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Having a real shit time getting started.

Joined
Aug 16, 2016
Location
St. Albert
As per the title, I'm failing at finding work for my own company. In the last couple months, I've only been able to get 4 jobs to quote. I won one of them worth a couple hundred bucks.

One they were trying to find a local manufacturer but they were comparing prices to Asia and I couldn't even get material and tooling for their delivered price. I worked super hard on that quote. I wrote programs and verified my actual machine time per piece. No markup on materials. And even at less per hour labour than I make at my say job.

One I was close to what they pay, and they said they would give me a chance when they actually order replacements, but that's gone cold. I've followed up and they haven't needed to replenish stock.

One I just haven't heard back.

I've sent 50 or more emails to oilfield companies around the province. Heard nothing.

I delivered more than 50 brochures in person, and that's where I got those three losing quotes from.

The quote I did win was from a friend who knew a guy. Basically he vouched for me. The parts are good. Good price. Good margins. Just no volume. I've called and tried to chat about how they worked out, if they want more, even to mention that next time they would be a little cheaper each.... left a message with receptionist and voicemail, still haven't heard back.


I tried setting up an MFG account but I'm not getting any parts in my inbox that would be a good fit.

I have a Maketime account to, but I can't get passed the new supplier orientation.


I have a TL-2 in my garage.
I've done almost everything to keep my overhead low.
I'm really limited but I thought I could find SOMETHING.

I still work full time and that pays for my bills, but not my machine payments.


Is there a Canadian MFG type website? I've tried going through oilfield service directories but again, I've totally stricken out. My dream would be making aerospace, defence, off road parts. How the heck can I get into those industries?

I'm a certified journeyman. Graduated top of my class. Great attention to detail. Aggressively priced. But I can't get people to take a chance and send my parts to quote.

I recently started working on making some of my own stuff to sell, like tobacco pipes and paraphernalia that I can make with a lathe. But I doubt I'll cover all the payment, working a few hours a night, between getting home and needing sleep.

Help?
 
As per the title, I'm failing at finding work for my own company. In the last couple months, I've only been able to get 4 jobs to quote. I won one of them worth a couple hundred bucks.

One they were trying to find a local manufacturer but they were comparing prices to Asia and I couldn't even get material and tooling for their delivered price. I worked super hard on that quote. I wrote programs and verified my actual machine time per piece. No markup on materials. And even at less per hour labour than I make at my say job.

One I was close to what they pay, and they said they would give me a chance when they actually order replacements, but that's gone cold. I've followed up and they haven't needed to replenish stock.

One I just haven't heard back.

I've sent 50 or more emails to oilfield companies around the province. Heard nothing.

I delivered more than 50 brochures in person, and that's where I got those three losing quotes from.

The quote I did win was from a friend who knew a guy. Basically he vouched for me. The parts are good. Good price. Good margins. Just no volume. I've called and tried to chat about how they worked out, if they want more, even to mention that next time they would be a little cheaper each.... left a message with receptionist and voicemail, still haven't heard back.


I tried setting up an MFG account but I'm not getting any parts in my inbox that would be a good fit.

I have a Maketime account to, but I can't get passed the new supplier orientation.


I have a TL-2 in my garage.
I've done almost everything to keep my overhead low.
I'm really limited but I thought I could find SOMETHING.

I still work full time and that pays for my bills, but not my machine payments.


Is there a Canadian MFG type website? I've tried going through oilfield service directories but again, I've totally stricken out. My dream would be making aerospace, defence, off road parts. How the heck can I get into those industries?

I'm a certified journeyman. Graduated top of my class. Great attention to detail. Aggressively priced. But I can't get people to take a chance and send my parts to quote.

I recently started working on making some of my own stuff to sell, like tobacco pipes and paraphernalia that I can make with a lathe. But I doubt I'll cover all the payment, working a few hours a night, between getting home and needing sleep.

Help?

To bad your not down the street from me, I need to find someone to do my overflow. BTW that post title will get this thread locked and deleted. Read the rules.
 
I have a TL-2 in my garage.

Under the circumstances, THAT is what you need most to 'sell'.

Can't expect to boil even a tiny part of an ocean you do not control - EG: the Alberta, Canada economy and the cost and hassle of transport to/from where you sit.

Cut your losses before they cut you.

Regroup, weight the downsides better next time. Or position yerself to move house and Day Job.
 
Too many shops,^^^ without viable working relationships in place ^^^ and too many of the same machines ^^^ fighting over the leftover table-scraps outside of smooth-running relationships ^^^.

.. or so I believe.

Pete Drucker, "The Practice of Management":

Nothing happens until somebody sells something.

Blame me for the emphasis.
 
As per the title, I'm failing at finding work for my own company. In the last couple months, I've only been able to get 4 jobs to quote. I won one of them worth a couple hundred bucks.

One they were trying to find a local manufacturer but they were comparing prices to Asia and I couldn't even get material and tooling for their delivered price. I worked super hard on that quote. I wrote programs and verified my actual machine time per piece. No markup on materials. And even at less per hour labour than I make at my say job.

One I was close to what they pay, and they said they would give me a chance when they actually order replacements, but that's gone cold. I've followed up and they haven't needed to replenish stock.

One I just haven't heard back.

I've sent 50 or more emails to oilfield companies around the province. Heard nothing.

I delivered more than 50 brochures in person, and that's where I got those three losing quotes from.

The quote I did win was from a friend who knew a guy. Basically he vouched for me. The parts are good. Good price. Good margins. Just no volume. I've called and tried to chat about how they worked out, if they want more, even to mention that next time they would be a little cheaper each.... left a message with receptionist and voicemail, still haven't heard back.


I tried setting up an MFG account but I'm not getting any parts in my inbox that would be a good fit.

I have a Maketime account to, but I can't get passed the new supplier orientation.


I have a TL-2 in my garage.
I've done almost everything to keep my overhead low.
I'm really limited but I thought I could find SOMETHING.

I still work full time and that pays for my bills, but not my machine payments.


Is there a Canadian MFG type website? I've tried going through oilfield service directories but again, I've totally stricken out. My dream would be making aerospace, defence, off road parts. How the heck can I get into those industries?

I'm a certified journeyman. Graduated top of my class. Great attention to detail. Aggressively priced. But I can't get people to take a chance and send my parts to quote.

I recently started working on making some of my own stuff to sell, like tobacco pipes and paraphernalia that I can make with a lathe. But I doubt I'll cover all the payment, working a few hours a night, between getting home and needing sleep.

Help?


Better learn to sharpen your sales skills. Sales is an art & practically a full time job. Goes way beyond handing out a bunch of brochures.
 
Have you tried advertising on Kijiji? I know its low end but it may get you a contact or two that will lead to something better.

Can you repair broken stuff? No one else wants to do that so maybe thats a place to start.


Location is pretty important in the manufacturing services business, the oil boom is over you would have better luck in Ontario.

Get a cheap Bridgeport clone so that you can do a greater range of work. Spend the next 10 years watching the used equipment market like a hawk so that you can put together a capable shop at a fraction of the cost of your competition. Make a big shop in your backyard so that your overhead is really low.

Read all of Huflungdung's posts, he makes a go of it in Saskatchewan.

My first year I made only $15 000, doing everything from designing automation to welding stair rails, it was a good thing I was living at my parents house.

Those are some pretty random thoughts.
 
Large companies are not going to want a one trick pony...you can turn parts from this size to this size, no keys, slots or hexs.

If I only had a single lathe, I'd be talking with shops that have overflow work.
Get out and see potential customers, ask for that bastard job nobody wants and nail it. Got my foot in the door several times going that route.

Brochures usually get file as your walking out the door unless...well I don't know as I haven't really found one I held on to, and the ones I gave out I have seen in same place they laid it last time I went out. Besides, what are you going to put in your brochure that will grab them...a bunch of turned parts, a facility list of "a machine". Most people want parts at a good price on time, quality today is just a given...what more can you offer? Pickup and Delivery, status reports, personal service...find something that sets YOU apart...aside from cheap.
-If they use you for cheap only,
--it won't be long before they want cheaper.
---it won't be long before someone comes in cheaper then you.
---
-run a job or two breaking even, bring up your price so you CAN make a buck and they cut you lose fro someone cheaper or about the same but will also offer milling and larger orders.


MFG.com and the like--

I tried them, lots of quotes and I mean LOTS of quotes 95% that I quoted were awarded at numbers I couldn't touch. Meaning material and a sawcut I was already over the awarded price. The other % was filled with drop what your doing and make these parts for next to nothing and the rest where not awarded.
I had hoped that even if I didn't gain too much work directly I might gain a lead, make a relationship...Only time I ever spoke to someone it was to get additional info on a lacking drawing which I think was intentional so they could get some ballpark pricing and pull quote for redesign. Never got a person interested in looking for a relationship...just dirt cheap pricing.
 
Classic. You need a partner, it can be dangerous alone. That’s what I lacked, the minister for foreign affairs. I was the home secretary, didn’t work.

Website, clear description of what you can do best, plus a little list of wanteds. E-Mails with good pictures

Singularity, something no-one does around, like lapping or bigger broaching. Those machines aren’t very expensive. I’m thinking of pipe joints and bore tooling.
 
.. or so I believe.

Pete Drucker, "The Practice of Management":

Nothing happens until somebody sells something.

Blame me for the emphasis.

agreed. Its easy to find guys who can make stuff.....the tough job is selling and bringing in the business. It doesn't help that you are in Alberta, but that doesn't mean its impossible. Even in a crappy market, someone is figuring out how to make money

I like that you've made an effort, but you need to do more. emails are anonymous. get 1/4 second attention and are easily forgotten. Personal visit and phone calls are better.....start calling everyone you've talked to, the message can be this simple "Hi, I've got a machine shop in town and would really like to do some work for you, have you got anything we can quote on" . Get their name and address send them a brochure and card and call them again in 4-8 weeks, "just keeping in touch - anything we can help you with".

You have to figure out ways to stay top of mind. They don't give a crap about you so if they didn't need a quote the moment you called, you are forgotten. The trick is be top of mind when they next do have something needed quoting.

Get a web web site up - when they look at your card or brochure they expect it. Without it you'll come across really small time.....you are small time but you don't to slap 'em in the face with it. Companies won't feel safe, so you have to puff out the chest a bit.

Finally its a numbers game. The more you call, they more leads, the more RFQs, the more customers.
 
Red

You will hear the same thing over and over from us guys who have done the drill. You need to go out and beat the pavement to get started and it only takes one good hit. But here is the best advise for now. Don't quit, don't get discouraged. You are only one yes away from a job and a customer. Stop in at every place, forget the receptionist walk in the back at shipping and receiving and pretend you are lost looking for another place in the area (I did this all the time)ask the guy what they do, if they have a machine shop in the building...If they do ask for the guys name who runs it, ask if you could meet him, anything name number Just ask. If they don't have a shop ask if they send out work and get a name.

Go to car shops that do custom work, go to bike shops, boat shops....Think

I think you are doing a lot of the right stuff just don't quit. If you want this you need to get creative go on You Tube and look at sales training stuff and find ones that address your problems. sales training in my early days got me in the door and made me a lot of money.

You can do this, We did it. it's not rocket science it's persistence and desire

Make Chips Boys !
 
I recently started working on making some of my own stuff to sell, like tobacco pipes and paraphernalia that I can make with a lathe. But I doubt I'll cover all the payment, working a few hours a night, between getting home and needing sleep.
Your own stuff is the ticket but I don't think you're going to do it with hash pipes. You need something with slightly larger margins. You're kinda screwed with just a lathe but add a bridgeport and you can get somewhere ...

Find a niche. One I know of is old Sportsters, but I'm sure there's lots of others. Parts that haven't been made in fifty years. Make good repops out of good materials. Look through the V-Twin catalog, it's all crap out of Taiwan. Pick some items that you can make and then tell people on the Sportster websites, or whatever other brand / field pops your cherry.

Hang out on those forums and ask questions. I think you'll need something beyond just turning but in the beginning, you can shop out stuff like grinding or tooth cutting. But you want to bring it in-house as soon as possible. When you make high quality stuff then you need to control every aspect. British bike stuff, 70* cranks for parallel twins (they run smoother, it's a lot of work, no one is doing it for sale that I know of) ... whatever. There's stuff out there. Find a need and fill it.

Anyway, find a niche with a markup. Not hash pipes. Luckily, you have a day job.
 
Look into to DOD work for the US government, Canadian citizens are allowed to bid on most jobs. Once you enroll which takes a couple hours here and there for a week you will find plenty to bid on. The larger sized low volume jobs still went for a decent price. Small high volume jobs went cheap and have ridiculous packaging requirements like individually bagging 6mm washers. The USA gov loves paperwork. I had to give it up when I moved as my satellite internet doesn't seem to get along with their website. Dozens of phone calls to their tech support and still could not get my passwords to work.
 
Lets face it, you're in Alberta and Alberta is in a bad recession the last 2-3yrs due to oil crash, compounded by NDP/commie provincial government. Over 100k people out of work and no real sign of it getting better anytime soon, dozens of real big shops closed or hibernating. So, forget oil for the next few years. Look into agriculture, quick fast service, but again, you're late in the game so good luck.
 
Look into to DOD work for the US government, Canadian citizens are allowed to bid on most jobs. Once you enroll which takes a couple hours here and there for a week you will find plenty to bid on. The larger sized low volume jobs still went for a decent price. Small high volume jobs went cheap and have ridiculous packaging requirements like individually bagging 6mm washers. The USA gov loves paperwork. I had to give it up when I moved as my satellite internet doesn't seem to get along with their website. Dozens of phone calls to their tech support and still could not get my passwords to work.

how is he going to get profitable work like that owning a TL2 in a garage in Alberta?
 
dozens of real big shops closed or hibernating.............

Hit every one of these shops and ask for work. They have reduced the number of people in the shop and sometimes don't have the time or man power for small parts. My first customer was a large sheet metal shop. I did small parts that went into big assemblies they made, I did parts for the presses they ran I did repair work for them. Shit I went to a lumber yard and made porch brackets out of angle iron for them.

Go to work man you can do it

Make Chips Boys !

Ron
 
Every other small (and large shop) has already called looking for overflow work.

I just ate a piece of bacon. Not regular bacon. Artisan, hand made, free range hog. Many butcher shops opened in the area (bedroom community, hipsters, $$$) to exploit the market. Morton exploited them with high rent and they tried to compete with the grocery stores. Most scrape by or closed.

But this shop, located out in the country at a restored mill. Far away? No its a destination! Even sells artisan bread. And it is expanding, it regularly sells out. You get there early or you go hungry. $18lb bacon. Its delicious. THey teach you how to use the rendered fat from it for seasoning other meals, they have cooking classes (believe they charge for those) they give recipes. They sell partly cooked complete meals. THey teach you how to cook with small amounts of the very expensive meats they sell so you dont notice the price.

In short, they sell on quality. They took a poor location and turned it into an asset. They offer a complete service. They educated the customer such that the very high price is minimized. They are thriving. The owner is happy, the customers are loyal, the employees are happy. And I had the best slice of bacon I have ever eaten.
 
I think you'd definitely need a milling machine of some sort to expand your capabilities. Small motor/lawn mower repair work often involves cutting a keyway and being able to drill a hole accurately across the center of a shaft. Small motor repair shops are very likely to give you some work to try you out.

I've said it many times before, but here it is again: get a stick welder or a mig welder and get some practice in so you can weld decently. I'd advise learning stick welding first as you'd have a greater variety of rods to choose from (on a moment's notice) for tackling various projects. You (like me) might not love welding all that much, but if it puts bread on the table, then you buckle down and damn well learn to do it. It is this sort of capability: welding and machining that makes your capabilities 'hard to find' and in demand. It will still take a few years to arrive at an experience level that begins to show real profits. But consider such learn-on-the-job activities as your tuition. You might not make top dollar but you can subsidize yourself with a few bucks. They also serve as your advertising: people will talk about you if you demonstrate aptitude and can deliver on their crap work.

There is nothing saying you cannot pursue better work at the same time, but that usually comes through networking. A lone guy with a lathe cannot really be taken too seriously, so you've got to kiss a lot of ass to get only lathe work for a small lathe.

The profitable repair work comes from salvaging a multi-hundred dollar part with a small amount of welding/sleeving or remachining. There is money to be made, but you do need to work your way up in the types of machines you have, in order to handle it. You don't want to have to work a miracle for every job :)
 
Sometimes it helps to hear things multiple times before it really sinks in so here's what I've heard that makes sense:

1. Do everything you can to survive the crappy economy you're in. In retrospect, it may have been better to buy that TL-2 from your twin brother who threw in the towel (too late for you but maybe others will consider that).

2. Find overflow work (visit other shops).

3. Hit up farmers and advertise on CL and other places as doing "repair" or "one-off" custom work.

4. Get a mill, but understanding you may not have the room or money (so that may not be an option at the moment).

5. Keep in mind that even just getting enough work to pay for the machine is at least getting your name out there and prepping you for the eventual rebound (and it will happen). You might have to pay yourself next too nothing until that happens.

Good luck and remember this: it's not the strongest that survive, it's the most adaptable.

The Dude
 
Perhaps be more specific..find what an outfit needs and get a foot in the door.

keyed, double end, threaded and centered shafts to xxx diameter and xxx length turned between centers for .0002 accuracy for diameter size and concentricity often shipped in less than a week.

Keyed odd size shaft couplings Id to your size.. often in less than a week, to xxx diameter and xxx length..

RE: Shaft Diameter-length -left end - right end- Cold roll steel, file hard, hardened. *Check your needed part with a file for files easy , files tough, does not file at all.

note hardened may required more time.

Answer questions up front to save "Can you do this?" waste of time questions.

Send a hand sketch if understood can often start the same day..

oilfield companies want right now service...thousands of dollars a day (perhaps pre hour) with being down.

One job with good service and quality makes a customer..
 








 
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