Buying a SouthBend

Hi Guys,
I am looking at purchasing a South Bend 9in Model A from a friend at work. This is a CL344ZD lathe. I have used a number of Hardinge and DoAll lathes making various parts, but this would be my first South Bend and first time owning the lathe. I wanted to get your opinion on the quality of these lathes as well as what common issues or "good to have" features would be before pulling the trigger. Also is it possible to convert this lathe to a lever style collet lathe in the future or am I stuck with a chuck setup?

Some of the items it would come with:
3 Jaw Chuck
4 Jaw Chuck
2nd Backing Plate
Quick Change Toolpost
Drills / Cutters
Carbide Cutter Set
Boring Bar Set
Knurling Set
Wired for 120V

They are nice "little" lathes...this one I presume is an underdrive machine on the 3 drawer cabinet?

since you are not new to machines I will not read you the riot act, so assuming good condition and everything free and lubricated it's hard to go wrong with one...you will enjoy it I'm sure, not what you are accustomed to but will make fine parts just the same if you put in the effort.

You can absolutely fit a 3C lever closer.

Yes its the under drive model with the cabinet. That is something I definitely would like to have on my setup. I will need to look at the ways when I go to see it, but from talking with my co-worker it is in decent working condition. Below is a picture. What kind of tolerances does a machine like this typically hold? Most of what I do at home would be in the +-0.005in range.

You can commonly expect the .001 tolerance on your parts if the machine is in decent shape. Even if your machine is badly worn, if you work at it you can still achieve this tolerance on many parts. On a good machine, That is properly set up and maintained, you can achieve .0005, or better, If you know your machine and work at it. Installing large dials or a DRO helps tremendously at this tolerance.

These are good little machines. They were intended for a small shop, hobbyist, military fieldwork. And although they can and have been used in production work, In today's Shops, there are much better machines for that purpose. A lever style collet closer is available for this machine, You can even get a lover type tailstock, And a lever type cross Slide for production work. please post plenty of pictures of this machine. Give us the serial number, located on the right side of the bed, and we will tell you when it was made. And maybe a little bit about the machine. You can also get a serial number card from South Bend. This will tell you when it was made, Who it was sold to and what accessories it had when it was sold.

Stay safe and have fun.

Joe.

I actually just bought my South Bend 9a about a week ago. After doing extensive research and which small lathe would be the best bang for your buck, this was the one I found personally. Apparently the South Bend 9 is the original, all others were seen as copies. I was also considering a Logan, or Atlas/Craftsman. Apparently the Logan is almost identical, but is slightly larger, yet I could find any real benefits. Although it will be cheaper as it isn't as known of a name. The Atlas/Craftsman if I remember correctly is known for flex in the bed.

The 9 was intended for 3c collets, but they're ridiculously expensive. You can make your own collet chuck or buy them online. I believe people are using the ER40 collets which just needs to have an outer nut tightened and not a draw bar.

promacjoe said:

You can commonly expect the .001 tolerance on your parts if the machine is in decent shape. Even if your machine is badly worn, if you work at it you can still achieve this tolerance on many parts. On a good machine, That is properly set up and maintained, you can achieve .0005, or better, If you know your machine and work at it. Installing large dials or a DRO helps tremendously at this tolerance.

These are good little machines. They were intended for a small shop, hobbyist, military fieldwork. And although they can and have been used in production work, In today's Shops, there are much better machines for that purpose. A lever style collet closer is available for this machine, You can even get a lover type tailstock, And a lever type cross Slide for production work. please post plenty of pictures of this machine. Give us the serial number, located on the right side of the bed, and we will tell you when it was made. And maybe a little bit about the machine. You can also get a serial number card from South Bend. This will tell you when it was made, Who it was sold to and what accessories it had when it was sold.

Stay safe and have fun.

Joe.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the input. The serial number is 46599NKR9

Mirage_88 said:

The 9 was intended for 3c collets, but they're ridiculously expensive. You can make your own collet chuck or buy them online. I believe people are using the ER40 collets which just needs to have an outer nut tightened and not a draw bar.

Click to expand...

I've gotten plenty of nice used 3C's and 1A's for similar money to name brand (Hardinge) used 5C's. For homeshop use, I find the lever operated closer a pain compared to the simple hand wheel type draw tube. If I was making 20 of everything, then yes, the lever closer...

John

PS: Is there a taper attachment mounted on the back of the saddle??? Another nice option to have...

That machine was made in 1960 or 61. The N stands for 9", K stands for quick change gearbox, R stands for regular spindle, The last 9 in the serial number is the revision number. MT3 Spindle center, MT2 tailstock RAM center.


stay safe and have fun.

Joe.

I've got a 10k that is sort of like your situation. About a dozen or 15 years ago I went to the Niles overhead crane auction with the intention of buying a Hardinge. While waiting, bought the "little" what I thought at the time was a 9A because I knew they had resale value. It came with almost all the accessories, chucks, and 1/32" set of collets, too; though handwheel, not lever closer. Then a buddy of mine showed up and was talking about buying the Hardinge. I waited to see if he dropped out, but he did not, so I did not bid. There are a number of Hardinge second ops here in the shop, 2 of which have chase threading.

So, here is my take on the 10K/9a: Far better lathe than I expected, still have it, planed a new longer bed to go under and rescraped it all last year. Still need to replace the cross slide screw. My biggest gripe is the tiny spindle hole. and the 10K at least passes 3/4", or takes up to 5/8" in the rare 6K collets. I use a Jacobs rubber flex chuck on it for larger "small" stuff and can thus use the full 3/4" bar cap or up to 1-3/8" in the collet body. Other than that, the tiny stroke (2") of the TS barrel is a joke, especially when often only 1-3/4" is usable with some tapers in it.

Within those limitations, they are surprisingly nice capable lathes. Due to the small spindle hole, you will probably want a good steady rest for endwork on long larger rounds. "Larger" being anything over 5/8" for your lathe, IIRC. That and the taper attachment get the most use on mine.

I keep threatening to strap it down to the operating table and graft a Hardinge headstock and TS onto it to make a Hard-Bend lathe. The parts are even already saved up in a heavy duty file drawer. But probably will never happen as other projects pile up and age increases.



smt

Don't limit yourself to the 9A only. I actually picked up my 10L for less than similarly equipped 9A's sell for, and its a heavier machine. The 10L uses 5C collets and has a much larger hole through the spindle. I want to say its 1 7/8", but it might be 1 3/4".

10L is 1.375" through spindle

Mirage_88 said:

Apparently the South Bend 9 is the original, all others were seen as copies. I was also considering a Logan, or Atlas/Craftsman. Apparently the Logan is almost identical, but is slightly larger, yet I could find any real benefits. Although it will be cheaper as it isn't as known of a name. The Atlas/Craftsman if I remember correctly is known for flex in the bed.

Click to expand...

I wouldn't call Logan or Atlas copies of a Southbend, although they both made lathes that targeted the same use and price points as the 9a. Logan at least made much larger lathes as well. As to no real benefits to the Logan, one might consider roller bearings in the spindle allowing higher speeds and a company that still supports and sells parts and manuals for their lathes to be an advantage.

Teryk

Love my 9A...

Check the ways for straightness (use a good straight edge), and make sure the spindle play is within spec. Those are the only two big issues with these lathes that makes them a pain to fix. Everything else is minor and easily repaired.

I ended up picking it up. I need to splice the belt back together and then it should be ready to get dialed in. Everything is in good condition and tight on it. The only damage is to the ways below the chuck where it looks to have had a number of abusive removals of the chuck. I'll probably come in a make sure all the high spots are knocked down, but it feels like that has already been done and my coworker said it didn't cut tapers.

Some photos of the rest and damage under the chuck

And thats why laying a chunk of wood on the ways when changing the chuck is a good idea. At least it seems to be on the spots where nothing actually rides. Bit of stoning to take off the high spots and it'll be as good as it needs to be.

I like the drawer organizers. Much better than my method of rooting through the box of bits to find the right one.

Your carriage lock is laying loose in the drawer, and the hole in the saddle is empty.

iwananew10K said:

Your carriage lock is laying loose in the drawer, and the hole in the saddle is empty.

Click to expand...

Good call. I wasn't sure what that was.