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More on the Gerstner box..... what makes a Gerstner a Gerstner?

elkhunter

Plastic
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Nov 10, 2007
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O.K. I have been following the threads on GI and have to say I saw one at woodcraft and was a bit disappointed by the quality. Something did not look right and then it hit me... BAM... I COULD HAVE HAD A V-8 COCKTAIL DRINK. The name plate said Gerstner International and not Gernstner & Sons. I immediately thought of General and General International and I lit on out of there.

So what makes a Gerstner a Gernstner? Are they really worth the price and are they all that?

First I have say that I am a bit concerned about the designs. The originals were often quartersawn white oak which is good for the design. The sides are solid timber and QSWO expands in the thickness plane and not the width plane. The top is T&Ged to the main box and this would be a major issue with other flat sawn timbers and hummid environs.

Then I have a question about the backs. Are these solid wood or some kind of veener over MDF/Ply/etc.? Again, solid flat sawn timber could be a problem in terms of expansion in this area.

Next on my question list are the drawers. What type of joinery did they use in making the drawers? I have reason to believe that they are using a table saw/rebate/groove joint here. Or are the drawers held together with either dovetail joinery or finger joinery?

I would really like to know how the original Gerstner boxes were assembled.
 
elk, you ask many questions...

The early Gerstners had finger jointing for the sides, top and back.

Later Gerstners used rebates (rabbetts) for box construction.

RE: Drawers; a rebated glue joint or just a flat rebate depending on vintage. Very early Gerstners had dovetails. Drawer bottoms (like WW II vintage chests had metal bottoms.

Gerstner uses a bunch of veneer quartersawn on the backs, and the tops, too. Sides are solid quartersawn stock.

The original ones (a century ago) looked a lot different from any recent vintage. The common box #41 was derived from Gerstner's century-old design simplifying the construction.

Hope this helps...

Joe
 
I would really like to know how the original Gerstner boxes were assembled.
As an ex woodworker I can tell you a Gerstner tool box is a complete yawner compared to proper furniture and other more complex projects. But if you insist on duplicating the work of the little Gerstner Elves, just buy a used one on eBay and all will reveal itself for said duplication. Then when finished with your creation, sell it on eBay for what you paid...or more.
 
"Gerstner Elves..." :D :D

Milacron is right, for sure. Replication of such a chest, is not tremendously difficult--h*lluva lot simpler that an 18th century 'tall boy' chest of drawers.

I used red oak for mine--and the back and top were red oak veneered ply. Would I do it again...ummm...prolly not, but I enjoyed (grrr) doing it.

Joe
 
Yes this helps. Toolchests can take on a lot of weight so I have wondered about the construction details. It would be nice if someone with a vintage Gerstner could post detailed photos of the construction details. Yes I could buy one but where is the fun in that. I am currently finishing a set of kitchen cabs and I actually made the drawers from solid maple and hand cut the dovetails. Hand cutting of tails is actually not that complex. So doing baby pins on the gerstner drawers actually makes more sense than just slappin it together with a nail gun and some bubble gum in a rabate. Thanks for any further intel on the subject.
 
yea, I was kind of suprised as well.

An older fellow at work has one, it's nice , but nothing special. An ok home woodworker with some decent tools could do it.

What I like about the old ones at least, is the old school look. In kind of the same way older machine tools look.

Same reason I bought a Kennedy top box, nothing special at all, but kind of cool.
 
It would be nice if someone with a vintage Gerstner could post detailed photos of the construction details. Yes I could buy one but where is the fun in that.
In other words you're too lazy or cheap to buy one and figure it out yourself and want someone else to hand you some drawings on a silver platter ?

You could probably find an ugly one cheap and restore it while getting dimensions and design technique info, and then sell it for a profit, all the while having the "fun" you seek ;)
 
It would be nice if someone with a vintage Gerstner could post detailed photos of the construction details. Yes I could buy one but where is the fun in that.
If I posted detailed photos and/or drawings of Gerstner's products so guys could knock them off without supporting Gerstner, wouldn't I basically be doing the same thing that makes us so mad when done by our overseas friends?

Not to be a smartass, but why not build one of your own design? Maybe bigger, or with different size drawers, or use fancier joints, or something? Then it would truely be your creation and not a knock off.
 
Not to be a smartass, but why not build one of your own design? Maybe bigger, or with different size drawers, or use fancier joints, or something? Then it would truely be your creation and not a knock off.
Yep, might spur a new business since their "everyone knows" about the super profit potential in these things ;)

Folks be on the lookout for the new "Elkhunter" line of boxes coming to a tools store near you ! ;)
 
I don't get why drawing one's own plans is so complicated.Gerstners do not have outstanding joinery in them to begin with. They do not use dovetail joints. They use what used to be called "cash register" joints on the front corners of the drawers,ultimately relying upon glue and maybe a few nails to hold them together.
 
"First I have say that I am a bit concerned about the designs"

Therein lies a great opportunity to improve upon it.

I would say that one of the "core" features in my thinking is the use of quartersawn oak. I've seen the walnut box up close and personal and while I feel that walnut is a superior and rarer species of wood, it just doesn't evoke the same: I want one of those! feelings. (I have never seen the American Cherry version up close for any comparison).

I've also seen so many Gerstners that spent their entire lives hiding under the brown zippered vinyl "wrapper", which I refuse to do because I like to look at it. If the shop's too nasty or I can't take proper care of it without damaging it, it prolly needs to go somewhere else.
 
The Gerstner boxes are beautiful, but mass produced. I would think a skilled woodworker (that's not me, but someone like Milacron or Stephen Thomas comes to mind) could design and build a wooden toolbox that would blow everyone's minds! I'm not talking one to sell, but an "ultimate" wooden box to keep your whole life and pass along to kids or grandkids.

I guess if I was inclined to build a wooden box (and skilled enough), this would be my goal, and not to build a Gerstner copy to avoid paying Gerstner anything.
 
I'd mentioned earlier that Gerstner uses rabbets for their drawer fronts and indeed they are glued--nope, not incredible joinery, for sure. Gerstner drawers were not designed to support intense mass--and besides, the drawers for the most part are to small anyway (save either the master or journeyman chests, and even then the drawers are not really large--obviously designed for calipers, guages and such.

A rabetted 'cash register' design I would think for low mass drawers as the Gerstner drawers are, is acceptable--dovetailing of such drawers fell out of favor because of labor--and the glued rabbet just made sense--

Yep, quartersawn oak is beautiful. But since there's less and less old growth white oak, the quartersawn I've witnessed during the last 10 years or so, has not offered that gorgeous appearance seen in older Gerstners--course this could only be me...

Violin makers have been attempting to replicate the mastery of a Stradivarius--hasn't occurred--reason is simple--no one knows--lot's of speculations, though.

I made a Gerstner replicate--I like it--but since I have come to the conclusion chest and tool boxes ideally should be designed and built based upon need.

Union Tool Chest and Gerstner (and a host of other makers) duked it out for a long time--and I would think that such tool chests were marques for the trinity of apprenticeship, journeyman and master users--

There are a bunch of tool chest Gerstner replicators--but Gerstner's original competitors or predecessors are for the most part gone--

But, I've a beautiful US Navy gray chest with his last name and carrier control number (strangely enough,#52; I was born in 52, 11 years after he did that chest!)--the marque left by my dad--he built that chest from old growth southern yellow pine--and to me, that apprenticeship chest--all dressed in flat Navy gray, is more beautiful and functional than either my Gerstner or Union...

And when I cleaned his Sargent circular plane--white oak shavings were just behind the lever cap--left there from dad as he was master ship's joiner on the last two wooden hulled minesweepers at Norfolk Naval Shipyard (NNSY) in 1951-1953.

Joe
 
There is darned little quartered white oak on any Gerstner made in quite a few years. I really think they could do better on that score,for what they charge. There is FLAKING on real quartered oak. Your'e lucky to see it even on one drawer front. When you consider that a Gerstner costs more than much larger furniture for a house does, I can't see paying that kind of money. I'll post pics of mine if I ever get it done,so you guys can see what quartered white oak should look like. Quartered white oak isn't that high priced compared to a lot of other woods.
 
gw, I think you should present The Queen with a toolchest make of Bubinga or East Indian Rosewood with Carpathian Elm Burl accents. Something to hold Crown Jewel repair kits and such you know. May need to sub out the drawer dovetailing to Rivett !
 
Elk hunter,the quartering has nearly nothing to do with the wood not expanding with the length of the grain. An average figure is that wood expands about 16 times more across the grain than with the grain. Wood does move some in all directions,and there is nothing that can be used effectively to prevent it. Finishes just slow it down some. That's why drawers shouldn't be fitted too closely. Unless you keep the chest in controlled conditions,it's going to move.
 
Should be after 75 years! BTW, the flaking in quartered oak ONLY appears if the oak is perfectly vertical grain. A LITTLE off,and no flaking.
 
Don,I wouldn't stoop to using East indian Rosewood OR Bubinga. I have over 1000 lbs of Brazilian rosewood cut in 1960. Bubinga looks too boring.I have 100 year old curly mahogany,Cuban mahogany,Santo Domingo 100 year old mahogany. Could go on,but as you can see,I am a complete wood snob. I have one 16" wide mahogany plank that looks like peacock tail marbled paper. The co. that sold it to me were trying to find out where the rest of the log went,as they had never seen that figure before.I need to figure out what to do with it before I croak with all the wood I've pigged over my lifetime. :D
 








 
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