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  1. #1
    Jim Shaper's Avatar
    Jim Shaper is offline Stainless
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    Default Voest Lathe owners/users opinion thread

    I know there's a couple more of you out there than Forrest (my wife hates you btw - cause I stay up too late reading your threads and not coming to bed now that searching works), so I thought I'd put this up to see who else has input and what not.

    Forrest, you seem to think your lathe is not really all that heavy duty. I have some questions as to why you say that:

    My DA210 (1500mm between centers, made in 1974) is among the sturdiest tool room lathes I have seen with such a small footprint for the bed size. @2900lbs according to the manual, I'm thinking I'm justified in that opinion. The ribbing in the bed is mammoth. Maybe your's is lighter? Maybe you just think of bigger machines when comparing it?

    As for over-driving it: I know you run a vfd into a ten hp motor. I actually have the 7.5hp factory upgraded motor (and D6 spindle), but I wonder about the 2000rpm option? I have some aluminum projects that would be nice to spin up a bit faster. Any ideas?

    I'm also interested in how many of these machines are out there?

    Mine came from the tool room of a plastics manufacturer who bought it new. One of the set screws on the spindle was backing itself out (back gear) and left some shavings in the head stock. I imagine they freaked and sold it thinking the bearings were shot, but I saw the screw head and how it was getting chewed by the gear below it and realized what all the mess was. There was no oil in it when I purchased it and it wasn't under power, but I had a 2 week satisfaction guarantee from the seller (a dealer down the street from the owner), so I figured I could check it out with little risk at home. So I replaced the ill fated screw and filled it up with lube and it works great. You can barely feel the wear on the ways. The only indication of any wear is on the inside edge of the front triangle rib. Not enough to catch a nail on, but it's not perfectly smooth like the rest of the ways.

    Since I haven't had it all that long, and only had it under power with an undersized idler on the phase converter, I don't really have much to say about my experience with the machine, but I'm sure there are others out there with wisdom and insights which could benefit us all. So I'd love to hear them.

  2. #2
    Charles Dolan is offline Hot Rolled
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    Jim we have two Voests here in the lab and both have been used extensively. they are very rigid and powerful lathes and will easily strip a half inch off the diameter of a 6" hot rolled bar without a murmur. My one criticism is the arrangement of the feed change lever on the apron, I find it awkward and counterintuitive in the way it changes from cross to sliding feed. apart from that I would rate them at the top of the league for a middle weight machine.

    Perhaps Forrest's opinions have more to do with his experiences with some of those legendary American monster lathes such as the Pacemakers or Monarchs and Leblonds which are supposedly an order of magnitude stiffer and stronger than any others.

    Charles.

  3. #3
    Jim Shaper's Avatar
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    That's pretty much what I was thinking having read several of his posts on the unit.

    Is a leblond really that much stronger? Regal or other model?

    Do you have pics of the machines? I'm curious to see what others look like.

    I'll get some good ones of mine once I get the OSB out of the way. I'm still in the process of building my shop and sheetrock has just begun.

  4. #4
    R.Nark is offline Plastic
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    Smile

    Hello Jim,
    Glad to hear of your good fortune in obtaining your lathe.I have an old Voest of unknown age. The machine seems to be built very well. And as you said in your post it has a small foot print compared to other lathes in that size range. Obtained the lathe a few months back and have been cleaning and repairing items as required .If you have any idea of the model number on mine I would be interested. The pictures show the tear down and rebuild in progress. Next major task will be the Quick Change Gear Box inspection and clean. Trying to get internal diagrams of what is inside.
    Also wanting to find out if it would be a good idea to use a air needle scaler on the lathe bed casting to get the old paint and Bondo off ?....After chipping would sand it fairly smooth for paint.

    this is the google sit with the latest pictures

    http://picasaweb.google.com/rnarks/VoestLathe

    this is the flickr.com site that has the older pictures 2 months ago

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/1203565...7601907416190/

    will post more pictures as the project moves along.

    RNARK@YAHOO.COM

  5. #5
    Jim Shaper's Avatar
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    I don't have any idea the model of yours. Mine's a `74 and looks much more like machines of that era, but the bones of your machine are very similar to mine. I could post up some parts of the manual where they show the parts list if that would help?

    These are the only pics of mine I have right now.





  6. #6
    R.Nark is offline Plastic
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    Hello Jim,
    Looks like you have the starts of a new shop area. You may want to get a spray guard for the back of the lathe so that you do not get lines on your new drywall boards.....
    On the offer of a scan or picture of the quick change gear box parts illustration, it would be very welcome. any help in the way of a look inside before I start dismantling the case is good..

    On your lathe you said that a set screw was backing out and was wearing against a gear. when I took the spindle out for the clean up, I noticed that the allen screws that hold the large key for the back gear , on the spindle were not very snug...When I went back together I took and used lock tight on them and the key , in the hopes that they would not migrate out.because they do not have much metal to hold onto ....On the back gear detent ball set screw I used a small punch mark to lock the set screw in. picture below.

    http://picasaweb.google.com/rnarks/V...94330562206050

    are ether of these problems what you had found on your lathe ?....
    thank you and keep warm up there , we have 72deg F in the day ,good for painting

    R.Nark

  7. #7
    Jim Shaper's Avatar
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    Actually, I have my new 24x35' shop rapidly approaching completion.

    Just got the ceiling done yesterday and finished blowing the insulation. Friday was the first time I had heat out there as I had difficulty finding an outfit to tap into my gas main for that line. Went from 7F to 45 in about 3 hours with no ceiling. Prior to installing any sheetrock I was running my 75K heater full time at the tune of a dollar an hour. Right now it's down to running 6hrs a day and there's still escape paths into the attic and the breezeway into the attached garage is wide open and also not sealed up from the outside all that well. It's still missing a window above it, which is only being covered at present. I'll have to melt some snow when I put that in. I still need to finish the frame first.

    Speaking of paint - I have a 10x15 paint booth I've built into the shop. I have inlet air along the inside wall via some filters, and then a plenum above the ceiling (paint booth ceiling is 9' where as the shop is 11') along the back wall drawing air out via a 5spd furnace blower.

    I used loctite as well, but it wasn't that screw that came loose.

    A splash guard is definitely on the to-do list. I'm not sure exactly what I'm doing above the lathe yet though. I have to see where my crane supports end up and how far off the wall the i beam ends up above the machine. There will be some form of jib crane serving the lathe, but I haven't gotten that far into it yet. I've been focused on getting the structure completed first. After all, I've had helpers for a couple days on some tasks, but for the most part I have built the shop myself.

    I'll scan those pages when I get a chance.

  8. #8
    R.Nark is offline Plastic
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    Smile Voest IPC image

    Hello Jim,....Forrest made some copies of the gear box internals and was kind enough to send them to me. will post more pictures as I go along with this project on the Google picture site

  9. #9
    Jim Shaper's Avatar
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    I hadn't forgotten about you. The wife's been busy on her comp doing christmas cards so I haven't had the chance to sneak in there and use the scanner.

    Let me know if you still want me to scan the diagrams.

  10. #10
    R.Nark is offline Plastic
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    Thumbs up

    Hello Jim,
    there is no pressing need at the moment, but if you can, any pictures from the ipc would be welcome.Forrest provided pages 19 through 26 (quick change gear box)....figure 9 and the lathe spec. sheet, plus the cover page...as I said earlier will take better pictures as I open these components and post them to the google site
    thanks
    R.Nark

  11. #11
    Jim Shaper's Avatar
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    Bump for Forrest.

  12. #12
    Forrest Addy is online now Diamond
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    I don't know how I missed this thread. Old timer's disease I guess. You all are correct. Voest, Casanueve, Cadillac, etc lathes are built on the "European plan" (as I call it to myself). They are dandy compact toolroom lathes and if powered up to their safe potential will take cuts that make for rapid stock reductions. Worked to capacity they will satisfy any small shop's lathe requirements except for heavy stock reduction and longevity should those qualities be paramount. These machine are lightly built compared to the heavy production lathes produced in the '60's and '70's.

    Are these lighter lathes on par with Axleson, Lodge & Shipley Turnmaster, American Pacemaker, Sidney, Mori Seiki, Okuma, some sturdy and very well built Commumist bloc lathes, the non-Regal Monarchs, etc. No. Are these machines capable of 20 or more spindle HP, do they have fully hardened bed and saddle ways, oversized spindles, large quills, etc; no. Heavy production lathes are beefy powerful lathes - production machines intended for 8 and 16/5 work weeks and have a 50,000 life.

    It was my intent to put lighter machines into perspective with their heavy duty cousins. A Voest 210 and comparable lathes are not heavy duty machine tools although they are often found on the used market after a long career of heavy use. They are built more as a toolroom lathe - that is one having many convenience features and a long list of options at a somewhat lower cost. Being limited use machine tools they are not as rich in durability features as heavy production lathes.

    That said, on my Voest 210 engine lathe, I can make about 12 pounds of chips per minute in hot rolled steel barstock using Kyrocera tooling. But I'm pushing it. I have to be careful which gear I use when I load the spindle transmission to that power level.

    So don't get offended if I suggest your particular machine doesn't make the cut as a heavy production lathe. That's a tough role to fill and such a machine might weigh twice as much and have four times the power of a toolroom lathe of equivalent work envelope - and cost more too.

    Here's an example of a toolroom lathe compared to a heavy production lathe. I was "volunteered" to do a job for the local yacht club of machining 16 cast manganese steel double flanged rail wheels for their marine railway. Full of confidence I chucked one up in my then (1971) brand new Voest. I butchered and cut at it but that tough manganese steel pushed away the stoutest carbide tooling I could borrow from work. I busted a lot of tools and got two wheels done in about 6 hours of machine time. My new lathe was defeated by the third job I put to it.

    I took the wheels to Tacoma where a friend of mine had a somewhat tired #4 Gisholt chucker that never the less had triple the power and regidity of my proud beauty. What a difference. Once I got the tooling set I could knock out a wheel in about 40 minutes. The chips were stringy and hard to break but the rigidity of the machine was such that I could bury the tool witout stalling the machine or having the tool push away as the edge wore. I didn't have time to finish them that Saturday but my buddy ran them off the next Monday at his shop rate.

  13. #13
    peteburgin is offline Plastic
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    Default Jim Shaper

    [I seem to have a twin to your machine and I love it. Only problem is I do not have a manual and have yet to figure out how to disengage carriate nut to use taper attachment. If you can help me I would be very thankfull.QUOTE=Jim Shaper;777157]I know there's a couple more of you out there than Forrest (my wife hates you btw - cause I stay up too late reading your threads and not coming to bed now that searching works), so I thought I'd put this up to see who else has input and what not.

    Forrest, you seem to think your lathe is not really all that heavy duty. I have some questions as to why you say that:

    My DA210 (1500mm between centers, made in 1974) is among the sturdiest tool room lathes I have seen with such a small footprint for the bed size. @2900lbs according to the manual, I'm thinking I'm justified in that opinion. The ribbing in the bed is mammoth. Maybe your's is lighter? Maybe you just think of bigger machines when comparing it?

    As for over-driving it: I know you run a vfd into a ten hp motor. I actually have the 7.5hp factory upgraded motor (and D6 spindle), but I wonder about the 2000rpm option? I have some aluminum projects that would be nice to spin up a bit faster. Any ideas?

    I'm also interested in how many of these machines are out there?

    Mine came from the tool room of a plastics manufacturer who bought it new. One of the set screws on the spindle was backing itself out (back gear) and left some shavings in the head stock. I imagine they freaked and sold it thinking the bearings were shot, but I saw the screw head and how it was getting chewed by the gear below it and realized what all the mess was. There was no oil in it when I purchased it and it wasn't under power, but I had a 2 week satisfaction guarantee from the seller (a dealer down the street from the owner), so I figured I could check it out with little risk at home. So I replaced the ill fated screw and filled it up with lube and it works great. You can barely feel the wear on the ways. The only indication of any wear is on the inside edge of the front triangle rib. Not enough to catch a nail on, but it's not perfectly smooth like the rest of the ways.

    Since I haven't had it all that long, and only had it under power with an undersized idler on the phase converter, I don't really have much to say about my experience with the machine, but I'm sure there are others out there with wisdom and insights which could benefit us all. So I'd love to hear them.[/QUOTE]

  14. #14
    peteburgin is offline Plastic
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    Default Jim Shaper

    [I seem to have a twin to your machine and I love it. Only problem is I do not have a manual and have yet to figure out how to disengage carriage cross feed nut to use taper attachment. If you can help me I would be very thankfull.

    QUOTE=Jim Shaper;777157]I know there's a couple more of you out there than Forrest (my wife hates you btw - cause I stay up too late reading your threads and not coming to bed now that searching works), so I thought I'd put this up to see who else has input and what not.

    Forrest, you seem to think your lathe is not really all that heavy duty. I have some questions as to why you say that:

    My DA210 (1500mm between centers, made in 1974) is among the sturdiest tool room lathes I have seen with such a small footprint for the bed size. @2900lbs according to the manual, I'm thinking I'm justified in that opinion. The ribbing in the bed is mammoth. Maybe your's is lighter? Maybe you just think of bigger machines when comparing it?

    As for over-driving it: I know you run a vfd into a ten hp motor. I actually have the 7.5hp factory upgraded motor (and D6 spindle), but I wonder about the 2000rpm option? I have some aluminum projects that would be nice to spin up a bit faster. Any ideas?

    I'm also interested in how many of these machines are out there?

    Mine came from the tool room of a plastics manufacturer who bought it new. One of the set screws on the spindle was backing itself out (back gear) and left some shavings in the head stock. I imagine they freaked and sold it thinking the bearings were shot, but I saw the screw head and how it was getting chewed by the gear below it and realized what all the mess was. There was no oil in it when I purchased it and it wasn't under power, but I had a 2 week satisfaction guarantee from the seller (a dealer down the street from the owner), so I figured I could check it out with little risk at home. So I replaced the ill fated screw and filled it up with lube and it works great. You can barely feel the wear on the ways. The only indication of any wear is on the inside edge of the front triangle rib. Not enough to catch a nail on, but it's not perfectly smooth like the rest of the ways.

    Since I haven't had it all that long, and only had it under power with an undersized idler on the phase converter, I don't really have much to say about my experience with the machine, but I'm sure there are others out there with wisdom and insights which could benefit us all. So I'd love to hear them.[/QUOTE]

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