, replaced a lot of crappy zinc diecast handles and hinges, and am quite happy to never do so again.

    And tires- you can put some halfway decent modern tires on just about any small hatchback today, and outcorner any muscle car built in the sixties and the seventies. When combined with a well engineered car, like my old 300zx, you leave those silly Mustangs behind rather rapidly.

    I love all cars- dont get me wrong. If I could afford it, I would certainly have a land yacht or two. But for day to day use, modern japanese cars are fun, fast, economical, and, most importantly, they dont break.

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    Quote Originally Posted by adamm View Post
    Yes, the 80's were a cross over time. New designs were in metric, but any cars using "legacy" parts still contained the imperial parts that were old designs. I remember having to have two wrench sets out to work on my parent's and my 80's cars. I think pretty much all the legacy parts were gone by the 90's. I recall them being pretty pure metric from a fasteners stand point.
    Oh god...
    The joy of Dodge/Mitsu mashups...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ries View Post
    also ironically, China is eating our lunch when it comes to automating factories, because for the last ten to fifteen years, skilled labor in particular has been getting 10% and 15% a year raises. Imagine that in the USA- where wages have been flat for over 20 years- shit, I would be making a hunnert dollars an hour!
    And, while hiring a bunch of teenage girls for peanuts sounds good- its actually not a very efficient way to do anything but the most unskilled work- many never come back from the Chinese New Year vacation, or only work one year, and, due to the longstanding 1 child policy, there are actually fewer young people than you would think in a country of 1.5 (plus or minus a few hundred million rounding error) Billion people.

    unskilled labor factories have been leaving China since 2008- in that year, 100,000 factories in South China went under, and most re-opened in Vietnam, or Bangladesh, or Cambodia, instead.
    Much of what we demand simply cannot be made by people.
    China was very clear about technology sharing and learned very rapidly what took the USA decades of work to figure out.
    I put together a proposal once for a small machine and sent it off to the client.
    I was quite surprised to find a 'knock off' of my conceptual design on the plant floor shipped in from China.
    After that I became much more circumspect about who got my conceptual work.
    The client was utterly unrepentent and told us to sue for violating the NDA.

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    Old Ford advertisement was about how handy its to replace the motor with Ford crate motor after 60000 miles! Todays Fords need oil change every 37000 miles..

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    Quote Originally Posted by ewlsey View Post
    I used to work in the US engineering center of a Japanese auto manufacturer. We had the ability to do 100% of the engineering required to design and build a car in the US with no support from Japan.

    It's a bit counter intuitive, but many car models are produced across the globe in duplicate manufacturing facilities. Something like a Toyota Corolla might be built in US, Brazil, England, Korea, Japan, China, etc simultaneously. Duplicate parts suppliers and tooling suppliers would be sourced locally. Somehow it more economical than making them all in one huge facility and shipping them around the globe.
    yes quite common to make same parts at different sites world wide. it also helps with supply disruptions from natural disasters like hurricanes, earthquakes, etc. and it helps with competition. i worked in company in new york state where i was told every day how productive the other sites were and how we had to do better or would be the 1st to shutdown when things were slow.
    .
    not for nothing NY factory had better efficiency but was shutdown 1st cause of taxes it was cheaper to keep Colorado factory running 100%. our better efficiency could not make up for higher taxes

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattiJ View Post
    Old Ford advertisement was about how handy its to replace the motor with Ford crate motor after 60000 miles! Todays Fords need oil change every 37000 miles..
    .
    kind of sad my wife could choose Ford Fiesta made in Mexico or Toyota corolla made most in USA. the Ford Fiesta made transmission noise 1st week we got it and we brought back to have it fixed many times. i had to have it towed 3 times cause it would not start cause of transmission. after 3 years our greatest joy was when driving to Nissan dealer and hearing the transmission noise was when it made it there to trade in for Nissan car and Nissan did not notice the problem to refuse the trade in.
    .
    kind of sad when greatest joy is car made it to dealer for trading in for a different car companies car

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    The Jeep Wrangler is available as a right hand drive in the USA. They are mostly intended for rural mail delivery. The Wrangler is also the U.S. vehicle with the greatest domestic content at about 74%.

    The auto business is global in nature and auto parts are exported by many countries including USA. The main impediment to foreign sales of complete autos is not size or lack of right hand drive but rather federally mandated features unique to the USA. Many countries also impose high tariffs, making them less attractive.

    Most U.S. cars can be fitted as right hand drive for export if there is a sufficient market to justify the costs. There is nothing inherently "left-handed" about most models and the mechanicals are usually straight forward but the cosmetics of the dash often require additional tooling.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scottl View Post
    Most U.S. cars can be fitted as right hand drive for export if there is a sufficient market to justify the costs. There is nothing inherently "left-handed" about most models and the mechanicals are usually straight forward but the cosmetics of the dash often require additional tooling.
    The dash is the easy part.
    The steering rack alone is a nut buster.
    Throw in all the engine packaged around the steering shaft move the brake master, new holes and mounting points in the fire wall.

    The USA is the third largest exporter by value in the world behind Germany and Japan.
    I think we're doing OK.
    We build them as well as the Germans and Japanese...tarrifs and design restrictions or not we could never build them cheaper to sell into India or other low end countries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Miguels244 View Post
    The dash is the easy part.
    A few years ago I was over in Taiwan, and we rented a shit box for a long weekend.. A
    Toyota something or other I think, 1.2L or something.. All the gages were in a weird
    holographic goofy thing in the center of the dash.. If you took the steering wheel
    and pedals out, you couldn't tell what side you were supposed to drive from.

    As an aside.. 3 days of driving all over the place, the fuel gage still was sitting on the "F",
    didn't even put gas in it before we brought it back.




    The steering rack alone is a nut buster.
    Throw in all the engine packaged around the steering shaft move the brake master, new holes and mounting points in the fire wall.
    Rear wheel drive and a straight six makes everything SOOOO much easier (and fun to drive)..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobw View Post
    Rear wheel drive and a straight six makes everything SOOOO much easier (and fun to drive)..
    I can't imagine the mass my old AMC would have been if it weren't engineered ambidextrous from the start.


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