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  1. #21
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    I think you've a level headed view of things, I'm just wondering have you talked anyone there about it? I love it when guys come to me with ideas - I too don't know what I'm doing lots (most? lol) of the time. Seriously, I'm slightly in that boat in that I am running a business in a industry I didn't grow up in so rely heavily on the team.

    imo what to do if anything would depend on what 'bought by an investment group' means - a 1/2 billion company picked up by a 20 billion private equity group, or a business with a few dozen guys picked up by local doctors and dentists. If the former you could hint you were interested in improving things but basically stfu and retire happily (you don't want to be perceived as "not aligned with the strategy" and don't want to be getting canned at 64). otoh It was also depend on the attitude of the direct supervisor, which if plant manager, is sort of surprising he's not interested. Maybe he's bigger fires and would like to work with you....or maybe he's a know-it-all ego tripper who will react poorly. Only you can find out

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by MushCreek View Post
    Ha ha!
    Plus a bunch of other stuff
    that makes me sad.

    I'm fairly certain we've all worked in a place that was similar..
    You want things to work, but NOBODY else does.. It sucks...

    a96ac256683587.59b84dbddf97b.jpg

    The trick is to just not give a shit.. Fuck it... Nobody else
    cares, why should you..

    ConverterKing
    It's an investment company. Did you ever think that they don't want to show a profit? If they don't care, why should you?
    Fuck it.. And its not always easy, because you want to do a good job, you want to work for
    a place that appreciates you, you want the place you work at to be successful.. And that is
    really hard when even the people up the food chain, that should want those things even more than
    you don't give a shit...

    So Fuck it.. Get up and go to work, do some stuff, but don't bust your ass.. Go home and forget about
    it... They don't care, why should you.. They don't want to buy a bandsaw blade, fuck it.. Sit and watch
    the CNC split your stock for you while you play CandyCrush or HayDay on your phone. Fuck it..

    A quote from a friend of mine.. "If I gave a shit, I couldn't work here"...

    You did your best, and I give you Kudo's for that.. I'd appreciate that if you did it for me...
    But they don't care, so Fuck 'Em!!!

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  4. #23
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  6. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by MushCreek View Post
    The head of Purchasing where I work now did say he would 'load me up' with work if I went out on my own.
    Having him get you work and having him pay you for that work are two different things.

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    Quote Originally Posted by converterking View Post
    Having him get you work and having him pay you for that work are two different things.
    Oh boy does THAT ring a bell ! One of my many errors - we hooked up with a place in the US a few years ago, for a while, and I thought I was so smart. I asked everybody behind the scenes, "Do these guys really have money ? Can they afford to do this ?"

    Answer was yes yes YES ! they have more money than God ! so we went for it.

    Wrong question. I should have asked, "Do they pay their bills ?"

    @MushCreek, at 64 you are doing great. Walking that line between knowing the place is worthless but still doing the best you can. Even in a losing situation you can keep your own pride ... but plan for the future. Seems to me you are doing exactly the best thing. Smile, put up with their shit, make as many parts as you can with the crap tools they give you, prepare for them to go broke and try to cheat you, and think about what you want to be doing when that happens.

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    The good news is that I'm already set up for retirement. The house is paid for, as are the cars. We're very frugal. We have money put away, and my wife is already on SS, and will be retiring in August. My goal is (or was) to work to 68, while starting SS at 66. I don't even see my paycheck- it all goes straight in to savings. I'm really just padding my savings for a bit more security when I do retire.

    When I had my own shop, one of the mistakes I made was way overextending the business buying capital equipment. I worked my tail off just to make the machinery payments. The difference now is that the modest equipment I have now is all paid for. It's in my own shop, so no monthly rent. The most I could get burned on would be materials, or if I farmed out a specialty trade like WEDM. It's only intended as a hobby shop, though, and I always envisioned just tinkering out there, and picking up a few small paying jobs just to justify having a shop, and paying for consumables.

    The GM and his inner circle are definitely know-it-all ego trippers. The upper management team is just dripping with condescension. It's an odd place; the grounds, outward appearance, and front offices are beautifully maintained. The HR department is wonderful and professional. As soon as you walk out on the shop floor, the difference is palpable. Dirty, noisy, poor climate control, rough looking characters, antiquated equipment. The people work, but their heart isn't in it. There's a very toxic atmosphere among the hourly workers, and the biggest challenge is in not getting caught up in it.

    So, I just enjoy the challenges that come my way, do very nice and accurate work, and collect my pay. I'm not good at goofing off, as I get bored easily, so I just work at the same pace I have for 40 years.

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    I reckon you are pretty lucky.....first day of new owners and new manager I was told to keep a log of all spare time I had,to spy on production staff and report slackers,rearrange my job so that I could be "versatile",in other words do production work,and the last straw....I was to be available as a cleaner as part of my maintenance fitter duties.Then when most of his "efficiencies" didnt happen,I was micro managed by a dickhead who didnt have a clue,and everything broke down.....so if you are being left alone,I say youre lucky.

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    It is hard to work under those conditions if you take pride in your work. When I came to work I told management "my wife told me to go to hell, so here I am". I semi retired at 40.

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    I don't know what it's like to be in my 50's-60's and looking for work. I'm 31, and I'm a street-pounding salesman now. Nearly every shop I walk into, after introducing myself, they will cut me off and ask if I want a job.

    My point there, is that at least in my area, there's such a need for skilled machinists & other trades, that I can't imagine you'd have a hard time finding a better job, even at 64.

    If you really want out of there, take a day off and just start knocking on doors of other local shops/factories. At your age & experience, I wouldn't even worry about a resume' unless you wanted to leave it on the owners' desk.

    You may be surprised...

    Best of luck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jashley73 View Post
    I don't know what it's like to be in my 50's-60's and looking for work. I'm 31, and I'm a street-pounding salesman now. Nearly every shop I walk into, after introducing myself, they will cut me off and ask if I want a job.
    Sure - at $10/hour with rises all the way to $12 after 10 years.......

    In my old day job (IT) I didn't get out of bed for less than $120/hour and I didn't set foot on a plane for less than $180/hour (I hate travelling). My response to people offering me a job was always 'you can't afford me'.

    PDW

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    I'm not sure what the deal is. I'm near Greenville, SC, and there's ton of work around here. Local shops that feed off of BMW and other major manufacturers. It's the first time in my career that I haven't just walked in the door and gotten hired. I'm either over-qualified, too old, or I'm up against the local good-ole-boy network, since I've only been here a couple years. Pay rates are pretty low here, but I don't really care. When looking for a job, I decided that I either wanted to do really interesting work, make lots of money, or be respected for what I do and/or know. My current job offers none of the above. Kind of a bummer to end up my career this way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MushCreek View Post
    Kind of a bummer to end up my career this way.
    Nah. You're just adding a little to the stash for when ya pick up an RV and go travel around the country

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    Quote Originally Posted by MushCreek View Post
    The company I work for was bought by an investment group, and they apparently know little about the business, and especially tool room work Here's the day I had recently:

    I was making some heel blocks for a mold that we are rebuilding. They are D-2, which is a bear to begin with. First, I had to start with way oversized stock, because the size I wanted 'isn't available'. Why isn't it? Because their credit is so bad that they don't have a vendor for tool steel, so they order whatever is available from MSC or McMaster-Carr. I needed eight 2" long pieces; I started with an 8' long stick.

    The only horizontal bandsaw is in the maintenance department, where they apparently use it cut rocks. They buy the cheapest blades, which don't hold up to D-2 even on the slowest speed and flood coolant. But on this particular day, the coolant pump was out anyway (and has been for about a month) so cutting it up on the bandsaw was out of the question. I set it up on my CNC bed mill, and wrote a program to cut it off using an end mill. No flood coolant on the mill, either, so you have to take it easy.

    After cutting off the pieces, I had to cut down the big stock with a face mill to get the desired size. I can't take a big cut, because it's only a 5 hp bed mill. Now, there's a big, strong VMC about 30 feet away, but it doesn't work because they left it disconnected so long that the memory and parameters were lost. It's a companion piece to the CNC EDM, wire EDM, turning center, and CNC ID/OD grinder that are all non-functional (I already wrote a thread about that).

    I did the math, and I spent most of a day making 7 lbs. of chips. That's more than the parts weigh! I used up about $100 in disposable tooling, and 8 hours making blanks, not to mention the 7 lbs. of D-2 all over the floor. I was told that 'labor doesn't count' as they were already paying me to be there. According to one of the middle managers, I'm really 'knocking it out of the park' with all of the work I'm getting done. That's because my predecessor spent his days playing on-line chess instead of machining.

    Typical underling gripes, I know, but in my last job, I was the manager over the tool room and mold maintenance. I can see so many mistakes (many the same that my previous employer used to make), yet am powerless to do anything about it. I'm just trying to tough it out for a few more years to retire, but I worry that the company won't last that long.

    Why won't management in a company like this not seek out the opinions of someone with 40 years in the business? In 1-1/2 years there, the general manager has never even spoken to me. I know; I should move on, but at 64, my resume gets ignored everywhere I send it. That, and this place is 10 minutes from my house; most jobs would be an hour away. So, I come in, do what I can, and keep my mouth shut. The dog is way too big for this old tail to wag.
    Going to take a guess here that the new management doesn't care what tool room does because they are not production. Do you think they are going to change a routing, order the material and have it shipped to the company over 8 small pieces? If this was going to be a production run of a lot of parts I would guess they may listen to you. Our Tool room guys rarely get the material they want to make parts, sometimes they have to mill off more material or use the bandsaw and cut stock out of a plate. They are not efficient but they still get the job done.

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  20. #34
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    Whatever you do, do not go out on your own based on getting work from these asshats. Never gonna happen. I will repeat. NEVER GONNA HAPPEN.

    Now, if you can find some other work, going on your own might be a fun way to wind down your career.

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    I didnt read everyone else' comments.....I assume I am about to say what many have already said....maybe a bit differently.
    As you stated...you are 64, I agree it is probably a bit late to be looking for new employment. Most likely what is happening (my opinion) management is using some goofy ass way of accounting that you and I will never understand and neither do they.
    You are 64.......nothing you do is gonna make things there significantly better......OR significantly worse. Stop beating yourself up. Do what you can so that you go home knowing you earned your check as best you could with what was provided to do it with. If you are looking for something MORE.....some sort of good feeling about your day and what you do I would suggest one of 2 options...#1 find someone you work with who seems eager to learn what you know...or ....#2 find somewhere to volunteer a couple of times a week, maybe a tech school where you can pass on your knowledge or something completely unrelated that gives you peace of mind....you are 64....you are not gonna win the fight you described.....find a different fight that you can make a difference at.
    Just my thoughts.....Its what I plan on telling myself in a few short years.
    Good luck

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    Well, it got a lot more interesting while I was out with the flu. On Thursday, they announced that the plant is going on 12 hour shifts. Supposedly, all hourly employees. It works out to exactly 80 hours for each two week period. Each employee would work every other weekend, and half a day every Wednesday.

    The reasoning is that they paid out some 1/2 million dollars in OT last year, most of it to production workers. Now, the only reason I know of for OT is when you don't have enough workers to cover each shift (we run 24/7). If you don't have enough workers, re-arranging their schedule doesn't get you any more hours out of them. In fact, since this move is to eliminate OT, there will be a substantial LOSS in man-hours. Add to that the huge exodus of people who won't/can't work these hours, and that puts them even further behind. To make it worse, the people who leave will be the ones who CAN leave, meaning better-quality workers who can get another job. That leaves the felons, meth heads, and goof-offs behind to do the work.

    The entire tool room, twelve people, said they won't do it. We were given a form to select the shift we preferred. There was a third option- "I can't work a 12 hour shift'. This option was followed by a strongly worded statement saying that if you fail to work your scheduled shift and hours, you would be subject to disciplinary action and/or termination. In other words, if you check this box, you will likely get fired. Most of the guys in the tool room are around retirement age, so if push comes to shove, most of us will leave. This starts in April; if I can't find someplace else, I'll work the 12 hour shifts while using my free days to search for a job.

    I feel sorry for the production workers. Many of them are women with children. Where are they going to find daycare to cover those hours? Where are they going to find daycare to cover every other weekend? Many of them live paycheck-to-paycheck, and the loss of OT will really hurt. A lot of them work more than one job- How can you work more than one job on that kind of schedule?

    Based on the chatter around the place today, this could really blow up in their face. A LOT of people are already looking for their next job. Should be interesting...

  23. #37
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    Someone here on PM in SC that can give this guy a job?


    .......................I'm so blessed to be self-employed.

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  25. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by david n View Post
    Someone here on PM in SC that can give this guy a job?


    .......................I'm so blessed to be self-employed.
    Amen brother, a bad day being self employed is better than a good day working for the man, especially in a large company.

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  27. #39
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    You said you were just banking the checks. Do you realize that at 64, your life is most likely more than three quarters over. Enjoy the time you have left. Quit now.

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  29. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by digger doug View Post
    Why are you enabling bad management ?

    Don't "Make do", you won't be rewarded for hero work.
    He answered your question in the first post. Management at his company apparently doesn't care. He's 64 years of age and will have a tough time finding another job.

    Hope this helps you.


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