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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewlsey View Post
    Anyone with two brain cells to rub together can see that what I described is the antithesis of efficiency and profitability.
    Try hard to not be such a whiner

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  3. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by rotarySMP View Post
    In 20 years GE could well be the last man standing in commercial aviation engines. The massive R&D investment in CMC#s (ceramic matrix composites over the last 30 years is finally bearing fruit, and will allow then to keep cranking comrpession rations and turbine inlet temps. They have far fewer fan blade issues as the competition on the large turbofans due to their long experience in composite blades.

    Hard to see the P&W1000 series rescueing P&W as a first tier manufacturer, and RR is also doing so well at present, having traded profitablity for market share for the last two decades.

    Mark
    they may have figured out CMC's but they are about to go industry wide and any advantage they had will be gone soon. And GE only owns 50% of CFan. The company that actually makes the blades.


    GE better hope that the 9x out does the competition for a long time. because if it doesn't, they are screwed.

  4. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkmc View Post
    Try hard to not be such a whiner
    Meanwhile your job goes to China. Wonder why.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ewlsey View Post
    Meanwhile your job goes to China. Wonder why.
    You better get involved in politics so you can change things for the better.
    You've got the personality to be a typical politician.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dkmc View Post
    You better get involved in politics so you can change things for the better.
    You've got the personality to be a typical politician.
    The OP of this thread posited a reasonable question regarding *why* GE could be in such dire straits, and Wes offered his direct experiences with the company which indicate practises that strangle the firm's ability to operate.

    I realise this is the subforum where good ideas go to die (or in the case of one malignant tumour of an OP, are never conceived) but let's not abort this thread too early.

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  9. #26
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    Understand two items. The new CEO us setting to make a name for himself. Management has little control over the unions. Some union shops are as bad as eslsey says, it was like that in Appliance Park. Where I worked the union wasn't as bad.

    Tom

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    As the ex-employee of a company that they recently took over and wrecked the IT department of (despite having said initially that our in-house resources would help to reduce their over reliance on outsourcing), I would say that there was far too much emphasis on 'this quarter's share growth' and the circular but-fuck hero worship mentality that lauded every ill-conceived idea from on high, without anyone saying 'No! that doesn't make sense'.

    It's upsetting when you predict problems, they are ignored and then they happen anyway. But I, personally, don't care now. I do feel sorry for my remaining ex-colleagues who are still trying to put things back together.


    Bitter, twisted? Not at all. Far beyond that .

  12. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewlsey View Post
    I've done work in a few GE facilities and heard the same thing. It's not hard to see why though.

    Needed to remove a hydraulic pump from a machine. Here were the steps required:

    1) Call a mechanic to remove the covers and pull the pump out of the machine.

    2) Call a plumber to remove the hoses.

    3) Call an electrician to remove the wires. The controls technician I was working with is not allowed to do that.

    4) Take pump to tool crib. Wait about an hour for someone to find a new one.

    5) Call plumber, electrician, mechanic, and controls guy to install new pump. Wait as required.

    6) Push button to start machine.


    I could have done that job in 20 minutes. It took 6 hours to install, and another 2 hours to make it actually work. An entire shift to swap out a 1/4hp hydraulic pump.

    The unions have "protected" themselves right out of a job...
    I experienced the same thing at the International Harvester Louisville facility in the early '80s!

    Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by mister honey View Post
    I experienced the same thing at the International Harvester Louisville facility in the early '80s!

    Mike
    I don't know how any person, union or not, can look at that system and not see how fucked up it is. I've seen it other places too, Chrysler being one.

    The most frustrating part is if one of those guys, plumber, electrician, mechanic, etc doesn't have work to do in their trade, they can't help someone else or fill in. They just sit on their ass and wait.

    Other places like Cat got rid of all the union maintenance people and farmed the whole thing out to an outside contractor. Much easier to get things done there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sable View Post
    You missed out all the risk assessments and paperwork at every stage,at least that's what it's like over here.
    I was at Ford in Dearborn with an Indycar on the shaker rig. A hydraulic line came loose and started to leak. The machine operator said he had to call maintenance to fix it. eventually a supervisor showed up and said that line looks like it is leaking, I'll call maintenance. Eventually a maintenance supervisor shows up and says that line is leaking I'll get it fixed, after another wait the maintenance man shows up, says it is leaking I need to go get a wrench, I offer him the one I would have used to fix it with 6 hours ago. He says no and disappears for another hour before returning with one that was too small. I don't know what time they got it tightened up as we went to the hotel after being told it would be fixed by morning. I could have tightened it up in about 30 seconds, instead we lost about 8 hours testing time. No wonder they send work to china.

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    Quote Originally Posted by moonlight machine View Post
    No wonder they send work to china.
    What they don't know (or don't care) is that China is worse. I once waited two days for the oil lady to determine what S.S.U. 200 oil was ... I guess the hourly rate is lower, but moving factories isn't free either.

    By the way, is youse guys behind the times or somethign ? GE decided to divest the non-related (e.g., they said they'd keep financing for locomotives and other GE products) finance division over two years ago ... some time in 2015, I think.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rotarySMP View Post
    Hard to see the P&W1000 series rescueing P&W as a first tier manufacturer, and RR is also doing so well at present, having traded profitablity for market share for the last two decades. Mark
    Mark,
    I heard on the news that Rolls-Royce reported a record loss last year, quite a shock.

    Rolls-Royce reports record loss of PS4.6bn - BBC News

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    I have little understanding of the GE Aviation division advancements, but in response to the OP inquiry on GE Finance and aviation lending, it can also be looked at as GE taking a bet against the economy.

    GE Finance was a moderate to high risk non-bank lender that sourced funding from the capital markets rather than carrying the debt on their balance sheet, this is the same business model that was used by Countrywide, The Money Store, GMAC, and a host of others. It does work and is profitable in a strong economy, however, when they can no longer source money from the market and their borrowers start to default in large numbers and no longer seek new debt their business turns upside down and they either go bankrupt, get bought out for pennies on the dollar, or get bailed out by either the government or a larger corporate parent (GE). A move away from this business model could be the company de-risking themselves at what they view may be near the top of the market.

    Aviation lending and leasing has always been a high risk high margin business, a move away could again be further de-risking.

    Rather than dismantling the company they could be battening down the hatches.

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  21. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Motorsports-X View Post
    GE is hurting. and that Is odd. I cant understand why they got rid of their VERY profitable financial division. It seems like they are being systematically taken apart. Can anyone explain why?

    Im all for the little guy. But you need these big companies that can do R&D that is outside the reach of most people.


    Can anyone here explain what is going on over there and why this feels fishy? I mean, now they are talking about selling the aviation leasing department. WHICH IS ALSO PROFITABLE. what the heck?


    How many of your pensions have GE shares?
    .
    example is Eastman Kodak
    .
    over the years they sold off divisions or parts of company so whats sold was independent company or sold to another larger company. in general it was cause they needed the money by selling parts off.
    .
    as core company got smaller and smaller they focused on the slowly diminishing photographic business which everybody knew has a limited life being replaced with digital cameras found in cell phones and tablets
    .
    at the end the core business went bankrupt which basically is a legal way of not paying what is owed. since other businesses were sold off they could not be held responsible for debts of core companies debts.
    .
    core company stock was canceled. at one time it was $100 share at bankruptcy is was less than $1 and even that when cancelled was worthless. then bankruptcy judge lets them sell new stock.
    .
    bankruptcy if you ask me is just legal way of not paying 100% of what is owed. sold off companies are protected from debts of former parent company
    .
    by the way the core business became kodak alaris and is owned by former kodak england company to pay pension debts. the actual former eastman kodak technically does not produce photographic products any more. that is now called kodak alaris.
    .
    you have to be a lawyer to understand it all. its like husband putting everything in wifes name cause if he has business with debts and they sue him he has no money. its in his wifes name the former money. protecting assets from lawsuits. billionaires become experts in it. i dont claim to understand it all and i could be totally wrong. like i said you need good lawyers and accountants to understand it all
    .
    a good accountant makes it so a husband can leave his kids all his assets often tax free before he dies and still retain control of company. instead of government wanting the death tax and the kids at fathers death the kids owe government hugh amounts they cannot possibly pay without selling the family business. lawyers and accountants often the rich are rich cause they pay lawyers and accountants for legal ways to move money around protected from lawsuits and tax collectors

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  23. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Motorsports-X View Post
    GE is hurting. and that Is odd. I cant understand why they got rid of their VERY profitable financial division. It seems like they are being systematically taken apart. Can anyone explain why?

    Im all for the little guy. But you need these big companies that can do R&D that is outside the reach of most people.


    Can anyone here explain what is going on over there and why this feels fishy? I mean, now they are talking about selling the aviation leasing department. WHICH IS ALSO PROFITABLE. what the heck?


    How many of your pensions have GE shares?
    Coincidence? See my post #2986.

    Make America great again

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    worst thing you can do is have any large portion of pension in any one stock. my former company stock was $100 went down to $80 and people bought a lot saying it will go back up to $100 eventually.
    .
    stock was less than $1 when it was canceled decades later and canceled means worthless.
    .
    majority of peoples losses of retirement savings is they put too much in any one thing thats too good to be true. ponzi scheme is actually older than the name. it going by different names going back centuries.
    .
    like a irish farmer planting everything he has in potatoes and when potato blight happened millions starved. they were not diversified enough to afford the loss. and potatoes cannot easily be stored for many years like grains like wheat or corn and potatoes were not even native to Ireland. loss of income longer it is kept without reinvestment is same as money devaluation. in some countries money $1 is worth 2% less every year in other countries it is 20% worth less every year.
    .
    money devaluation goes back centuries to when gold and silver coins were made with metal less valued mixed in (not pure) or coins made smaller and no longer a pound being a pound or ounce coin no longer a ounce.
    .
    1-2% inflation at such low level people are not complaining so much as to be rioting in the streets so to speak. but in reality savings if not reinvested are being taken or devalued every year. better than keeping potatoes which go bad yearly or grain which tends to be not as good after 2 to 10 years
    .
    big company breaking up is protecting the assets as long as possible like squirrels hiding nuts and so nobody else can find the nuts but the squirrel who hid them (hide the assets by moving to separate storage locations)

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    often the real difference in the rich and poor is the rich are better at math and compound interest and using laws and accounting rules and regulations to there best advantage.
    .
    and rich often have the patience to wait when the math says its best to wait.
    .
    ponzi scheme is basically a con getting people to bet on a stock for the big winnings. like the lottery majority of people loose money on the lottery and yet millions and billions are spent on lotteries every year. same people often put little or nothing into retirement accounts
    .
    breaking up big company is really protecting the assets by separating them. separate companies are protected from bankruptcy debts

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  27. #38
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    Alstom Energy Acquisition

  28. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeE. View Post
    Is the locomotive mfg. division another thing they're selling off?

    I run them a lot, and I like their locos...

    Must not be any money left in there, either.
    GE is the number one locomotive builder over Caterpillar's Progress Rail's division now called Electro-Motive Diesel.

    GE did move their US locomotive manufacturing from Erie, PA to Texas a few years ago...just recently Erie has shut down completely. Why? Unions I'm sure played a part.

    EMD hasn't sold a new diesel locomotive in the United States in almost 3 years. Why? Their original 2-cycle diesel motor (a proven design for decades) could not meet Tier-4 emissions requirements, and they have been desperately trying to prove out a new 4-cycle engine.

    EMD has survived the last 3 years by selling new locomotives outside the US, and by rebuilding older locomotives -- which are not required to meet the Tier-4 standard. It's a good thing for EMD that Caterpillar has a longer-term view about marginal divisions than General Electric does.

    Funny how a "well-intending" government regulation has nearly put one of the only two locomotive manufacturers in America out of business.

    The railroads obviously do not want that, as GE could then really put the screws to them.

    ToolCat
    Last edited by cnctoolcat; 11-20-2017 at 04:16 PM.

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    Ok, GE quits the loco business and EMD can't meet emissions. Who overseas wants to take control of the nation's railroads? China? They are rapidly upgrading their system from coal fired locos.

    Tom

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