Looking at a 1930s Bridgeport -- am I crazy?

[shaggy]

I have a 1954 J-head and I love mine. I never need to hog metal so that's not an issue for me.
Easy to move by yourself disassembled with an engine hoist.
What's the serial number on "your" mill?

Hi -- I'll find out if I can, just to go with the pics, and for the record.

The only way I can see this machine being useful to me is with a J-head transplant or somesuch, and I'm still too ignorant to know if that would be easy or even worthwhile.

 

[shaggy]

That's nice work, Don.

BTW, what is the story with the head on that old BP of yours?

 

[thermite]

Hi -- I'll find out if I can, just to go with the pics, and for the record.

The only way I can see this machine being useful to me is with a J-head transplant or somesuch, and I'm still too ignorant to know if that would be easy or even worthwhile.

Dovetail-ram J-head transplant onto a round-ram M-head?

Not hard.

CO of the unit next door in 'nam finally got pissed-off at the junker of an M-151 jeep he was cursed with, told his FSGT to "fix that!"

Driver had a "custom" red shift knob on it instead of the GI issue one.

Jeep was fixed overnight.

They had unscrewed that red shift knob.

Ran a brand-new jeep UNDER it.

Screwed the shift knob back on.

You use the vise instead of a red shift knob when you run a J-head under what usta-bee an M-head.

That easy!

NB: "Bird" power of the J-series replaces "Bee" power of the M-series, that round ram becomes a karussel axle.

That's why Bridgeport abandoned it theyselves, after all.

 

[rons]

On the other hand, 'they don't make 'em like this anymore'(pretty much my motto!)

That's the thing. If the owner thinks he has a antique and it's worth a bunch then you will have to pay more.
Pay more if you think you will want a antique and cherish owning it. Price, it's about what a used 60's BP J head is worth.

 

[shaggy]

No, I don't collect antiques or museum pieces, and this one looks a bit too much like that.

50s is my own vintage, so obviously ideal

Maybe I could consider it as a basis for an upgrade, if the price was to come down a substantial amount. But the rest of the machine might've had it's day. I'll keep looking. I mentioned my limited space hereabouts -- so the short table is a plus, believe it or not. Medium-sized solid-built mills are hard to find.

So the search is on -- I've cleared out the back of my truck, laid down some hardwood boards, and threw in the ropes, canvas tarps and moving blankets. Brought back some good memories!

 

[thermite]

Maybe I could consider it as a basis for an upgrade,

Maybe I could upgrade a Bic lighter to an Oxygen lance and slice through four foot of solid steel at go as well?

Jack? Did you PAY that old wizard for those giant beanstock seeds?

 

[shaggy]

Maybe I could upgrade a Bic lighter to an Oxygen lance and slice through four foot of solid steel at go as well?

Jack? Did you PAY that old wizard for those giant beanstock seeds?

haha --okay, thanks for the verbal cattle prod guess I still need it

 

[thermite]

haha --okay, thanks for the verbal cattle prod guess I still need it

PM has been TELLING you your were crazy. That a round-ram was the sort of Bee Pee it is best to run, not walk, away from.

BRIDGEPORT abandoned them, didn't they?

What do you know that Bridgeport did NOT know when they went-over to dovetailed ram and walked-away from MT spindle as well?

 

[shaggy]

PM has been TELLING you your were crazy. That a round-ram was the sort of Bee Pee it is best to run, not walk, away from.

BRIDGEPORT abandoned them, didn't they?

What do you know that Bridgeport did NOT know when they went-over to dovetailed ram and walked-away from MT spindle as well?

haha -- well, Bridgeport also probably does/did not know or care about how little is in my bank account,
-- nor expect that anyone would still (in 2020) be interested in buying and selling used 1960s and 70s BPs!

A mere $4000 (plus hauling) will get me this (see below). Better?

 

[thermite]

haha -- well, Bridgeport also probably does/did not know or care about how little is in my bank account,
-- nor expect that anyone would still be interested in buying and selling manual 1960s and 70s BPs!

If yer actually IN Oakland, Kalifornikyah SSR, wotever is in it now is at-risk of severe dimunition, next months and years.

Pretty-boy Governator is expecting he only has to hang-on 'til early January of 2021 'til the looter-lie-bore-alls take back the Senate and Whitehouse so he can get Federal bailouts voted to him.

Kali is f**ked if even ONE of those fails to happen.

Smarter paupers have already bailed ahead of the rush.

 

[M.B. Naegle]

I've used a round ram BP, a few dovetail ram J-heads, and a couple 2J head's. Each is better than the other in that order, but each can make parts just as well as the other as long as you understand the machines limitations. M heads get up to 1/2 HP and 1/2" collets and they work beautifully in that range.

The round ram slipping out of tram is another issue, but from my experience it has more to do with dull cutters, un-rigid set-ups, and miss-judged feed/speed rates, than some inherent flaw in the machine. IMO, Bridgeport came out with each later model because they were improvements over the last, not because their previous machines had problems.

IMO a machine on your floor is worth 20 in your dreams. There will always be a part that's too long, or a cut that takes too many passes. When you're in the market, you get the best you can for your needs and you become as familiar with its capabilities and limitations as possible.

 

[shaggy]

If yer actually IN Oakland, Kalifornikyah SSR, wotever is in it now is at-risk of severe dimunition, next months and years.

Pretty-boy Governator is expecting he only has to hang-on 'til early January of 2021 'til the looter-lie-bore-alls take back the Senate and Whitehouse so he can get Federal bailouts voted to him.

Kali is f**ked if even ONE of those fails to happen.

Smarter paupers have already bailed ahead of the rush.

I can only agree. (Smarter paupers also aren't looking to be hobbled by 2000 lb cast-iron albatrosses around their necks!)

 

[thermite]

The round ram slipping out of tram is another issue, but from my experience it has more to do with dull cutters, un-rigid set-ups, and miss-judged feed/speed rates,

He should be good to go then.

God looking out for drunks, fools, and virgin Bee Pee operators as she does so well, NONE of those things could ever possibly happen to a novice.

Only the most expert of grizzled veteran mill hands get caught-out by those issues, yah?


PS: "rigid set-up"? On a Bee Pee?

I think I can tell a greater lie: "I believe it can be done!"

 

[shaggy]

I've used a round ram BP, a few dovetail ram J-heads, and a couple 2J head's. Each is better than the other in that order, but each can make parts just as well as the other as long as you understand the machines limitations. M heads get up to 1/2 HP and 1/2" collets and they work beautifully in that range.

The round ram slipping out of tram is another issue, but from my experience it has more to do with dull cutters, un-rigid set-ups, and miss-judged feed/speed rates, than some inherent flaw in the machine. IMO, Bridgeport came out with each later model because they were improvements over the last, not because their previous machines had problems.

IMO a machine on your floor is worth 20 in your dreams. There will always be a part that's too long, or a cut that takes too many passes. When you're in the market, you get the best you can for your needs and you become as familiar with its capabilities and limitations as possible.

Absolutely! Dreams are nice, but only useful (perhaps) to get one up in the morning. Improvisation is the name of the game. If I'm not improvising, I'm probably not earning my pay. It's been said a good job can be done with inferior tools, and though it goes against the grain, it's true and I prove it every day (yes, by having to improvise), but you need to KNOW your 'inferior' tools, and be very very good, period. ALL tools will come up against their limit, and the workman has to take it from there, if they can.

 

[pat pounden]

Absolutely! Dreams are nice, but only useful (perhaps) to get one up in the morning. Improvisation is the name of the game. If I'm not improvising, I'm probably not earning my pay. It's been said a good job can be done with inferior tools, and though it goes against the grain, it's true and I prove it every day (yes, by having to improvise), but you need to KNOW your 'inferior' tools, and be very very good, period. ALL tools will come up against their limit, and the workman has to take it from there, if they can.

have you ck'd aragon's yard in san leandro-he'll have something in your $ range...

 

[shaggy]

Thanks, yeah I've been meaning to go down there and take a look, maybe when I've got a little more $$$ to bargain with. I think that might be one of his BPs I posted above?

 

[spaeth]

Shaggy,
I have Bridgeport Serial No.1874.(1943) M head Round Ram and Short table. As has been said for using smaller cutters it works very well. The table movements are the same as the J head dovetail ram models. All those parts are readily available.The only part I can not find for the head is the clock spring. For many jobs I prefer this one over the later one which I also have. The M head quill has a nice feel especially for small drills. Mine has machined a lot of accurate parts and is satisfying to operate. Even though there is no power down feed the hand wheel has a nice ratio and easily produces smooth bores. Yes it's not a big horse but sure is a fine pony. No matter which machine you choose, having good tooling and work holding stuff is very important.
spaeth

 

[shaggy]

That's a fine looking machine, spaeth. I'd be proud to own it.

I have tons of of excellent tooling; blocks, gauges, setup stuff, T&M. I've been a mechanic since 1969 and a machinist of sorts -- though certainly no journeyman or toolmaker -- almost as long, and need little excuse to add new cutters etc to the collection. Though late to milling machines, I've had several smaller mills a long time now, and in the distant past worked as operator on a few big 'uns as well.

Actually owning any of the big stuff is another matter (and in that vein, I suppose some wise words might be, 'be careful what you wish for'(!)

 

[CJD]

Even after all said, I still like old iron for hobby milling. As long as the price is right and you understand it is limited. My BP has 2 horses with mist cooling, and I find everything I mill is temperature limited, rather than rigidity or power limited. But then, I am a hobby machinist and not working fast to make a dollar.

I still think $2k is too much, though. I got my 1970's vintage CNC BP 6 months ago for $1500, including servo motors that would sell for more than the mill. It's best to decide what you want to do, which machine will do it...and then be patient. With CNC being the new "thing", the manual BP's are not going up in price like they were 10 years ago. There is no hurry finding "your" machine. It will turn up.

 

[shaggy]

I have a 1954 J-head and I love mine. I never need to hog metal so that's not an issue for me.
Easy to move by yourself disassembled with an engine hoist.
What's the serial number on "your" mill?

Thanks -- I just got word this morning the Ser. No. is 100024.

I think that's 1938. And, could it be, the 24th BP ever made(?) yikes