What's new
What's new

Parker question for Bill, Reliance small frame motor

bll230

Hot Rolled
Joined
Jun 14, 2007
Location
Las Vegas
Bill, I am pondering the installation of my Parker. Since there is no way to reverse the armature without reversing the series field, what are your thoughts on the series field? If one makes the assumption that the only reverse operation will be for threading, which is low RPM, and might be 5 times a year, would it work to wire in the series field with the armature, and then when the lathe is operated in reverse the series coil will be working against the field coil, but forward will be operating at optimum as designed.

Or, if having the series coil operating against the field coil is no good, how about a relay to take the series coil out of the circuit only when operating in reverse.

Or just not use the series coil?
 
Bill, I am pondering the installation of my Parker. Since there is no way to reverse the armature without reversing the series field, what are your thoughts on the series field? If one makes the assumption that the only reverse operation will be for threading, which is low RPM, and might be 5 times a year, would it work to wire in the series field with the armature, and then when the lathe is operated in reverse the series coil will be working against the field coil, but forward will be operating at optimum as designed.

Or, if having the series coil operating against the field coil is no good, how about a relay to take the series coil out of the circuit only when operating in reverse.

Or just not use the series coil?

Remind me which motor, how many leads, how marked? Is nameplate photo already in a PM thread?

If it is the same as my 3 HP small-frame, all three will work. The op you cite probably won't even load it enough to call for compensation. WiaD & Modular have to "care'. SSD has enough flexibility to over-ride it or do without it, doesn't care as much.

If one brings the leads out to a more convenient box, it would not be hard to change, later, so I'd either leave it out of the circuit ELSE wire it preferring FWD, go on about my business unless it became problematic.
 
Another Bill here.

If you really need the series field, I put them on the DC side of a suitable bridge rectifier. Connect the AC side in series with your armature. The amp rating needs to be well above the full load current of the motor.

As thermite Bill indicates that you probably don't need to use the series field anyway.

Bill
 
Another Bill here.

If you really need the series field, I put them on the DC side of a suitable bridge rectifier. Connect the AC side in series with your armature. The amp rating needs to be well above the full load current of the motor.

As thermite Bill indicates that you probably don't need to use the series field anyway.

Bill

I'd probably want to find a way to utilize it on a "1Q", AKA first quadrant, contactor reversing AND NOT not Thyristor reversing drive.

The WiaD and Modular, as well as a Eurotherm/Parker-SSD 512C series or a Beel/BICL D510 are all 1Q, contactor reversing. They just do not "do" over-run management nor regeneration, so:

A) They are more in need of compensating/compounding assistance.

AND

B) They can work with sync'ed contacts to reverse the S1, S2 connections, just as other contacts reverse A1, A2. The drives are blind and indifferent to what the contactors & relays have been asked to do, but they do exist.

For 4Q, drives, there ARE NO contactors or relays. Analog or Digital Logic switches the SCR's dynamically to change direction or brake. Even zero-point control is an active process.

The 4Q, four quadrant, fully regenerative drive, such as the 514C-16/32, the drive can be sort of tap-dancing between FWD, idle, REV very rapidly to manage ramp up/down, braking, over-run (NOT) on coast, changes in load, and enforcing "zero speed".

Kinda neat, BTW, that a single knob does FWD & @ RPM, OFF/BRAKE/CREEP, REV & @ RPM, and why I wanted mine on the carriage, not the HS.

The electromagnetic effect, nor the "inertia" of the supplemental coil on S1,S2 is not "externally managed", dynamically, as the 4Q drive is. It won't have the same effect at all times or under all circumstances, nor the same level of interaction with the more dynamic drive.

Ergo it is probably best to leave electromagnetic compensation out of the game in the interest of better stability, all RPM & loadings.

There'd be less risk of conflict / reinforcement and resonances, EVEN IF.. it might be helpful under SOME RPM & loadings.

That isn't so much a FWD/REV issue, after all.

It IS akin to not wanting more than one entity flying an aircraft, each blind to the other's capability or intentions in the moment, not communicating, ergo sometimes opposing, sometimes aiding, other times indifferent, and always "If don't know I'm not the only player, I am UNABLE to cooperate except by accident".

That cooperation would have to be designed-in, and we aren't in the right place or time to do that with the "stock" 1-P only drive we have.

OTHER DC Drives, 3-Phase input ONLY?

Lots of goodies in their ar$enal$, 24-pulse included.

Just bring money. And utility-mains-grade 3-P, of course!

:)

2CW

BTW: MY 3 HP Reliance small frame utilized a tachogenerator. The SSD drive can handle that. Field weakening, OTOH, neither Mark nor I have yet had need, nor time to research and sort beyond Shackleton having had a Field Regulator that mated to the prior generation of DC Drives to the 514C.

Absent that cooperative Field Regulator, using the tach simply denies field weakening RPM boost by dropping Armature power to offset it!!! Catch 22.....
 
I haven't done it with these drives but I have looked into reversing other DC motors that way. Performance with the series windings reversed was poor. When I put DC motors on my South Bend and Sheldon, I brought separate leads out of the motors. It isn't that hard to do.

Bill
 
I brought separate leads out of the motors. It isn't that hard to do.

Agree that. Only two extra wires. Six instead of four, and not that long of a run.

Cazeneuve even did something nice on 3-Phase. Brought the motor winding leads clear to the electrical cabinet so 220/440 reconnection was easier on DIN-railed terminal blocks.

Surely beats digging "Marrettes" crammed into an on-motor peckerhead it didn't have space for anyway.
 
Thanks all. As Rochester Bill mentioned. I had thought of using the rectifier inside the 514C for the field output, and running the armature output through the field output for the S1/S2. The Parker manual states the field output is .9 field input due to diode losses, I figured that was close enough. However, the other Bill's explanation makes sense as well. I think for the initial wire up I will not use the S1/S2, hopefully everything will run so well that I won't have anything inclination to change.

Update on the spindle and bearings. I ordered new Timken bearings form General Bearing in LA and sent my spindle to Monarch to regrind the nose. Will put up new post on those soon.
 








 
Back
Top