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Thread: Payroll tax cut good for the US?
12-26-2011, 04:02 PM #101
FactCheck.org: Kerry Ad Falsely Accuses Cheney on Halliburton
There's an interesting site that tracks the problem of misconduct. Here's the dirt on KBR:
Contractor Profile - Federal Contractor Misconduct Database - POGO
The top 100 list is here:
Home - Federal Contractor Misconduct Database - POGO
12-26-2011, 04:59 PM #102
Most telling: his net worth was $50 million (mostly in Halliburton stock) when he took office in 2000. His net worth when he left office was $95 million
History's Highest-Priced Ticket - Forbes.com
"Cheney continues to hold 433,333 Halliburton stock options, and receives a deferred salary of about $200,000 a year. According to Cheney’s most recent tax returns, he held $2.5 million in retirement accounts, much of which likely came from his former defense firm.
Cheney recently filed disclosure reports that show he is valued at $94 million."
12-26-2011, 06:09 PM #103
That still would leave the possibility that Cheney could profit from his Halliburton stock options if the company's stock rises in value. However, Cheney and his wife Lynne have assigned any future profits from their stock options in Halliburton and several other companies to charity. And we're not just taking the Cheney's word for this -- we asked for a copy of the legal agreement they signed, which we post here publicly for the first time.
The "Gift Trust Agreement" the Cheney's signed two days before he took office turns over power of attorney to a trust administrator to sell the options at some future time and to give the after-tax profits to three charities. The agreement specifies that 40% will go to the University of Wyoming (Cheney's home state), 40% will go to George Washington University's medical faculty to be used for tax-exempt charitable purposes, and 20% will go to Capital Partners for Education, a charity that provides financial aid for low-income students in Washington, DC to attend private and religious schools.
The agreement states that it is "irrevocable and may not be terminated, waived or amended," so the Cheney's can't take back their options later.
The options owned by the Cheney's have been valued at nearly $8 million, his attorney says. Such valuations are rough estimates only -- the actual value will depend on what happens to stock prices in the future, which of course can't be known beforehand. But it is clear that giving up rights to the future profits constitutes a significant financial sacrifice, and a sizable donation to the chosen charities.
And that's just the stock options you (and Kerry) are going on about. You should visit the link.
12-26-2011, 06:26 PM #104
"The agreement states that it is "irrevocable and may not be terminated, waived or amended," so the Cheney's can't take back their options later."
Just like a pre-nup wedding agreement, huh. Those can never be overturned, right? That's what lawyers are for. Think the Cheneys know any lawyers? That's like Warren Buffet giving away his zillions after he dies- but he's giving it to the Bill and What's her name Gates foundation, then they give away what's left after administrative costs. Administrative costs can get out of hand, I bet.
I say if the Cheneys are gonna give it away, give it right now, not at a future, indeterminate date. Sell the stock and cash in all the chips and give it to charity R.F.N.~ that is if you really plan on giving it away.
12-26-2011, 06:29 PM #105
Cheney is a sociopath interested in seeing people die. I doubt he's really motivated all that much by money.
I'm sure he's well taken care of by all the companies that made billions off his war shit. That stock he gave away doesn't matter.
Hope his heart gives out for good soon.
12-26-2011, 06:50 PM #106
12-26-2011, 07:07 PM #107
Bush increased the national debt by $4.9 trillion plus the lifetime cost of the Iraq War (estimated around $4.5 trillion so far).
Iraq war will cost more than World War II - CSMonitor.com
Obama has increased the national debt by $4 trillion (so far), but then again the first 9 months of Obama's tenure was Bush's budget.
Neither is an example of fiscal responsiblity. On the other hand, a large portion of both Bush and Obama's debt increase was the ~ $3.5 trillion in Wall Street bailouts...
12-26-2011, 07:26 PM #108
Back to the idea of how the payroll tax cut helped me. Back last year when this started I had these dreams of all that cash flowing into my pocket and how I would look in my new black Caddilac Escalade, All said and done, I used the cash to put an extra 1/4 tank of gas in my Ford Ranger
12-26-2011, 07:33 PM #109
The agreement specifies that 40% will go to the University of Wyoming (Cheney's home state), 40% will go to George Washington University's medical faculty to be used for tax-exempt charitable purposes, and 20% will go to Capital Partners for Education, a charity that provides financial aid for low-income students in Washington, DC to attend private and religious schools.
They are giving away the future profits. Same way the Nobel prize works. The prize money comes from investments of Nobel's fortune. If it had all been given away there would be no future. As it is, the money is earning enough to pay out quite a bit to Nobel prize winners after all these years.
That is the idea behind Cheney's stock holdings. They will continue to earn forever so long as some portion remains invested. In 2008 those options were worth $8,165,489.07 from an original value of aroun $250,000. That excess goes to charity. How can that be a bad thing?
12-26-2011, 07:41 PM #110
12-26-2011, 08:37 PM #111
15.1 Trillion debt today
17.6 Trillion CBO projection by 2015 (4 years from now)
23.8 Trillion at they current rate of spending
So we take on another 8 Trillion in 4 years? The Federal income is only 2.3 Trillion but they spend double that now. BOTH parties SPEND IT!
The main problem I believe is just what happened in this last extension bill. Like the OP says, 90% would vote for it but then someone comes along and uses that to get a pipeline! Could be and i think it is a very good idea to allow the pipeline BUT NOT HOLD HOSTAGE some other legislation.
When your CNC goes down and you need a new spindle you may discuss the pros and cons of what to replace it with, perhaps you have a plan to sell that machine and buy a newer one, perhaps you can fix it. I can tell you one thing though, If I were in business and my machine went down that I make a living with and my partner said he would only vote to repair or buy a new one if we also set aside twice as much money to fund his dream trip to the moon I think we would have a problem.
The compromise concept they have in Washington should be called what it is, Blackmail. At least they should compromise within the same subject matter and not hold hostage a decision to repair a hole in the roof that lets in all the rain and a vacation to Hawaii.
BOTH PARTIES SUCK SHIT! Stop fighting your brothers and sisters who are in the same dam boat you are in, you may need their help when the the music finally stops, and it will stop just like the Nasdaq did 10 years ago. That was a 25 year ride up and just a few short years down. How long has this massive debt been building? Are you ready? It is unsustainable and un fixable without a massive correction.
Others here have pointed out the cure is now as bad as the status quo. It really is too late to fix it.
12-26-2011, 08:40 PM #112
12-26-2011, 08:44 PM #113
12-26-2011, 08:54 PM #114
12-26-2011, 08:57 PM #115
Doubling your money in 10 years is not rocket science.
12-26-2011, 09:04 PM #116
12-26-2011, 09:15 PM #117
Interesting comments here. We need to remember it is the congress who make the laws and the president only signs them. just for clairity the Dems controled the congress and senate in 07 and 08 and 09 and 10 and still controls the senate. The bubble started breaking in 07.
Sure a lot of what seems to be class envy here. So how does that help anything? Basicly may be better just to apply the comandments. Like the one thou shalh not covet.
Another point. We are a republic and not a democracy as stated above. There is a difference.
A very wise man once said: We have learned by sad experiance that it is the nature of almost all men that as soon as they get some authority as they suppose they imeadiatly begin to exercise un rightious dominion.
I would also think that this applies to everyone posting here. Probally even me, If you were them you would likely see things different. Maybe even the way they see them.
So the only thing we can do is dump all the entrenched players and start over fresh and then do the term limit thing and tort reform would also be good. maybe even make the positions no pay expenses only. Maybe we would get a little service out of them for a change.
It is high time to sweep both houses and level the playing field with support for the Fair Tax.
12-26-2011, 09:16 PM #118
Dick Cheney - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Cheney resigned as CEO of Halliburton on July 25, 2000. As vice president, he argued that this step removed any conflict of interest. Cheney's net worth, estimated to be between $30 million and $100 million, is largely derived from his post at Halliburton"
12-26-2011, 09:36 PM #119
His separation package and deferred earnings payment mean nothing as that was all settled before he became VP. He had the deferred payroll funds insured so that Halliburton could go belly up and he still would have gotten paid. That no doubt to assuage the chatter that he had an interest in Halliburton's continued good health so he would get all of his deferred paychecks. I can find no evidence that he profited from Halliburton while VP.
Edit: Not to forget - we're on this tangent because of your absurd and unsupportable claim that Halliburton made trillion$ from the Iraq war.
12-27-2011, 07:35 AM #120
So Dennis defends Wall Street Bankers, Bush, Newt and now Cheney? LOL
Excellent entertainment, thank you.