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How do you handle "Setup Sheets"?

tbm0115

Plastic
Joined
Jan 7, 2015
In my previous job as a 5-Axis Laser Operator, I came into the company right before they began transferring setup sheets "online". The department's engineer developed a nifty Excel workbook that handled revisions and was very well organized. However, they still printed the setup sheets before each job. Ultimately defeating part of the purpose for going "paperless"...

I'm at a new shop now and they're still working with hand written setup sheets. Granted, they scan each setup sheet so they are backed up on the server, it is a burden to update any setup sheets. This inevitably leads to poorly written setup sheets.

My task is to implement a Setup Sheet "Site". So far, I've created a simple web page with a list of machines. The operator simply needs to provide the Job and Step/Operation numbers and the site redirects to the setup sheet page. Each setup sheet is comprised of part/job information, a tool list, and operations. The setup sheet can have virtually an infinite number of tools and operations. Each operation is comprised of appropriate fixture information, images, and operational notes.

I've made it this far with as mixture of my personal experience and the feedback from the machinists at this shop. But, I'm curious if anyone else has conjured up (or found) a similar solution and what might make it better than what I've created.


Capture0.jpgCapture1.jpgCapture2.jpgCapture3.jpg
 
It sounds like you have it pretty much covered.

TBH I usually just take pictures with my phone and pictures of my notes. Then Email them to myself (as a means to back them up). With the Part #/customer/description.

But i usually work by myself.
 
setup sheet

In my previous job as a 5-Axis Laser Operator, I came into the company right before they began transferring setup sheets "online". The department's engineer developed a nifty Excel workbook that handled revisions and was very well organized. However, they still printed the setup sheets before each job. Ultimately defeating part of the purpose for going "paperless"...

I'm at a new shop now and they're still working with hand written setup sheets. Granted, they scan each setup sheet so they are backed up on the server, it is a burden to update any setup sheets. This inevitably leads to poorly written setup sheets.

My task is to implement a Setup Sheet "Site". So far, I've created a simple web page with a list of machines. The operator simply needs to provide the Job and Step/Operation numbers and the site redirects to the setup sheet page. Each setup sheet is comprised of part/job information, a tool list, and operations. The setup sheet can have virtually an infinite number of tools and operations. Each operation is comprised of appropriate fixture information, images, and operational notes.

I've made it this far with as mixture of my personal experience and the feedback from the machinists at this shop. But, I'm curious if anyone else has conjured up (or found) a similar solution and what might make it better than what I've created.


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we just use microsoft powerpoint. it handles pictures, scanned images and you can draw with computer even draw on a image to blank it out if you want to draw over it and type text over it, draw circles, rectangles, arrows, etc. handles multiple pages too. if you make any system too complicated chances are you will be the only one that uses it
 
Since you are backing all of this up on the PC have you thought of maybe using a tablet in the shop to access these in the future. It cuts down on the paper each time.
Michael
 
setup sheets

Since you are backing all of this up on the PC have you thought of maybe using a tablet in the shop to access these in the future. It cuts down on the paper each time.
Michael
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our setup sheets are on the computer network which is backed up every day. i prefer a big computer monitor 20" is ok but 27" is better as you can see drawings easier. even bigger monitors are coming down in price
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my experience is small stuff like tablets or even scanners that are moved can be dropped and break falling even 3 feet. plus i hate the ideal of touching any computer item and getting it dirty. i have keyboards covered in sticky coolant that are bad enough to keep clean.
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personally i hate the ideal of any touch screen device in the shop. some computers can run 2 monitors at the same time. it is nice to have setup sheet on one monitor and the drawing on another.
 
@TomB one of the programmers uses powerpoint for setup sheets on our 5-axis machine center. The machine center has two monitors and has Microsoft Office to access the file (amongst others). I've used powerpoint setup sheets before and they're quite nice, the only drawback is editing/creating the setup sheet takes a bit of time formatting everything. Do you use a template for creating setup sheets? I haven't come up with a solid template design for PowerPoint.


@mthomure That's a valid point, but the issue is with editing the setup sheets. The machinists end up getting frustrated with rewriting everything just to change one step in the sequence. This results in a lot of short hand descriptions which equals lower quality documentation. PDF's are great for storage, but not for editing unless you fork out some money for a decent PDF editor.


Has anyone played with some of the Setup Sheet functions in software like Vericut, MasterCAM, or the Zoller Tool Management Software? I'd be curious to know if these have options to edit the display and content very easily. I've seen Vericut spit out a pretty sweet tool list with very little effort.
 
tbm0115
I understand the editing issue for sure. We are just a four man shop so it doesn't take long to duck into the office and correct the set up sheet in Excel. We can add photos and notes when that is more appropriate.
It may not work for everyone , but it does for us. I already had 12 3" notebooks full of paper set up sheets.
Michael
 
setup sheets

@TomB one of the programmers uses powerpoint for setup sheets on our 5-axis machine center. The machine center has two monitors and has Microsoft Office to access the file (amongst others). I've used powerpoint setup sheets before and they're quite nice, the only drawback is editing/creating the setup sheet takes a bit of time formatting everything. Do you use a template for creating setup sheets? I haven't come up with a solid template design for PowerPoint.


@mthomure That's a valid point, but the issue is with editing the setup sheets. The machinists end up getting frustrated with rewriting everything just to change one step in the sequence. This results in a lot of short hand descriptions which equals lower quality documentation. PDF's are great for storage, but not for editing unless you fork out some money for a decent PDF editor.


Has anyone played with some of the Setup Sheet functions in software like Vericut, MasterCAM, or the Zoller Tool Management Software? I'd be curious to know if these have options to edit the display and content very easily. I've seen Vericut spit out a pretty sweet tool list with very little effort.
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i do not have a problem editing with powerpoint. sure it helps if you have a template file you save as a copy that way original template is still blank except for name date file name locations at the top.
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one programmer does not like powerpoint. he will draw with pencil and paper and has a little sheet fed scanner at his work bench. takes less than a minute to put it up on the computer screen. he uses whiteout white ink to blank out areas if he wants to redo a spot on page. it is crude but it works as he rarely takes more than a few minutes to draw it out
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i have seen excel used but this can create bigger files which open slow on the computer network. powerpoint is designed to open faster for showing a room full of people the "slides"
.... excel is more useful for a setup and inspection checklist. that is i record in the cells specific items have been done and measurements with name and date and it helps to do things in order and not forget anything. as long as there is not that many pictures excel works ok too. with excel inspection file which we fill out as we do a job we can go back and see who did what and when. we just right click and insert a column for the next new job. records can back for years
 
here is what I made up for setup sheets in the shop. There is drop down menus which have our most used tooling/inserts/grades.

I have emailed it to a few people already. If anyone is interested pm me.

Its kinda in beta stage. I would like the drop down menus to be dependent on the selection of the previous menus. But I can't figure it out without it looking weird. something to do with spaces in the names. basically.. if you pick part off blade. I only want part off inserts and grades shown in the next menus.

The tooling/insert list is mainly for Lathes. But you can edit it out to suit your needs. I also have most of the cells protected(can't edit out the info) and its saved on the server as a template. Almost every machine we have has its own computer with the shortcut saved to the desktop.

here is a screenshot.

setup.jpg
 
here is what I made up for setup sheets in the shop. There is drop down menus which have our most used tooling/inserts/grades.

I have emailed it to a few people already. If anyone is interested pm me.

Its kinda in beta stage. I would like the drop down menus to be dependent on the selection of the previous menus. But I can't figure it out without it looking weird. something to do with spaces in the names. basically.. if you pick part off blade. I only want part off inserts and grades shown in the next menus.

here is a screenshot.

View attachment 138233
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we would call that a tool list which if we use regular standard tools kept in tool changer we do not bother putting on a setup sheet. only thing on setup sheet we have is non standard tools
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also a gcode program we have tool list at beginning a program with tool descriptions so operator can check standard tool numbers and see if in the machine. for example tool 22000024 is always a 4" dia roughing facemill of a certain length. we keep a setup book just for tools so we know if they are in tolerance. our parlec tool measuring system will say if a endmill is too short in a tool holder and each tool holder has a electronic chip or is engraved with permanent marked tool number on its side
 
In some cases - I have started taking pics and just storing the pics with the prints. (on the pyuter)


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox
 
We're a job shop that does a lot of onsies-twosies stuff. The stuff I manage and design on are mostly the onsie-twosie stuff. The high part-count longer-run and repeat-jobs may get a little more thorough attention (ironically enough) but we don't have a lot of time to make thorough setup documentation... and it's hard to invest in something like that if the chance of a repeat for that part is <5%

We program in NX8.0. In the programmers' "start file" we have all the tombstones, grid plates, tables, vices, rotaries, etc. Once the part is set up in whatever work-holding it will have, they just pop a "top view" (at minimum, sometimes more) of the machine setup, and plop it onto a company title block, or even just a blank sheet with any important dimensions shown. NX spits out the tool requirements automagically, since we have a good tool library built up.

For our CMM guy, if we have to run a CMM report on multiple parts (some customers basically want an FAI for every serialized part) then we keep photos of the setup and keep them in the part # folder on the server. The photo will either show, or have notation for which grid positions on the grid plate each post or fixture piece is aligned to. Match the Part #, Rev # to make sure you're running the right program and let 'er rip. The one time when it magically happens to be a case of "just put it on there and push the green button!"

I am taking notes from some of y'all's examples... I like it!
 
the problem i see often is any system where only one person like a programmer creates a setup using a computer program only he has easy access too.
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the best systems are where a cnc operator can add info. it can be as simple as a M0 program stop message that says rechuck and setup sheet might say reclamp part at 10 ft lbs and check part seated with .001" feeler gage and a warning of tight tolerances
... or adding to setup sheet tool 123 is kept in cabinet A drawer 3 in pocket D
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i have seen setup sheets created with a pencil and paper and scanned in at work bench and on a computer in a minute. i have seen printout used and whiteout a spot to rewrite a note on setup sheet. sounds crude but it works and i have seen operators trained to use scanner in less than 5 minutes. Scanner is often only $100. also have seen digital camera used too. again the cost can only be $100 but pictures are useful for showing complex setups from different angles.
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i am just saying the best systems are where a operator can add a note, warning, etc for himself or other operators as a operator can learn important things as he is making the part from the experience gained making that part that the programmer might not be aware of. i often will add a note on program printout or setup sheet to watch a tool to warn to be close to control rather than be far away doing other work and not being there in time to stop a major problem from happening. i consider operator to operator notes important
 
I have worked in so many different industries with some many different setups that I've come to the conclusion that there is no one "best way" except the one that works for you. You've hit on one important issue and that's simply to have the setup documented and make it "systematic" to be able to find it. That's 75% of the battle right there. Here's some other general ideas:

For a lot of industries, it makes sense to start incorporating video or at least photos since that technology is so easy to integrate now.

A lot of setups are simply needing to know "which tools do I use?" (i.e. photos, documents, videos, etc. aren't needed". For us, that is the case so we assign tools to the BOM and that gets printed on the traveler as a "tool" item so the operator knows it's a tool and not material. However, we don't do this where the type of tool is obvious (i.e. you use a 4" squaring jig on 4" material and 5" squaring jig on 5" material). We also have a "settings" category to tell an operator about any settings they need to make to a particular machine. That puts all setup info in one place but admittedly won't work in more complicated operations.

The Dude
 
i am just saying the best systems are where a operator can add a note, warning, etc for himself or other operators as a operator can learn important things as he is making the part from the experience gained making that part that the programmer might not be aware of.

I completely agree! The place I used to work at had a spiffy Excel program that handled revisions, but locked us out of updating the information until the revision was approved (which could a take up to a week for a part that's made every day).

The site I made is all based out of an Microsoft Access database that stores all of the setup sheet information for all setup sheets. The tooling and fixture information is dynamic, so whatever items you add to the Access database table is available on the setup sheet to add more tools/fixtures and edit existing items.

The reason it's a site and not a desktop application or Excel spreadsheet (or even straight out of Access) is because it eliminates the necessity of installing extra software on any hardware. In our case, there were two Android tablets that were several years old and don't play nice with Microsoft products. A site is one thing that almost any modern device can efficiently use. This system allows everyone who has access to the local intranet to create, view, and edit a setup sheet.
 
I completely agree! The place I used to work at had a spiffy Excel program that handled revisions, but locked us out of updating the information until the revision was approved (which could a take up to a week for a part that's made every day).

The site I made is all based out of an Microsoft Access database that stores all of the setup sheet information for all setup sheets. The tooling and fixture information is dynamic, so whatever items you add to the Access database table is available on the setup sheet to add more tools/fixtures and edit existing items.

The reason it's a site and not a desktop application or Excel spreadsheet (or even straight out of Access) is because it eliminates the necessity of installing extra software on any hardware. In our case, there were two Android tablets that were several years old and don't play nice with Microsoft products. A site is one thing that almost any modern device can efficiently use. This system allows everyone who has access to the local intranet to create, view, and edit a setup sheet.
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where i work they have no internet as too many waste time on it. although internet is occasionally useful for finding catalog info as a CNC Operator i believe they feel i would never need to look anything up.
...... many machine shops have a problem with people playing games or chatting on a computer or playing with their phone. they even have had to go around and remove any game programs on all computers and ban cell phone use during working hours
....... we use tool numbers and if we want more info we have a hard copy 3 ring binder book with tool setup information. i rarely need to look at it as usually tool is already setup and i just replace inserts. sometimes it is easier to just use a simple system as some people have difficulty using a computer.
 
sometimes it is easier to just use a simple system as some people have difficulty using a computer.

I've encountered this situation before and it brings up a good point in general. When setting up systems like this, it's hard to accommodate everyone's needs and preferences.

So far, our biggest concern with the design of these setup sheets is the reference to tools. We've recognized that tooling is one of our biggest hurdles, since we don't have any public "database". Machinists still have tools in their personal tool boxes and there is no tool number ID system outside of our AutoCrib. However, even the AutoCrib isn't fully utilized. We've been looking into the Zoller TMS System to help manage inventory and identification.

This might be a stupid question, but how did you even begin your 3 ring book of tool setup info and how specific do you get in identifying all of the components?
 
I've encountered this situation before and it brings up a good point in general. When setting up systems like this, it's hard to accommodate everyone's needs and preferences.

So far, our biggest concern with the design of these setup sheets is the reference to tools. We've recognized that tooling is one of our biggest hurdles, since we don't have any public "database". Machinists still have tools in their personal tool boxes and there is no tool number ID system outside of our AutoCrib. However, even the AutoCrib isn't fully utilized. We've been looking into the Zoller TMS System to help manage inventory and identification.

This might be a stupid question, but how did you even begin your 3 ring book of tool setup info and how specific do you get in identifying all of the components?
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basically tool setup book for end mills lists tool holder length and diameter and end mill length range and well as diameter range and length of cut range, flute number, a lot of info
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i usually just look at the length of cut range as if you need a 2" depth of cut and are too short the tool holder will hit the part. also got to be careful the side of a tool holder does not rub on the part. i use a lot of long over 18" tool holders
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it is really really a good ideal to standardize tool numbers. i have a excel chart for example that lists tool 22000024 (the 22 is a standard number for roughing end mills) and all the feeds and speeds used with it along with metal types and have a record of any sudden tool failures. in less than 10 seconds i can look up a program settings and a specific standard tool used and see if it is in a normal range or if the settings are in the sudden tool failure range.
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a simple excel file has cut down on my sudden tool failures by easily over 90% just by not using feeds and speeds that are known to cause problems. i also increase speeds and feeds if they are too slow if i have a record of faster settings being used without any sudden tool failures
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different tool lengths can have a huge effect of feeds and speeds that will work ok
 
...it is really really a good ideal to standardize tool numbers.

I nominate this for understatement of the year! I would say that it's virtually mandatory that, once you reach a certain "critical mass" of machinists, machines and tools that the system becomes chaotic if you don't have this. I'm no machinist but if I had one piece of advice for any shop starting up (even single person and single machine) it's this: implement a tool numbering system from day one. . You will be so glad you did. Just start out with a spreadsheet. Give every tool some kind of ID number that either represents it's storage location or it's function (ideally have one number for each as a mistake-proof form of ID). DON'T WORRY ABOUT KEEPING ALL END MILLS, REAMERS, ETC. TOGETHER. It's more important that every end mill has an identifier and a "home". You can "look" at them in your spreadsheet sorting them properly to see what you have and just opening the dang drawers will tell you if you're low on anything in about 30 seconds. If your setup sheets or system BOM (e.g. E2 or Global Shop, etc.) call out tool ID's and locations then you can easily put them back when the job is done. Get all those "extras" laying around in tool boxes into some nice storage cabinets. The extra tools and cost avoidances on purchasing more "extra" tools (when you already have them, just can't find them) will pay for at least part of the cabinets and the time savings will cover the rest to make a good payback. Easier said than done but one of the best "system" changes you can make.

The Dude
 
with standard tooling and programs using mostly standardized tools then when you change a job often all the tools needed are already in the machine ready to go. the cad cam program is setup to use standardized tools with standardized feeds and speeds
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most places i worked had other standard tools just outside the machine already setup in a rack and just had to be put them in the machine when needed. often a tool magazine has over 80% of standard tools always in it and a few empty pockets ready for quickly putting in rarely used standard tools.
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i would say normally, having to setup a special tool is usually done maybe only 5% of the time. this using mostly standard tools usually means setting up for a different job might only take a few minutes to put a few missing tools in.
 








 
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