Surfcam vs Mastercam for green machinist

[antoniog]

Hey everyone, it seems like the “this vs that” posts aren’t popular here, but it’s a question/advice that I’m looking for so I’m gonna post it regardless. So the asshole in our building is leaving in 2 weeks (hurrah!) and that will leave a spot open for me to enter as a programmer. As far as CAD/CAM experience goes, I have played around with fusion 360 a couple of times and I have made a few successful parts after self-teaching through tutorials and YouTube. I’ve also used and am somewhat familiar with Geopath SCAD/CAM (but on Windows ME)
And have made a few parts as well. At this shop, I will be getting trained by other programmers there that know what they’re doing and I will be given my own computer as well I believe. Here is the dilemma: one programmer uses surfcam while the other uses mastercam. I have a choice for either one as far as it’s been made clear to me. Which one should I start with? I know i can just end up learning both if I really wanted to, but I feel like that’s not a very realistic answer to my question currently. The work for now will be almost 100% 3 axis/VMC work, with a small chance for 4 axis/HMC and tiny chance for large programming. I also have the future in mind, and would like to work for myself one day. Maybe in the end for that fusion 360 will be the best choice for home/small shop considering price and relatively shallow learning curve/abundance of features. If it matters I am located in the Bay Area. Thanks for reading my rambling and I’m hoping to get some advice on where to start.

 

[nihilistic]

Who do you like and/or smells better?

Mastercam is more prevalent in the industry so you would have more support and future opportunities if you learn it.

Surfcam is a good system just not as popular.

Or you can search your area on Indeed and compare the job opportunities using surfcam or mastercam as keywords.

EZPZ

 

[MCritchley]

I just switched from Surf to master cam. I like master cam a bit better, but they are both outdated as far as the user interface goes.
I get great phone Support from master cam if I have a issue or simple question. The support from Vero is ok.
Both of their drawing packages are difficult to learn if you’ve done any solid modeling.
I doubt that Surfcam will ever get big updates, and most likely doesn’t sell that many new seats.

 

[mhajicek]

More jobs in Mastercam, and more good online help available. It's got problems like anything, but it can do just about anything once you learn how. It's two areas of weakness are Swiss and Millturn.

 

[len_1962]

@ antoniog
Here is a question, what software are they using for CAD?
I ask because that will make my answer to your question relevant to one of the software's.
once you reply I will explain which one I would pick.

 

[antoniog]

@ antoniog
Here is a question, what software are they using for CAD?
I ask because that will make my answer to your question relevant to one of the software's.
once you reply I will explain which one I would pick.

one guy uses mastercam, the other guy uses surfcam. I think I’ve made my choice though for mastercam

 

[len_1962]

one guy uses mastercam, the other guy uses surfcam. I think I’ve made my choice though for mastercam

I'm sorry, as the Knight in Indian Jones said ................https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIitjokEJwg
the battle still continues between GOOD and EVIL (MASTERCAM)


Surfcam user since 1992 and knew the guy in the Bay Area that sold it to everyone there, Walt was his name.
We had 12 seats at Contour Inc, had 22 model makers in the heyday before 3D printing machines became affordable.
Contours Sunnyvale operations was sold off and the owner moved back to Wisconsin.

Now I am an avid SW\HSMWorks guy

best of luck but hey if you don't like one you can jump to the other

lenny

 

[charlie gary]

Mastercam. I say that as someone with 17 years of experience with SurfCAM who can't find a job as a programmer because everyone else uses Mastercam. Now I'm learning Mastercam.

 

[len_1962]

Mastercam. I say that as someone with 17 years of experience with SurfCAM who can't find a job as a programmer because everyone else uses Mastercam. Now I'm learning Mastercam.

Yeah kind of the way things are going again ....TO THE DARK SIDE

Hence why I've been running SW\HSMWorks since 2012 and who knows how long that will be until AutoDesk kills it, then I guess onto SWCAM aka CAMWorks or CONFUSION360.

 

[Zeus1050]

I used both at my last place of employment. I bitched about Surfcam until I had the opportunity to use Mastercam, then I ran back to Surfcam. Nothing is better at 3D, TrueMill really works well, drilling is easy with the menu. It’s much easier to set your coordinate systems.
Mastercam is buggy, copying operations in the operation manager doesn’t work well. The dynamic milling and optimill are a pain to use, the graphics crash. Unlike Surfcam or HSMWORKS, or Camworks, drilling is one tool, one operation at a time, you can try copying and changing, plan on being aggravated.
Neither have good drawing tools, the solids in Mastercam is backwards at best, Freecad is better...Neither have an easy to use post generator.
I prefer CAM that works in the modeler, Camworks is nice, different but works well. I come to like HSMWORKS. My take..

 

[Dan B]

Here's another option. Introduce Fusion 360 to your company. It's so cheap why not give it a year and see how it goes? Even with a year of machining extensions included it's still only a couple grand.

 

[Zeus1050]

Fusion 360 works very well for what it is, unfortunately it’s Autodesk and they have you up against the wall. The argument over cost is legit, yet in the end you are hostage to a full time internet connection and the whim of AD at any given second. To say the cloud sucks is the understatement of human history. Time will tell if AD smartens up....

 

[len_1962]

Fusion 360 works very well for what it is, unfortunately it’s Autodesk and they have you up against the wall. The argument over cost is legit, yet in the end you are hostage to a full time internet connection and the whim of AD at any given second. To say the cloud sucks is the understatement of human history. Time will tell if AD smartens up....

just buy fusion so you can get HSMWorks! no files hostage in SolidWorks!

 

[Zeus1050]

Not exactly.... yes you get HSM, but.... it to has to log on every two weeks or it won’t work, so you have to take your computer somewhere there is a net connection every two weeks. Been there , did this....
I also don’t know if AD has blocked out the multi axis tool paths that were in HSM.

 

[Dan B]

Fusion 360 works very well for what it is, unfortunately it’s Autodesk and they have you up against the wall. The argument over cost is legit, yet in the end you are hostage to a full time internet connection and the whim of AD at any given second. To say the cloud sucks is the understatement of human history. Time will tell if AD smartens up....

Maybe he could just set aside the potential doom and gloom of what might happen one day, maybe, and get some work done with Fusion in the meantime. It's not going away, as much as some people here wish it would. I'm starting to see resumes with Fusion experience. I expect that will continue to happen moving forward.

 

[Mtndew]

It's not going away

Reminder, we're talking about AutoDesk here. It could go away tomorrow for all we know.

 

[Mike1974]

I used both at my last place of employment. I bitched about Surfcam until I had the opportunity to use Mastercam, then I ran back to Surfcam. Nothing is better at 3D, TrueMill really works well, drilling is easy with the menu. It’s much easier to set your coordinate systems.
Mastercam is buggy, copying operations in the operation manager doesn’t work well. The dynamic milling and optimill are a pain to use, the graphics crash. Unlike Surfcam or HSMWORKS, or Camworks, drilling is one tool, one operation at a time, you can try copying and changing, plan on being aggravated.
Neither have good drawing tools, the solids in Mastercam is backwards at best, Freecad is better...Neither have an easy to use post generator.
I prefer CAM that works in the modeler, Camworks is nice, different but works well. I come to like HSMWORKS. My take..

My guess is graphics crashing is your system. Use MCX (and probably alot others?) on a low end system, well garbage in garbage out. Once upon a time MCX only supported "officially" Nvidia cards, not sure if it's the same. Easy check might be to check your resource manager as you run through a programming session and see if one thing is spiking towards the end of performance...

 

[Zeus1050]

My last employer was no slouch when it came to hardware, it was MC 2018. The toolpath simulation crashed the whole program regularly.

Over the last 38 years I’ve used Masterscam, Bobcad, Vector, Fusion 360, Camworks, Surfcam, Ultrapath,Featurecam,, Hsmworks and plain old hand programming. Each one of these systems has advantages and disadvantages. I once knew a fellow who was wicked good with Bobcad and made very complicated drag bike parts, he knew the system well.
The guy above has a choice between Surfcam and Mastercam. Choose wisely....

 

[len_1962]

Not exactly.... yes you get HSM, but.... it to has to log on every two weeks or it won’t work, so you have to take your computer somewhere there is a net connection every two weeks. Been there , did this....
I also don’t know if AD has blocked out the multi axis tool paths that were in HSM.

nope stays connected as long as you don't turn off add-in or shut down SW. and you can use your phone as as a hotspot so no problem getting web either..... next rant?

 

[Dan B]

Reminder, we're talking about AutoDesk here. It could go away tomorrow for all we know.

That seems to be the trend if Autodesk acquires companies. Look at T-splines and VSR for example. But Fusion is their flagship product. I attended an Autodesk user meeting a couple of months ago and they stressed that all new development is going to Fusion first, then that may or may not trickle down to other products like PowerMill or FeatureCAM. Up until recently it was the other way around. I will bet that WorkNC disappears before Fusion 360 does.