Why is the 10EE so lusted after / revered?

morganfield52 · Jan 31, 2015

What's so great about these lathes?

Mebfab · Jan 31, 2015

smooth feel, tough, wide selection of threads, wide selection of feeds, sort of compact. Art deco styling.

Hickory · Jan 31, 2015

very rigid and accurate, designed to last a lifetime with proper maintenance.

bhigdog · Jan 31, 2015

This will probably be seen as heresy but when I was an aspiring tool maker, and this goes back to 1960's, We had a tool room full of BP's, K&T's, assorted engine lathes, new Hardinges, B&S grinders etc etc etc and one 10EE. The 10EE was used only if nothing else was open. No one particularly liked it, including me. Sorry about that..............Bob

matt_isserstedt · Jan 31, 2015

To add:

Some very nice features that aren't necessarily exclusive to EE (but are to Monarch), flat belt drive to power feed to eliminate geared harmonics to the spindle, internal carriage oiling, relatively powerful drive from 0-(2500 to 4000 rpms) with the twist of a knob. Helical gears when using leadscrew which are relatively quiet. The ergonomics of the controls are par-none if you ask me: big handwheels for fine feeding, ball-ended handles are easy to find and operate.

Everything is done with an extra measure of quality and heft, in terms of design and construction. The experience of operating one is always time well spent.

bhigdog · Jan 31, 2015

thermite said:
That's righteous.

Now - tell us where we can find that selfsame low-mileage, low-abuse 10EE today and perhaps make a new minder happier next month than you were then..

Bill

Just hop into your local time machine, set to 1965, Union Blvd, Allentown, PA, Western Electric tool room. It would be the end lathe in the first row. The one with the strange blue glow..............Bob

oldster · Jan 31, 2015

I, like thermite, acquired my Monarch after a lifetime of alternate, adequate. but not inspiring equipment. I felt that I could afford the best, got the square dial '54 MG, and look forward to firing up the lathe when I am doing a part for R&D. Accuracy is beyond my abilities, and it gives me a sense of pleasure and accomplishment every time I run it. To know that when I set the DRO for .0001, I know that the lathe can do it.

Lee (the saw guy)

amdinc · Jan 31, 2015

I picked up a Rivett 1020S a month or two ago and have not yet had the time to put power to it. From the sales advertising they rate it better than the Monarch by comparison of specs. I have never ran either of theise lathes and wonder which one is actually the better lathe.

John

amdinc · Feb 1, 2015

thermite said:
The 10XX Rivett and the Hendey T&G are close competitors to a 10EE, welcomed for many years by "Monarchists" as brothers-in-arms when a restoration project needs to fit into a forum and has none of its own.

Thereafter, it is probably down to 'condition, condition, condition'.

Either of those can pose a greater challenge to sort out if not in top condition as acquired, though.

Drives were no less complex than a 10EE, arguably more so on most counts.

Parts are essentially unobtanium for the Rivett, mostly a dedicated one-man show with more drawings than metal for the Hendey.

All three are gems well worth preserving.

Bill

I picked this one up at an auction a couple of months ago. I never was really interested in it but pput a low bid of 700 on iy. I didn't get the bid but when I went to pick up some other stuff they asked me if I still wanted the lathe for my bid price. The other bidder had reneged on his payment. It has aa collet closer as well as a taper attachment but no collets. I lucked out a second time in that I had a box of collets in the back warehouse that were 6H which I read were the same as the 6R other than a slight difference in the length.

John

traditional-tools · Feb 1, 2015

amdinc said:
I lucked out a second time in that I had a box of collets in the back warehouse that were 6H which I read were the same as the 6R other than a slight difference in the length.

The 6H will work in the Rivett, I have one that I have used in mine, but have a lot of 6R collets. I have almost a full set plus another 20. Good luck on your project, it needs a bit of TLC by the looks of it, hopefully nothing is broken and everything is working. Post more pics when you get a chance.

The real Leigh · Feb 1, 2015

amdinc said:
I picked up a Rivett 1020S
From the sales advertising they rate it better than the Monarch by comparison of specs.
I have never ran either of theise lathes and wonder which one is actually the better lathe.

How many 10EE lathes are still in commercial use, and in hobby / small shop use every day?

How many Rivett 1020S lathes " ?

I've used, rebuilt, and discussed myriad 10EE lathes.
Never even heard of a Rivett 1020S.

That should answer your question.

I certainly don't claim there's anything wrong with the 1020S.
But since I've never encountered one, they were not nearly as popular as the 10EE.

- Leigh

The real Leigh · Feb 1, 2015

thermite said:
...never HEARD of a Rivett 10XX? Been on PM where they vacation in the MONARCH forum, and for HOW long now?

Hi Bill,

I said I'd never heard of a Rivett 1020S. Of course I've heard mention of Rivett lathes in general.

But I was speaking from a professional point of view.
I worked with a commercial machine rebuilder for a couple of decades.

We did a number of 10EE lathes over that period, but not even one Rivett.

My comment was based solely on the installed population of the machines, nothing else.

- Leigh

traditional-tools · Feb 1, 2015

The real Leigh said:
We did a number of 10EE lathes over that period, but not even one Rivett.

There was only about 500 of them made over the course of 20 - 25 years, There were very few of them sold to the private sector, the Government basically had standing orders on the Rivett 10XX, so that is one reason you didn't see a lot of them in the rebuilding sector. In 60s Rivett was bought by Leland-Gifford and they sold some lathes to the private sector, but not a lot of them and finally they closed it all down sometime in the mid to late 60s. The U.K. site has about the best information on the actulal machine.

For whatever reason, there seemed to be a number of them on the west coast.

You must not follow the Monarch forum, they do come up regularly and there are a number of owners on PM. AFAIK, this is one of the only places Rivett 10XX lates are discussed.

Cheers,
Alan

elninio · Feb 1, 2015

because of autism, same with hardinge and other expensive tools.

they like to call it "smooth" like its whiskey or something

The real Leigh · Feb 1, 2015

traditional-tools said:
You must not follow the Monarch forum, they do come up regularly and there are a number of owners on PM. AFAIK, this is one of the only places Rivett 10XX lates are discussed.

Hi Alan,

Thanks for the info. I didn't realize the population was that small.

Yes, I do follow the Monarch forum since I own a 10EE, and I have seen Rivetts discussed there, but I don't follow those threads.

Taking Bill's number of 137 threads out of 5,333 on the Monarch forum makes them only about 2.5% of the thread volume.

My comment about not seeing them was in the field, specifically in the machine rebuilding discipline.

Thanks again.

- Leigh

The real Leigh · Feb 1, 2015

thermite said:
After 20 years with a machine-tool rebuilder and fifty years a practicing Electrical Engineer, you've been in the workforce longer than I've been alive.

Oh... So now you claim to be alive ??? I never would have guessed. :eek:

I said I worked WITH Keith, not FOR him. I was not an employee of his business at any time.

He was my best friend, going many years. He had a thriving business and excellent mechanical skills, but was short on technical training.

Being an engineer with a machinist background, I was in a position to help him in many of his tasks.
I was usually there on the weekends, and occasionally in the evening.

Just doing what I could to help a friend. I learned a lot from him in return.

- Leigh

Marty Comstock · Feb 1, 2015

I never knew what a 10EE was until I saw one in the local trader paper for 1500 and bought it for 1300, hauling it home in my 1/2 ton pickup.

Joined here and WOW what great information.

Same with other makes and models, Take the Hardinge HLV for example. Tool room had 6 of them! a wonderful, wildly simple machine compared to my 10 EE, but I got used to them. Still dont seem to see many people picking these up as cheap as a Monarch. Dont know why, perhaps tool dealers or folk who frequent auctions can offer an opinion.

I wish my carriage had a motor like an HLV, though. Otherwise, my 10EE fits my shop perfectly. Small, easy to power, accurate, solid, and Just plain looks cool in our shop full of other old tools.

trevj · Feb 1, 2015

traditional-tools said:
There was only about 500 of them made over the course of 20 - 25 years, There were very few of them sold to the private sector, the Government basically had standing orders on the Rivett 10XX, so that is one reason you didn't see a lot of them in the rebuilding sector. In 60s Rivett was bought by Leland-Gifford and they sold some lathes to the private sector, but not a lot of them and finally they closed it all down sometime in the mid to late 60s. The U.K. site has about the best information on the actulal machine.

For whatever reason, there seemed to be a number of them on the west coast.

You must not follow the Monarch forum, they do come up regularly and there are a number of owners on PM. AFAIK, this is one of the only places Rivett 10XX lates are discussed.

Cheers,
Alan

Any idea where they were sticking them? Just curious. R&D Labs? Military? Nuke?

At one time there was a forward thinking element in various Government Departments that actually looked at critical capabilities and took pains to ensure that they survived so they would be available to use if needed. I would think that having more than just one maker of decent quality machine tools would fit that thinking. Just wondering if that was why thy were buying them or not.

The pictures I see of the Rivett and Monarch innards, put them into the category of mechanical art, esp. compared to the paltry look of my Colchester et al.

Cheers
Trev

9100 · Feb 1, 2015

It depends on the exact usage. I know two toolmakers, one of whom had worked mostly on a 10EE when they were new, who chose HVLHs when they got their next lathe. Both really know their business and made the decision based on the type and size of work, not quality, since both lathes are excellent.

Actually, I was a bit disappointed with my 10EE. The post the compound pivots on was a loose fit, so I made one that was snug. With it installed, the compound would not sit flat on the cross slide. Turned out that the hole in the compound was bored crooked and someone just cut the pin down to make it work, sort of. I bored the compound straight and made a stepped pin to fit. A few other things are a bit rough, reminding me that it was a fairly large production machine and workers did not spend as much time fitting and finishing as they might have.

Bill

morganfield52 · Feb 1, 2015

Well thanks for the input gents.

It's nice to see some of the views posed here. I work right next to our old (prewar) machine shop and it has a 10EE that doesn't get much use....but I get a kick out of walking out with a cup of coffee and staring at it. I hope to one day catch the machinists there actually using it.

Why is the 10EE so lusted after / revered?

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