insulated steel panels for shop roof and walls

Not sure where to put this, but just curious if these style foam core panels are popular over there and how suitable they are for a shop environment? any problems? Kingspan Australia - Kingspan Insulated Panels, Australia: Roof Panels KS1000 RW

Not that I can see. Only in the very hi-end building panel builders.

I have discussed the need for these with one of the roofing sheet manuf downstate.
The "ag panel" market is really getting big for re-roofing old houses around here.

Around here, that panel/profile is made to exact custom length, you get them in
(1) week. I suggested just getting "dow" or some other foam board make extruded
sheets to that profile, the end user could lightly stick them on with #77 adhesive, before
placing them down (the fasteners would take over from there) to preclude the manuf
from buying a bunch of expensive extruding/bonding equipment.

The suggestion "Went in one ear, and out the other"...ugh.

A building in our park has foam-core walls. Nice building, looked great the first few years. Now, the skin has big bubbles, where the adhesive has failed. Looks terrible, but the strength is not compromised AFAIK..

Thanks for the replie's,the bubbling is definitely a concern.Basically it's going to be for a large steel frame pole barn, I think is what you know them as? And it will be used mostly for fab work,so I don't like the idea of exposed spray foam,or having to mess around and line it. So this just seems like a quick simple clean option.

Ajc123 said:

Thanks for the replie's,the bubbling is definitely a concern.Basically it's going to be for a large steel frame pole barn, I think is what you know them as? And it will be used mostly for fab work,so I don't like the idea of exposed spray foam,or having to mess around and line it. So this just seems like a quick simple clean option.

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Bondor also make panels and roofing sheets.
Bondor Australia - Insulated Panels & Architectural Facades: Home | Bondor Insulated Panels | 1300 300 099
They have all the flashing to go with them as well. I'm thinking of using them for the 3 room extension on our home.
Rich.

My building has walls like that
Foam with steel sheet lining with a low profile on both ends
The flat roof is 20cm foam with steel low profile lining on both sides with glued on PVC roofing
The size is about 1.25 mtr wide and lenght is about 8 to 10 mtr I think
They have a unsupported span from about 4mtr On a flat roof that is
So the foam is a structural element
So glueing them together yourself is not a option
Those panels are very commen over here for industrial buildings and bubbling is not a problem Never saw it
It is a very well insulated building I have
This winter I have used no heating at all

peter from holland

We use these a lot in the UK Especially as we live about 10 miles from a big Klngspan factory, and several local dealers sell "seconds" quality. There are many products like this about, the only difference seems to be the coating on the outside of the panels. The best ones are pvc coated zinc plated, next best are the zinc coated acrylic painted. the rest need to be cheap! easy and fast to fit, and make a completely watertight roof! There is a version which has the outer sheet moulded to look like slate or tile finishes of various types.They are very convincing, but expensive. You can also get a choice of inner finishes, some galv steel, some plastic and the cheapest seems to be an "anti condensation coating" a bit like building paper membrane . I will probably be reroofing two buildings this year using this type of sheeting.
Phil, UK

We use them for buildings and roofs here in the UK. Quicker, cleaner, cheaper in labour than separately insulated roofs.

My home workshop is slightly different, that's structural insulated panels with 125mm of PU foam in between cement bonded particleboard (outside) and OSB (inside). That stuff's excellent.

baccus61 said:

Bondor also make panels and roofing sheets.
Bondor Australia - Insulated Panels & Architectural Facades: Home | Bondor Insulated Panels | 1300 300 099
They have all the flashing to go with them as well. I'm thinking of using them for the 3 room extension on our home.
Rich.

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A good product, but it burns like you wouldn't believe and firefighters are very wary of such buildings on fire due to the heat, explosive toxic gases and propensity to collapse without warning. Bondor claims it is fire retardant but a little real world testing indicates otherwise, a nice touch from a company that is associated with JH. Say no more.
The last kingspan material I worked with was phenolic foam and quite fire resistant, even resisting prolonged application of a blowtorch.

Great idea.
Never seen those in the states.
SIPs are becoming more common, not sure the steel panels are approved yet.

I picked up a brochure at the tool show from a place that makes these panels. But what interested me were the panels they made that were rockwool as the insulation rather than foam. They are fire rated the same as a block wall.

I used to work at a factory that made panels like that. Had a machine to form roll sheet metal and feed it into a fixture which sprayed the foam mix onto it and placed a top sheet over and hold until the foam expanded to fill the space between. Most of those went to Alaska for the pipeline buildings.
I almost was able to get a stack of rejects from that line for hauling them off, but when it was asked about, the guy to OK it saw $'s and sold it off instead. Had it not been pointed out, the pile was scheduled to go to the scrap yard.

peterve said:

My building has walls like that
Foam with steel sheet lining with a low profile on both ends
The flat roof is 20cm foam with steel low profile lining on both sides with glued on PVC roofing
The size is about 1.25 mtr wide and lenght is about 8 to 10 mtr I think
They have a unsupported span from about 4mtr On a flat roof that is
So the foam is a structural element
So glueing them together yourself is not a option

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Pete, gluing on is temporary just until it gets up to roof.

Right now those panels we use, don't have any added strength,
most use purlins at 24" c-c spacing, I use 16" c-c.

But trying to walk on an open roof span (just purlins) and tacking down
1" styrofoam, aint gonna cut it. Attaching the panel to the roofing tin,
makes the job much safer.

also, not having the foam bonded on, should (I would think) eliminate
any buckling problems.

I am a retired builder that specialized in Steel SIP construction for over 25 years , they are structural on there own and used mainly for cold storage , but we specialized in using them for light commercial, custom homes,clean rooms, barns,www.greensips.com

I believe the high rise apartment building that burned in Britain recently was clad in some thing like these panels. I believe Alcoa made them with a aluminum outer skin and foam insulation. The fire got into the foam and traveled all through the exterior walls. The video showed burning panels flying off in the fire storm winds.
Bill D

24 stories, at least 49 killed.

cmkavala said:

I am a retired builder that specialized in Steel SIP construction for over 25 years , they are structural on there own and used mainly for cold storage , but we specialized in using them for light commercial, custom homes,clean rooms, barns,www.greensips.com

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Well that's all well and good, however you have not:
1. Told us of the cost.
2. Explained if any one can just walk in and buy them.

Alcoa changed its name to Arconic in 2016 for some reason. Sounds like in single story construction the panels are okay. No idea what this means for roof panels.
Bill D

Grenfell Fire: Arconic Knew It Was Supplying Flammable Cladding Panels | Fortune.com

Bill D said:

I believe the high rise apartment building that burned in Britain recently was clad in some thing like these panels. I believe Alcoa made them with a aluminum outer skin and foam insulation. The fire got into the foam and traveled all through the exterior walls. The video showed burning panels flying off in the fire storm winds.
Bill D

24 stories, at least 49 killed.

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No its nothing like these panels the grenfell problem material is more akin to dibond, its a decrotive finish and the core is nearer solid than a foam. Just 2 thin sheets of alu often with a decorative finish and a plastic core depending on brand - thickness there normally sub 1/4" thick. Whats more they passed UK flammability testing criteria because being aluminium skinned casual flame contact won't cause em to ignite. Now get the whole panel hot enough and the core liquefies drips out as a highly flammable sticky napalm like material and yeah you have big issues. All the more so with one of the cores combustion products being cyanide, the smoke is seriously nasty stuff.

The real likely cause of the problem there is not the flammability of the panels everyone keeps whining on about but how they were installed. The flame - heat must have been travelling up the backs of the panelling for it to spread that fast, because a unheated pannel just won't burn from causal flame contact!! They have to get sustained flame - heat to ignite. That points IMHO to significant installation failings not just a material problem. There should have been horizontal fire brakes at regularly set intervals and if that had been done right it should have been really clear from the pics as it burnt Yeah the fire may have jumped levels, but a whole side should not have reached near ignition point at the same time. Equally the fact that levels bellow the fire did not really burn also points to there being a clear chimney type effect going on keeping thoes panels bellow the fire cool enough not to ignite. With correct fire brakes that chimney effect should not have been happening.

The panels being discused here are meta skinned with a foam polyurethane core in the case of the typical building over here there steel skinned and are bloody tough, yeah you can walk on them with no issue. But they can be bloody slippery. Equally if there mossy and the roof also contains clear panels for light transmission more than a few people get careless - don't notice and end up stepping on and falling through the clear panelling.

Adama, interesting. So the panels are just decorative like the old tin ceiling panels? I guess the filler material is just because the skins are too thin to be self supporting. you have to supply your own insulation under them.
Still that fire does make me wonder about the flammable insulation inside the SIP panels and how fire breaks would be designed into the structure. I suppose some wood or metal framing at every joint.
Bill D