South Bend No. 2-H Turret Lathe 16"x6' Restoration - Page 6
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  1. #101
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    Got the NOS crossfeed screw in. As stated above I went with my original dial and hand wheel. Prior to getting the NOS crossfeed assembly, which also came with new crossfeed nut, I had purchased a set off ebay that had both crossfeed nut and compound rest nut. Well when going to install the compound, I would have needed a shim to keep the cross feed from binding. I had a shim, but it was too fat. Tried my other new nut, and was able to tighten the oil screw and run the compound back and forth with no binding, and no shim.

    I also tightened nut on handwheel, to remove free play on the opposing bearings. I tightened it enough to just begin feeling like a preload on bearings, but without impeding how well it spun. Going tighter created too much drag. Oil feed through the top of saddle to this part of assembly for the bearings and such is clear.

    I have three options for compound. The original, with t slots and use the turret style tool post, a normal toolroom type compound with latern tool post from ebay, and a whole taper attachment assembly I have been considering stealing from my other machine. In thinking about it, I went original first. One I could get it ready quicker, two, I'm thinking most of my use is going to be straight ahead. I'll come back to this in another thread and post link here:

    Anyway went original for now. There's cross drilled holes from oil plug for crossfeed threads, these drilled holes allow oil on both sides of the track between saddle and compound. They were packed with chit. Got em cleaned out so oil flows now. The gib is a little different on this vs the toolroom type I have. The toolroom type has a single adjuster, facing dial I believe. The original turret compound gib has a series of set screws facing tail stock side, like 9 of them. And the gib has little counter sunk holes for each set screw to fit into. Sorry forgot a pic of that.

    With gib snugged, and everything oiled, compound is tight but rolls like butter back and forth on saddle. With new crossfeed screw and nut, no end play on threads.

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  2. #102
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    Next worked on the turret tool post. It was stuck like a son of gun, and pretty difficult to get a part. Spent more time than I figured getting it cleaned up, but surprisingly the parts are in really good shape. As with most of this, cleaned and lubed it operates well, and as it should.

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  4. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasgunsmith View Post

    I have three options for compound. The original, with t slots and use the turret style tool post, a normal toolroom type compound with latern tool post from ebay, and a whole taper attachment assembly I have been considering stealing from my other machine. In thinking about it, I went original first. One I could get it ready quicker, two, I'm thinking most of my use is going to be straight ahead. I'll come back to this in another thread and post link here:
    For some reason I can't edit that post. So I'll link it here:
    Which compound/toolpost setup, advantages & disadvantages

  5. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasgunsmith View Post
    For some reason I can't edit that post. So I'll link it here:
    Which compound/toolpost setup, advantages & disadvantages
    FYI, posts can only be edited for about 2 days.

  6. #105
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    Before I put main lead screw in I wanted to get a few things squared away. One was the end thrust in tailstock apron wormgear. If you are familiar with the regular apron on these, the thrust is control by bushings and threaded nuts.

    On the tail stock apron it is similar principle, but is controlled by one piece bronze caps that bolt on externally. It appears that the cap facing the other apron takes the majority of thrust.

    To reduce the end thrust I trimmed the flange of that particular cap. One of the reasons I trimmed that cap is that if future adjustments are needed, I will do the other cap, as I only need to drop lead screw end bearing off to get it. While the one I did trim would need lead screw out to access it.

    So I took my first cuts with this lathe without the main lead screw in. I just locked the carriage down and turned crossfeed by hand to get it done. I took off just a little more than .050". I left about .005 end thrust for oil clearance.

    Forgot to get pics of it, but I deepened the oil relief trenches as well on thrust side. I also cross drilled through the front face to one of the oil reliefs and tapped a set screw, so I could shoot oil in there externally prior to operation.

    Another thing I wanted to address was the gear lash from main apron to rack that's mounted to bottom of bed. I had more free play in hand wheel than I liked. I lossened the rack and used feeler blades to get an estimate of what I needed. I dropped rack out and made up a shim from 22 or 24 gauge sheet metal that was .025".

    The metal muncher at my work to cut sheet metal isn't big enough to cut the 40 inches of length that the rack is, plus the material I had on hand was only 18" long, so I have a gap between the two shim pieces. But all the screw holes are supported so it wont distort. Got it mounted back up and made quite a difference. I have a little free play in hand wheel, and a little bit of gear lash as well, but it's considerably improved.

    I played around with going a little tighter, but I could end up with tight spots when running apron back and forth if gear lash was removed.

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  7. #106
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    Got the main lead screw in and some other odds and ends. I have more or less full operation now. I feel like a kid in a toy store, just running the power feed, carriage, and cross feed back and forth, haha.

    I still have a ton of minor things to square away and go thru, like all the collet attachment parts, micrometer stop, 4 jaw chucks, steady rest and the list goes on and on. . . but with this up and running I'm going to address those things as I need them and time allows. I have a couple of grinders and a milling machine I'd like to get up and running, so I plan on dumping a bunch of time in those areas for a bit.

    I did get a test bar from Miller Machine and Fabrication to fit the spindle taper. Supposed to be a special South Bend taper. Their website:
    Products – Miller Machine and Fabrication
    I found them from this website, under one of the South Bend stickys here:
    South Bend Links: Sources for Parts, Info, etc.

    I also got a regular mt3 test bar for the tail stock end from another outfit off ebay. I plan on checking run out, and do my best to get dialed in and everything pointed at center.

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  8. #107
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    Started working on getting the machine dialed in a bit and tail stock point towards center. Much of the machine was stuck, frozen, and generally gritty when I got it. So I didn't spend too much time checking it prior to tear down. Figured I'd get it clean and operating smooth and take it from there. I did do kind of a half assed check of runout from the back plate of chuck prior to teardown, which if memory recalls, i'm thinking was about .0005 at the time. And I'm thinking I measured about .0005 to .001 on spindle end thrust as well up and down on chuck side of spindle.

    Fast forward to now and using the spindle taper test bar:

    Aside from the taper, the test portion of test bar is 12" long.

    The good news: I initially stick the test bar in. At the closest test portion to spindle threads I roll a zero using a .0001 dial indicator. I mean ZERO. It was so good, i had to stop and check my indicator, I thought the indicator was stuck or not contacting. Holy Shit ! I have the indicator mounted on compound. I roll apron down so i'm indicating off the far end of test bar, 12" away. I roll spindle and can just barely see needle move on indicator line, I'm going to say maybe .00002", wow! I roll apron back and forth easily half a dozen times and duplicate the results every time.

    The bad news: After checking and setting end thrust on spindle, removing test bar for the night, then reinstalling later, I have not been able to duplicate the above results. Now I read about half a 1/10,000, or .00005 close to spindle threads, and about .001 at 12" away.

    At first my readings were kind of inconsistent and needle was kind of jumpy. I cleaned spindle and test bar tapers multiple times. Handled everything gently. Tried putting end thrust back to where it was. Now the needle is steady and more consistent, but I'm still coming up with .00005" at spindle threads, and .001" at 12" out.

    While in the midst of that. In doing other checks I have about .0015 up and down on chuck side of spindle. This has been very consistent. I played with removing, changing shims previously on that side's cap, but I get too much drag when going tighter. As it is, I can run the machine and both caps and saddles stay cool and roll nice, so I'm going to stick with that for now. The bearings are babbitt.

    I did find a cause in some of my inconsistencies. It was in the spindle end thrust. First I think I was actually thrusting in one direction off the chip guard that pushes onto the threaded end of spindle, So that chip guard was thrusting off that side's saddle. I got it moved off and added a little clearance. Next a shim for the other spindle cap must have moved slightly during cap installation. A small piece was sticking out on thrust washer side, and contacting the critical surface of thrust washer. I took care of that and set thrust. I have thrust at about .0005" to .0008".

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  9. #108
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    Getting it dialed in pretty close took a bit more time than I expected. When I originally tore the machine down there were shims under the headstock, its a little hard to see, but I got a pic of it.

    One concern I've had is that maybe the tail stock center would be lower than the head stock, especially as the turret tail stock has multiple moving parts that will affect height as they wear. But knowing I had shims in there previously I was hoping it might work out.

    When I put the head stock back on I also put back most of the shims, a couple of them were kind of deteriorated so I left those out, and figured I see where I was. As it turns out the tail stock was high !

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  10. #109
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    Getting it relatively close was fairly easy, but getting it dialed in real close was quite time consuming. I added shims to head stock on spindle thread end. This got me close to center, plus had the side effect of improving my readings running along the ways.

    I had to keep making minor adjustments to get readings at 12 oclock, 3 oclock, and 9 oclock, as well as my height to tail stock closer. One adjustment inevitably would affect the others. . .

    In the end I have about .030 to .035" worth of shims under head stock at the chuck side, and about .004 to .005" of shims under head stock at gear end.

    Spindle test bar is 12" long. My .0001 dial indicator was being a pain in the ass, so I switched to what is my most reliable .001" dial indicator.
    My results with .001" dial indicator are like this:
    .0003 - .0005" runout close to spindle threads.
    .002 - .003" runout at 12" out, the far end of test bar.

    Setting indicator at zero while mounted on compound, close to spindle threads, I run the saddle the length of test bar from three positions, 12 o'clock, 3 o'clock, and 9 o'clock. Taking runout into consideration, and averaging where I'm at, running the full length of 12", I look like this at the far end of test bar:
    3 o'clock: +.0005"
    9 o'clock: -.0005"
    12 oclock: -.001" (saddle rising on ways)

    Installing an mt3 test bar on tail stock and running the saddle the rest of the ways (lol pun), I rise on ways about another .001" So totally between centers I rise about .002".

    Whether running the saddle back and forth or rolling spindle, my indicator returns to zero, so I feel pretty good that the number are reading pretty correct.

    Using a couple of dead centers I checked the indexing of all 6 positions on turret. They are all locking in pretty much spot on to each other, maybe .001 or .002" difference. You can see in the pics the dead center is lined up and entering spindle test bar nicely, which I can repeat with all 6 positions of turret. I have the same result with turret extended or retracted.

    Anyway I'm pretty happy with these results. I plan on using the machine as it is for now. I'd like to get the 3 and 9 oclock readings to zero at some point, instead of a plus and minus, but I think I'm well within what I need atm. As I get other projects and other machines finished I may see what I can do to tighten it up further but for now I couldn't be happier.

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