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Graziano Sag 14 apron oil seals

Charles Dolan

Hot Rolled
Joined
Apr 28, 2006
Location
Montreal Canada
Having now completed the renovation of my Sag 14 I am now running the machine.
I really should just say “enough dismantling to get it into my basement and very careful cleaning and painting” rather than renovation.
My question relates to the amount of oil leakage I should tolerate from the feed shaft worm seals.
As you may remember this lathe was originally fitted with an hydraulic copying drive through the feed shaft and cross slide and clearly this has provided 99% of the carriage driving power throughout the machines former life (the gear box is virtually band new showing no wear or even tooth contact and the halfnuts and lead screw are the same). Because of all this use the feed shaft coupling to the hydraulic motor had loosened and was allowing the shaft to run eccentrically. The spherical ball bearing was still in excellent shape so I made up a new coupling and this has brought the running of the shaft into acceptable limits.
However before fitting the new coupling there was a serious leak of oil from the feedshaft seals, particularly so at the higher speeds. With the new coupling this is reduced by 80% but is still there at speed. At lower revs the oil coming out of the apron seems about normal i.e. A few drops after half an hours feeding. This is certainly within my “comfort zone, but at the higher speed I would like to see less oil in the pan.
As changing the seals is quite a performance I am looking for reassurance that these always leak to some extent and that I am not going to regret leaving them as they are, at least for the time being.
Once more I would like to say how much I appreciate the help that I have received from you all since joining this Forum I have been fooling around with machine tools most of my life and have previously muddled through with the inevitable problems a “new machine” has, but access to this global race memory is just magic.

Charles.
 
I used to have a little plastic tub suspended on wire loops below the saddle to catch the oil leaking out of my SAG180. Replacing the seals stopped all oil leaks and after selling it 4 years ago, the new owner still hasn't had any problems. Because it was 7 years ago that I replaced them, I don't remember the whole process, but I do remember it wasn't too much of a job.
 
Charles, you are procrasinating about the bush I reckon. You are not going to be happy unless that oil leak stops! :D :D

If it helps, after the 'newness' wears off, you might be able to put up with those little drips.


If you came and operated the Sag 14 at work, you might get some of that "care" rubbed off, it leaks oil in various places and no one really cares. Shabby Sag 14 of the year award. The headstock spindle dribbles a little at the chuck end, but the thought of letting anyone loose on that doesn't appeal to me.
 
Peter,

You are probably right about me being a little too fastidious but I would prefer not have an oil leak at all if it is avoidable and if not I would like to settle for the minimum I can get away with. It now seems to have settled down to even less than when I first fitted the new coupling, perhaps the seal lips have regained more of their "elastic memory" now they are not being streched out of shape at every revolution, and I have resolved to put up with it untill I have nothing better to do in the future.
Charles.
 
Nick,
We have dificulty here in Canada with small quantities of specific oils, a tanker load and you are all set but a gallon or two is really dificult to get. I have settled on straight 50 weight gear oil for my sag 14 but I am convinced that straight 40 would be just as good. By 'straight' I mean not multigrade and no automotive aditives. Provided the grade is appropriate I doubt there is any significant difference between reputable brands.

Charles.
 
Well I gave up and bought new seals. The job was not too dificult, a little awkward lying on my back for an hour or so but eventually worth the trouble, the apron is now tighter than a Scotsman's wallet not a drop of oil to be seen.

Thanks for the help.

Charles.
 
Charles,

Good to hear you got the job done! I am curious - were the seals a standard part, or did you have to get a Graziano part - if so, where?

Nick,

Not sure about the Tellus 22, it is probably not correct.

I asked Shell about this, they say they still make Tellus 32 (use instead of Teresso 43 in the Sag 12 transmission) and Tellus 46 (in place of Teresso 47).
 
Peter,

The seals are a standard metric single lip seal. The number is on the outside face of the cup, I don't have the old one by me so I will try to remember; 60 42 10? I think this is right it is the OD, ID, and width in milimeters. they are about $5.00 each. Virtually all such components and bearings etc. are standard parts and even with no serial/part number to be seen if you can measure them any good bearing service can source them for you. Don't expect the local bike shop to have a set of Gammet spindle bearings on the shelf but pretty much everything else should be availible in any biggish town.
Lubricating stocks are all the same as far as performance goes, the numbers relate to the viscosity primarilly, there used to be issues with seal compatibillity that caused the makers to specify one makers product. Howevert the polymers used in seals for the last 40 years are pretty well universally immume to all oils. I will eat my hat if any one can tell me that they have suffered problems as the result of using the equivallent grade of another brand of oil in a machine tool.

Charles.
 








 
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