****** south bend clone ******

I am not certain if this belongs in this forum or the antique forum, or perhaps, none at all.

When I first saw this lathe on Kijiji with one bad picture, I thought that it may have been an early South Bend 9, although the headstock looked rather odd. It turns out to be a Canadian made Moody lathe manufactured in Terribone Quebec by the Matthew Moody and Sons co.

It is an awful dirty mess right now, but there is little rust and lots of grease, so I believe that it will clean up just fine.

Here's a few pics....

The former owner and his son in the background and my brother with his head clipped off...















It didn't come with much, but the original drive is present and was removed for the journey. It also came with the change gears, a 4-jaw chuck and a steady rest.

I have already begun dismantling the lathe and have removed the apron, compound rest, cross-slide and saddle. After cleaning the ways with some varsol on a rag, I was pleasantly suprised to see flaking visible everywhere with very little wear near the headstock.

I am having difficulty in removing the compound rest spindle from the slide. I can remove the nut and ball crank as well as the micrometer dial, but that's as far as I can get. Is the "pointer" or zeroing collar behind the micrometer dial integral to the rest or is that pressed in or threaded in ? I realize that this isn't a South Bend, but believe that it may be constructed very similarly. Any of you with a South Bend 9 have any help, it would be appreciated.

Here's a pic of the assembly...



I will post pics of the tear down and clean up as I go along.

Cheers....

Brian

very interesting!

never seen that one mentioned anywhere.

on the SB the collar with the zero mark is threaded into the casting.

Thank you so much. I wondered if it was threaded, but didn't want to mash it up trying before I asked. I'll explore that and let you know if it is the same.

The company was established in 1845 and manufactured a wide variety of machinery , including farming equipment.

With the change in the swing to 11", the saddle, cross slide and top slide castings were increased in thickness - necessary to raise the cutting tool to the correct height - and the idler and leadscrew gears in the changewheel train were both increased in diameter, a change that allowed a finer rate of carriage feed. (quoted from Lathes UK ).

Although, this is clearly a South Bend clone, there are some marked differences between the two. In addition to the increase in swing and the spindle hole diameter, the bed feet are longer and more massive. As well, the headstock front is closed in and the spindle runs on roller bearings. This particular lathe has had grease nipples installed for the roller bearings.

Would roller bearings require oil or grease in this case ?

I really like the "Fleur-de-lis" design in the gear cover, clearly indicating a French origin....



I realize that this is a rather small lathe, but it begs exploration to determine an approximate date of manufacture. So far, my searching has come up with very little information.

Thanks for looking...

Brian

We are always interested in any of the South Bend lathe or the copies that are out there. It is very interesting to find out how many Companies copied South Bend lathe. It is a tribute to the Machine.

That company is not listed, or at least not under that name At the "Lathes.co.uk" Website. Email Lathes.co.uk. I'm sure he would be interested in any information and pictures that you can provide him.

Keep us up-to-date on the restoration of your machine.

Stay safe and have fun.

Joe.

Hello Joe,

Thank you for your interest. All of these companies were trying to get a "piece of the pie" that South Bend had very cleverly established.

This company "is" actually listed at "Lathes.co.uk.". If you go to the archives and click on "Moody", you will get an error. If you google "Moody lathe" and then find the link to "Lathes.co.uk" it should get you to the single page with pics of another machine the same as mine.

I have emailed Tony to let him know that I have aquired this lathe. He has yet to respond to me, but I will gladly pass along any info and pics to him. As well, I will post pics of the teardown and post any anecdotal information as I go along.

Again, I ask, would roller bearings for the spindle be lubricated with oil or grease ?

Cheers...

Brian

my guess would be oil given it`s age.probably originally had oil cups like the countershaft does- just a guess though.

my lathes with roller bearings are oil lubricated... but depends on the bearing i guess. lots of guessing!

any plates with an indication of the speed ranges?

I was thinking the same, as far as oiling the bearings. I haven't seen any additional plates with info, other than the one on the headstock with the company name and starting date of business.

I have been working pretty much 7 days a week and 12 hours a day for some time now, so I haven't had much time to go further in looking at the lathe since yesterday. I do see a window opening up soon and am very much looking forward to getting back to it.

Cheers...

Brian

I had another look at the lathe this morning and can see that there is no keyway in the leadscrew and no provision in the apron for either longitudal or cross feeds. Is this how some of the early South Bend 9's were set up ? I suppose that in the early models, these things would be considered options that you chose and paid more for.

Here's a few pics of the ways and the frosting... not great pics, but I think that they show up ok... better in person ...









Well, I'd better get myself off to work.

Cheers...

Brian

There is a member on the yahoo southbendlathe group with one of these- we recently talked quite a bit about the gears and headstock on his. General consensus seems to be to use tha thin teflon based grease in the headstock, since that is what is speced for other tapered roller bearing machines like small milling machines. However, greases of different types really don't like to mix, so you need to clean out what is in there first.

allan

Hello Allan,

Thanks very much for that tip. I am a member there and may go see if this chap has any pics or threads to peruse. I will certainly and thoroughly tear this lathe down to the last nut and bolt, clean, oil/ grease/ re-paint and put it back together. It's a joy to work on a machine that is small and the parts are relatively light and not so complex, compared to some of the other machines that I have worked on.

Cheers...

Brian

iwananew10K said:

very interesting!

never seen that one mentioned anywhere.

on the SB the collar with the zero mark is threaded into the casting.

Click to expand...

Thanks... It was, indeed, threaded in. There wasn't a hole for a pin wrench but I managed to free it up without too much effort.



Brian

Hello all,

I had a couple of hours this afternoon of playing in the shop and got back to further dismantling the lathe. Before I began, I had a closer look at a decal on one of the legs that I had noticed when I went to look at the lathe. It is circular in shape with "MOODY " straight across the center. At the top it says the full name of the company and location. The bottom section states.... " Better In 1845.... Still Better Today " ...

Stylistically, this lathe appears to be old, but when you look at the font on the threading chart, it doesn't appear to indicate great age. I'm guessing not older than the 1940's or so. My point is, it looks like Moody was making a direct stab at South Bend to try to gain a foothold in SB's market. Maybe I'm reading too much into the slogan, but I find it interesting, nonetheless.





With the scarcity of information and examples of this lathe, they obviously didn't succeed, but it looks like they made a pretty decent little lathe. It would be interesting to find out if they made larger lathes as well.

Here's a pic of the faded and dirty decal...



Cheers....

Brian

A google search led me to some links. hope these might help.

http://www.lathes.co.uk/southbend9-inch/page3.html

http://www.lathes.co.uk/southbend9-inch

Hello Spyder,

Thanks for the links.... Tony's site is a wealth of information. I actually looked at those pages before going to look at the lathe.

Here's a little more progress...

I found the serial# stamped at the rear of the bed between the v-ways which corresponds to the tag's serial#.

Sorry for the blurry pic...



I had some difficulty in getting at the bolt for the headstock at the chuck side, so I ended up removing the foot to enable me to remove the headstock. My first lift was a bit sketchy and it wanted to turn turtle, so I passed a rope through the spindle and that helped immensely.









Once the headstock and feet were off, I then could remove the rack. The headstock traps one of the rack bolts...



Thanks for looking...

Brian

Project is looking good, I'd like to see updates as you progress.
Good luck!

Looks like there's a Morse Taper 3 adapter sleeve in the spindle. I wonder what the actual spindle taper is?

That label can be replicated with some work. Find someone skilled in Photoshop or another graphics program like The GIMP. Get as high a resolution shot as you can, as straight on as you can. Take shots with and without a ruler held against/next to the label.

Then the photos can be used as a guide to rebuild the design from scratch to the original size. I did that with the POWR-KRAFT lable for my 1940 Montgomery Ward lathe.



That's printed with a HP Color LaserJet 2500 onto Papilio self adhesive, white polyester film. Stuck one on the headstock where the original was and one on the apron simply because it was so big and empty with it being the cheap no power feed model. Then for extra fun I ran one off large on a sheet of paper, spray glued it to the end of the bench then sprayed it with clear lacquer.

Hello Galane,

Yes, there is an adapter sleeve in the spindle. I have to make up a ram with a brass end to try and punch it out. I have some taper adapters that I'll try once I get it out to determine if it's a true morse taper or not.

I really like the idea of making a new label. It's a bit out of my league at the moment, but I'll give it a try.

Cheers...

Brian

Spyderedge said:

Project is looking good, I'd like to see updates as you progress.
Good luck!

Click to expand...

Hello Spyder,

It's looking like I'll have the whole weekend off for a change and maybe even most of Friday... that means shop time, so I'm sure that I'll have some pics to post.

Brian

Getting new decals can be a challenge - here's the best I could do on a belt/disk sander - before and after pics. Looked OK on the machine.

Alchymist said:

Getting new decals can be a challenge - here's the best I could do on a belt/disk sander - before and after pics. Looked OK on the machine.

Click to expand...

I'm impressed... !!! It looks great and still looks old at the same time.

Brian