Thread: Making a tailstock dauber

Back in the good ol’ days, before ball-bearing live centers came into widespread use, machinists mostly used the solid, or “dead” center for turning stock between centers. Along with this came the need, not only for periodically loosening the tailstock quill as the part expanded from heat, but also for frequent lubrication of the tailstock center. To facilitate the latter chore, South Bend equipped their tailstocks with a little “well” cast right into the side of the tailstock, along with a small, brass dauber. Here is a picture from a 1941 catalog showing a tailstock so equipped (note that SB referred to the dauber as a “quill”):



Though I don’t know for certain, my own educated guess is that they stopped including this accessory some time in the late forties or early fifties. This is based on when the dauber stopped appearing in South Bend ads. However, in keeping with their notorious reluctance to change or modernize their products, South Bend left the “well” in the casting, right up to the bitter end. Perhaps they surmised that some users found the little hole useful for storing a chuck key, or other accessory. At any rate, this has resulted in a situation of many, many more “oil wells” on lathe tailstocks than there are daubers to go with them. No big problem, I guess, since most people use a live center these days.

Nevertheless, I’ve been keen on the idea of having one of the little brass daubers for my lathe, mostly just for looks and the novelty of it. Forget about buying an original one. They command an unreal price on eBay, if you can even find one. The last one I saw brought $76.00 for its lucky owner! So... I thought it would be a nice little project to make my own dauber, in conjunction with my lathe restoration project.

Fellow forum-member, “Waterlogged” was kind enough to supply me with a very good photograph of his original dauber, and I was able to make a dimensioned drawing from his picture. It may not be exact, but it’s more than close enough for the purpose at hand. Here’s the picture that Waterlogged sent me, and the drawing that I made from the picture:





Since the upper cast surface of the “well” is seldom even close to flat, the first step is to counterbore the hole in the tailstock, so that the dauber will have an even surface to seat against. I believe that South Bend probably did this when they were still supplying daubers with their lathes, but eventually only provided the drilled hole, without counterboring. On mine I used a 7/16” dia. counterbore, with a 5/16” dia. pilot:



To make the dauber, I started with a short length of 1/2” dia. 360 brass rod. I turned approximately 1-3/8” of it down to the .39” major O.D. Then I roughed out the ball-handle contour using a combination of lathe cuts and hand filing. The important thing here is to leave the center of the ball at the .39” diameter for now. This will be used for chucking the part to turn the quill end of the dauber. Then you can chuck on the smaller turned boss just above the quill to finish the ball-handle contour. Here’s what it looked like just before cutting the part from the stock piece:



Turning the dauber around, and chucking on the two .39” diameter portions of the ball handle, it’s a fairly quick matter to turn the quill features. For this operation, the compound was set at 3-1/2° from the lathe axis. I ground a generous radius on the tool so I could turn the quill angle, and make the radius in one easy operation. If you want the dauber to fit nicely in its hole, double-check the diameter of the tailstock hole (mine had some taper to it), and turn the .32” boss accordingly.



With the bottom of the dauber finished, I inverted the part in the chuck for final contouring of the ball-handle end with files and sandpaper. After filing, I used progressively finer grits of wet/dry sandpaper, starting with 220 grit, and ending up with 600 grit. (This is overkill, of course, and the original parts were not so highly finished, and probably just had an as-turned finish.) After sanding, I used MicroMesh polishing cloth to achieve a high luster. This was followed by two coats of clear gloss lacquer, on top half only. Here is a view of the finished dauber, by itself:



Here’s how it looks in its new home:



Not a very practical addition to the lathe, but somehow the tailstock looks less “naked” now. A useful turning exercise, if nothing else.

Paula

Very pretty.

Many SB machines from that vintage have
the bosses for that feature unceremoniously
ground off, I think the idea is to make
extra clearance for turning items when the
tailstock center is in use.

The hardinge one is made of steel, and black
oxided. I'm not suprised SB chose brass, the
tiny plugs that go in the belt tensioning handle,
and the top gear handle on their lathes bear
a strong resemblence on top to the item in your
photos, which are likewise made of brass.

Jim

That dauber/quill is really quite beautiful. I remember using one with white lead back in 1957 in high school machine shop in Chicago. We had a tough teacher and I believe all the lathes (South Bend of course)had their daubers. Wonder what happened to all those daubers. Let's see $76 x 24 ..... Bob

Paula, Very nice work as always.

Here's a pic from my archives that includes a ruler and you can use it to roughly check your dimensions if you don't have any better alternative.



I had intended to make one as well but it's pretty far down the priority list. Sounds like there's a business model in there somewhere though. [img]smile.gif[/img]

-Bruce

Paula,
I noticed the two GITS oil cups on top of the headstock that were on "s" series lathes. That may be a nice addition to any tailstock????
wendell

"I noticed the two GITS oil cups on top of the headstock that were on "s" series lathes. That may be a nice addition to any tailstock?"

On my ca. 1945 Logan, there is a Gits Bros. oiler at the rear, for the screw, but a flush-mounted plug at the front, where the spindle key was inserted from the top.

I drove out the plug, bored it to 1/4", and inserted a Gits oiler there, too.

The dauber on a Logan consists of a turned part, ending roughly at the shoulder in the one Paula made, and a standard pin, driven into the dauber body, from there.

Lower manufacturing cost, of course, but just as effective.

"note that SB referred to the dauber as a 'quill'"

Apparently, for lack of a better term, for a relatively cylindrical, functional machine part.

Some manufacturers "overload" the term "quill", and use that term when they mean "spindle".

The terms "ram", "quill" and "spindle" have all been applied to the functional part of a tailstock. Logan and Monarch call this part a "spindle".

I noticed the two GITS oil cups on top of the headstock that were on "s" series lathes. That may be a nice addition to any tailstock?

Indeed. I added a Gits oiler to the center oil hole on my tailstock. It was a simple to do. The oil hole which serves the feed screw bearing is not as easy to adapt, however, because of how it's situated.

Paula

"note that SB referred to the dauber as a 'quill'"

Apparently, for lack of a better term, for a relatively cylindrical, functional machine part.

I think that in this case South Bend used the term in the way that it applies to the tip of a pen which is dipped in an ink well. Like a 'writing quill'.

Some manufacturers "overload" the term "quill", and use that term when they mean "spindle". The terms "ram", "quill" and "spindle" have all been applied to the functional part of a tailstock. Logan and Monarch call this part a "spindle".

I believe I've also heard the term "barrel" used. I prefer the term "ram", and I think of a "quill" as being a special kind of ram which houses a spindle. The term "spindle" has wide application across many disciplines, but in the machine tool idiom, it ought to be confined to a driven, rotating shaft which has been specifically adapted to accommodate a tool or workholding device.

Then there are the terms "lead screw" and "feed screw". I consider a feed screw to be a special type of threaded machine element, designed to impart a controlled, or measured movement to another machine element. A lead screw is a special type of feed screw, specially adapted for producing the "lead" of a threaded part. I wince when I hear someone refer to a lathe's cross-feed screw as a 'lead screw'.

Paula

"I wince when I hear someone refer to a lathe's cross-feed screw as a 'lead screw'."

Especially as, on toolroom quality machines, every effort is made to make the leadscrew as perfect as is possible.

Monarch grinds its leadscrews, and even has a patent on a device which can eliminate any errors which may remain in the leadscrew, after finish grinding.

My wife and I laughed all the way to the bank when the first dauber went for $76. Out of the blue today, it hit me that I have another one.
[IMG]
It was on my milling attachment and has been collecting dust since I sold the attachment a few months ago. The only place I've seen a picture of it is in this photo from the SB catalog.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...lp/dauber7.jpg

You'll obviously notice that it's slotted and doesn't have the tapered shank since it fits into the oiling hole at the top of the screw.

(For some reason the full picture won't load)

I'll start the bidding at $76. LOL

Here is the dauber:



[ 07-07-2007, 06:50 PM: Message edited by: Paula ]

The one with the split bottom isn't a duaber,
it's one of the two plugs that the cast iron
base lathes have.

One goes into the belt tensioning lever pivot
point oil hole, and the other one goes into
the left-center-right upper lever on the single
tumbler gearboxes.

They prevent chips from plugging those oil
holes.

I suspect there's a market for those as well.

Jim

I'm sure "dauber" wasn't the correct terminology. "Plug" would be more accurate. This particular one was from my milling attachment as shown in the picture. Although I haven't checked the dimensions yet, it may provide more accurate numbers for Paula's drawing.

Thanks for posting that picture, Waterlogged! I was thinking about making one of those for my milling attachment, but have never seen what the lower part looks like. Can you post some rough dimensions of the one you have?

Here's a picture of a milling attachment that has one of the brass oil hole plugs:



I've also seen these ball-plugs used on the early tailstocks, for the feed screw oil hole.

Paula

Dang! I made a couple daubers out of steel last year, as a first project for my home-made radius turner.

Now that I see what they look like in yellow metal, I guess I've gotta make a couple from brass or bronze.

As if I don't already have enough projects under way. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Thanks for the drawing, Paula. It's nice not to have to guess.

Paula,

I think you should make a dozen of these and put them on ebay.

Sounds like you free-handed the ball on top? Very nice job.

Paula,
quote:
For this operation, the compound was set at 3-1/2° from the lathe axis.

problem;
Trying to make the dauber, and as I am not a machinist here is what I did. Set the compound to 3-1/2o as you did but I didn't have the success of turning the quill in one operation. There must be something I don't understand, so many things so little time????
wendell

Hi Wendell,

Sorry my description wasn't more clear. Here's a drawing that breaks the process down into ten steps (the red line represents the end of the chuck jaws):



1) Chuck up a piece of 1/2" dia. brass, leaving about 1-3/8" sticking out past the jaws.

2) Turn to .39" dia. by approx. 1.30" long.

3) Rough out the ball contour, leaving the center of the ball section at .39" dia. for the time being.

4) Cut off.

5) Invert the part and re-chuck, leaving enough sticking out to machine the .32" dia. shoulder.

6) Turn to .32" dia. (or as required), and face end to length.

7) Set compound to 3-1/2 degrees. Using a bit with approx. .07" nose radius, turn quill .55" long, until small end is .07" dia.

8) Chamfer shoulder, and radius end of quill (I just used a file).

9) Remove part, invert, and re-chuck. (A collet would be ideal here, if you have one that fits the shoulder dia., since there is not much to grab hold of.)

10) Finish turn and/or file ball contour to size. Sand & polish, if desired.

The reason for turning the ball handle profile in two stages is to provide a solid purchase for the chuck jaws during the quill turning operation. Also, there isn't much of a shoulder to chuck on in step 9, so it helps to have the ball contour roughed out in advance. I'm sure there are different/easier ways to do it on a manual lathe, but this worked pretty well for me. A ball-turning attachment would be nice, especially if making more than one piece. I just eyeballed it with the help of some radius gages.

Good luck!

Paula

Nice layout of the steps for making that
part.

One approach instead of a radius cutter is to
use a form tool. If the ball is about 3/8 inch
diameter, you can purchase a ready-made form tool
for that: a 3/8 inch corner-rounding end mill.

Just install it in place in your toolpost and
set it right on center.

Just out of curiosity, I notice that you seem
to always do your work in the chuck - but never
in a collet, yet your machine has a collet
setup. For a small part like that, the collet
does a terrific job, much faster than a three
jaw when trying to fiddle tiny bits into place.

When I saw the way you broke the steps down for
that part, all I could think of was how fast
I could turn them out on my turret lathe.

Jim