Machine shop floor team development setup and management? How did you start?

[SageGlad]

Hey forum people!
I am not a big shop, but we getting busier and busier. More customers more jobs rolling our way. I am the one who program setup and run the machines, and I need changes..
As I see I can bring more and more jobs in, and I need people on my floor to setup and operate.
Have never hired any workers before, done everything myself so far, and it’s getting tough.
Is I see it, I should get a couple operators to run the machines, hire an inspector and a supervisor to get it all working properly together. I have a picture in my mind how should it look like in my understanding, but here a lot of you guys who went through this stuff before and have made some mistakes, someone hav a different opinion on how should it look like from scratch, someone has built a successful team from ground up…
I need any advice, opinions, guesses, thoughts, whatever you guys think of it.
How would you do? What did you do? What’s did you built?
Where did you miss something?
Any comments greatly appreciated!
Hug you all!

 

[ttrager]

This is a complex thing you are looking at accomplishing. But it WILL, without fail, be one of the most significant experiences you will have in your lifetime of working, no matter how it turns out. While I don't know the specifics of your shop, there are some general guidelines that I believe apply.

This may seem like over-thought over-kill, but I've listed these because your potential changes go way beyond just hiring a couple more operators/machinists. You are looking at introducing an entire new tier of "authority" into an existing group of people.

Identify your one or two trusted lieutenants to act as your right-hand people (new hire or not, someone to be a "supervisor", etc.). Figure out who you think that is, or hire if that seems justified. And your internal candidates, if any, aren't necessarily your "best" machinists. It might be, but you need someone(s) with "better judgement", whatever that means.

Lay out job positions "on paper": 1) Block out each CURRENT job position, list the responsibilities and "authorities" each carries now. Don't take this for granted, list everything pertinent under each person.. 2) Lay out each NEW position you are thinking of adding and identify what responsibilities and "authorities" those will have. That will make up two things: A) Potentially MOVING something currently under an existing employee, and B) Something new no one else is currently responsible for. It is things under A) that might need more care, because it might be something someone thinks is theirs.

After laying out the positions and their responsibilities, sit back and think through the workflow in your shop and how each person interacts as product is manufactured and inspected. Look for places where it's going to run smoothly, and places where there may be collisions between people: A) An actual "mechanical" conflict in the process. Easier to clean up. B) A perceived issue by someone. This might be nothing more than someone resenting the new process or a new hire. Requires a great deal more attention. c) No conflict, should be fine.

Consult with your existing employees, if necessary, and as you see fit. It is usually helpful to consider the opinions/viewpoints of the people currently there, with a vested interest in their jobs and who have historically been trusted to do the work. Use judgement though. Get information and opinions, but realize a blindly open-ended free-for-all by others can be a mess.

Personally, I would write up job descriptions once you've got the above figured out. Even if you are a small shop, basic job descriptions just help, if you bother to use the tool.

Write up the qualifications for any new positions, regardless of new hire or giving it to someone already there. You are looking to cover two things here: A) Information to use when posting job openings online, or B) Double checking with your internal pick for additional training (if any), or just planning.

Double Check the Budget and the ongoing revenue increases necessary to fund the changes you are thinking of.

The above are some of the basic organization techniques I'd use when looking to evolve a work group like you are describing.

Best of luck to you.

 

[Kingbob]

I've only ever experienced organic growth, (and contractions) but I recommend you take it one step at a time, one person at a time.
Everyone has to get along and mesh well, job applications and previous experience won't inform that.
Start with your lieutenant, train him up or at least crash course him for a month or two then hire and train the next guy together, monitor the mood on the shop floor.
When you add a new guy and the mood sours a month or two later you know who to look at first.
One nasty, complaining attitude can make a great shop a terrible place to work.
Enforce good shop citizenship, the whole team gets a superbowl ring or no one does.
Machine shop is a team sport, there is no individual success in a failing shop and no individual failure that doesn't impact everyone.
Understand the growing a shop means trading control for growth, if you want your people to take responsibility for their work the must feel a sense of ownership over their part of the process and that can't be faked.

 

[Turretturn]

Sounds like your shop is in a similar place to the shop I did my apprenticeship.

It was just the two owners running the shop, they brought in me and another apprentice, the wages were cheap and I think partially subsidised by the government, we worked to their methods as we didn't know any better and it was a great learning experience for us working closely with the owners.

 

[SageGlad]

I've only ever experienced organic growth, (and contractions) but I recommend you take it one step at a time, one person at a time.
Everyone has to get along and mesh well, job applications and previous experience won't inform that.
Start with your lieutenant, train him up or at least crash course him for a month or two then hire and train the next guy together, monitor the mood on the shop floor.
When you add a new guy and the mood sours a month or two later you know who to look at first.
One nasty, complaining attitude can make a great shop a terrible place to work.
Enforce good shop citizenship, the whole team gets a superbowl ring or no one does.
Machine shop is a team sport, there is no individual success in a failing shop and no individual failure that doesn't impact everyone.
Understand the growing a shop means trading control for growth, if you want your people to take responsibility for their work the must feel a sense of ownership over their part of the process and that can't be faked.

Man, thank you very much for sharing! Sounds like a plan to me, as I don’t have currently a big chunk of money to invest in it, but in need of growth. Very appreciate your comment!

 

[SageGlad]

This is a complex thing you are looking at accomplishing. But it WILL, without fail, be one of the most significant experiences you will have in your lifetime of working, no matter how it turns out. While I don't know the specifics of your shop, there are some general guidelines that I believe apply.

This may seem like over-thought over-kill, but I've listed these because your potential changes go way beyond just hiring a couple more operators/machinists. You are looking at introducing an entire new tier of "authority" into an existing group of people.

Identify your one or two trusted lieutenants to act as your right-hand people (new hire or not, someone to be a "supervisor", etc.). Figure out who you think that is, or hire if that seems justified. And your internal candidates, if any, aren't necessarily your "best" machinists. It might be, but you need someone(s) with "better judgement", whatever that means.

Lay out job positions "on paper": 1) Block out each CURRENT job position, list the responsibilities and "authorities" each carries now. Don't take this for granted, list everything pertinent under each person.. 2) Lay out each NEW position you are thinking of adding and identify what responsibilities and "authorities" those will have. That will make up two things: A) Potentially MOVING something currently under an existing employee, and B) Something new no one else is currently responsible for. It is things under A) that might need more care, because it might be something someone thinks is theirs.

After laying out the positions and their responsibilities, sit back and think through the workflow in your shop and how each person interacts as product is manufactured and inspected. Look for places where it's going to run smoothly, and places where there may be collisions between people: A) An actual "mechanical" conflict in the process. Easier to clean up. B) A perceived issue by someone. This might be nothing more than someone resenting the new process or a new hire. Requires a great deal more attention. c) No conflict, should be fine.

Consult with your existing employees, if necessary, and as you see fit. It is usually helpful to consider the opinions/viewpoints of the people currently there, with a vested interest in their jobs and who have historically been trusted to do the work. Use judgement though. Get information and opinions, but realize a blindly open-ended free-for-all by others can be a mess.

Personally, I would write up job descriptions once you've got the above figured out. Even if you are a small shop, basic job descriptions just help, if you bother to use the tool.

Write up the qualifications for any new positions, regardless of new hire or giving it to someone already there. You are looking to cover two things here: A) Information to use when posting job openings online, or B) Double checking with your internal pick for additional training (if any), or just planning.

Double Check the Budget and the ongoing revenue increases necessary to fund the changes you are thinking of.

The above are some of the basic organization techniques I'd use when looking to evolve a work group like you are describing.

Best of luck to you.

Thank you for your comment! Sounds like a business plan, and you right and very structured about the process of building a team. Unfortunately I don’t have a big investments as of right now, trying to use funds for the machinery more first now. Hopefully with one or two more people (as “Kingbob” said in his comments) like an organic growth, should increase cash flow and I’ll be able to build more serious structure than

 

[F35Machinist]

Really depends on the type of work you expect to be doing. You say you are spending all of your time programming and doing setups, but then say you want to hire operators and a foreman. How will the operators relieve you if they can't help with setups or programming? If you have high volume, long running work that really needs operators, then the job is defining exactly what these people need to do and then making it dummy proof. It doesn't have much to do with machining at that point and it's more like operating a mcdonalds.

On the other hand, if you are looking for copies of yourself then you probably aren't going to find any. The going rate for competent machinists in my area is 45$/hr. Are you ready to pay 100k a year for someone that will produce half the output that you do? Many machine shop businesses that make sense with 1 owner operator don't make sense anymore with employees. There is a good chance you are going to work longer hours for less money at the end of the year when you hire employees. Believe it or not, operating a hectic 1 man shop is less stress than a shop with employees.

 

[Kingbob]

Thank you for your comment! Sounds like a business plan, and you right and very structured about the process of building a team. Unfortunately I don’t have a big investments as of right now, trying to use funds for the machinery more first now. Hopefully with one or two more people (as “Kingbob” said in his comments) like an organic growth, should increase cash flow and I’ll be able to build more serious structure than

Happy to help, I have a wealth of past failures to draw experience from.
I've been robbed by employees and customers, cut off for good reason and no good reason, had good customers go bankrupt and bitter competitors turn into good clients.
It's a ride and it hurts, I've gotten mad and "quit" several times, I've got mad and broken a phone and drank too much, I've cried and drank too much, and had good times and drank to much.
It's not easy and it's not supposed to be, people front, don't believe them.

 

[SageGlad]

Really depends on the type of work you expect to be doing. You say you are spending all of your time programming and doing setups, but then say you want to hire operators and a foreman. How will the operators relieve you if they can't help with setups or programming? If you have high volume, long running work that really needs operators, then the job is defining exactly what these people need to do and then making it dummy proof. It doesn't have much to do with machining at that point and it's more like operating a mcdonalds.

On the other hand, if you are looking for copies of yourself then you probably aren't going to find any. The going rate for competent machinists in my area is 45$/hr. Are you ready to pay 100k a year for someone that will produce half the output that you do? Many machine shop businesses that make sense with 1 owner operator don't make sense anymore with employees. There is a good chance you are going to work longer hours for less money at the end of the year when you hire employees. Believe it or not, operating a hectic 1 man shop is less stress than a shop with employees.

You saying the right thing. In many cases I have jobs that are 50-200 parts, and I run them for a few days going back and forth from one machine to the other doing setup at the same time. And I also have a job for one of the customers where I run 1000 parts every like 3 months or so, and I have a huge down time on that machine because I can’t stay there and change the parts every 40 minutes (it takes 10-15 minutes to change). That’s where I start feeling I need a second hand that makes me more free to concentrate on setups and programming, and quotes also take time… the quality of my job also depends on how good I was concentrated on setting them up. That’s why I’m thinking to have an employees I think I can grow that way faster then running like crazy by myself and trying to do everything so I would make all money myself.

 

[john.k]

Once you have employees ,everything has to be double fail safe .....no employee will give the same attention to detail or experience to any job that you do.......and if you rely on an employee to 'do the extra yards' on a job,then you better feel lucky,.........consequently things like profit margins need to be able to take a big fail and still get by.

 

[ttrager]

You saying the right thing. In many cases I have jobs that are 50-200 parts, and I run them for a few days going back and forth from one machine to the other doing setup at the same time. And I also have a job for one of the customers where I run 1000 parts every like 3 months or so, and I have a huge down time on that machine because I can’t stay there and change the parts every 40 minutes (it takes 10-15 minutes to change). That’s where I start feeling I need a second hand that makes me more free to concentrate on setups and programming, and quotes also take time… the quality of my job also depends on how good I was concentrated on setting them up. That’s why I’m thinking to have an employees I think I can grow that way faster then running like crazy by myself and trying to do everything so I would make all money myself.

Perhaps, as others have pointed out in this thread, focus on distinct "small bites". When I read your opening post I interpretted a broader initiative to include a "foreman".

How to you "take just a bite"? Lay out your tasks and needs, distinctly, so you can see them in a list. Then circle the ones that you have to do the most running between, and hire someone for that or promote from within and hire a replacement for what that person was doing.

The most obvious example I think I see is your need for a "Setup Operator", or "engineer". Without actually knowing what I'm talking about since I don't know your shop first hand, I do have an example that illustrates how this was handled where I worked previously:

It was a larger shop mind you, but they had a problem very similar: The CNC Plant Manager didn't have the time to run around and handle all the machine setups. They needed a couple of "Setup Engineers" capable of doing that. Out of all the unskilled labor in that place they had a very few that were actually educated in CNC programming, as well as a couple of standout Operators that were a cut above.

To fill the need they promoted from within and backfilled open Operator positions with new hires.

They figured out the Job Positions and what tasks they were responsible for. #1 at the top was to change out the setup on CNC machines as needed, when a different job was going to swap into the position. They figured out what else those guys could do between job changes. Going on memory I believe some of that was working with the tool room on new fixtures, doing some of the Preventive Maint checks on the machines to verify fixtures were working properly, filling in with some part production when necessary. In one fellow's case he was a programmer, so they had him work with the prototype guys on blueprints and inspection points.

Bottom Line: List out the task-problems you have and pick those you most need filled. Figure out the qualifications needed for a new hire, or the training (if any) needed for an internal pick. That's your small bite.

 

[OpusG5]

Hey forum people!
I am not a big shop, but we getting busier and busier. More customers more jobs rolling our way. I am the one who program setup and run the machines, and I need changes..
As I see I can bring more and more jobs in, and I need people on my floor to setup and operate.
Have never hired any workers before, done everything myself so far, and it’s getting tough.
Is I see it, I should get a couple operators to run the machines, hire an inspector and a supervisor to get it all working properly together. I have a picture in my mind how should it look like in my understanding, but here a lot of you guys who went through this stuff before and have made some mistakes, someone hav a different opinion on how should it look like from scratch, someone has built a successful team from ground up…
I need any advice, opinions, guesses, thoughts, whatever you guys think of it.
How would you do? What did you do? What’s did you built?
Where did you miss something?
Any comments greatly appreciated!
Hug you all!

Hi, I like to get more jobs for my small shop and wondering how you started getting more jobs.?

 

[dkmc]

(Some) questions for the pre-hires:

Have you ever worked in a team environment?

Do you have any issues, concerns, or problems with working in a team environment?

What contributions and improvements can you comment on with a team environment work concept?

Because many people don't grasp the concept, and if they don't intend to be a team player it won't ever work out. Best to find that out sooner than later. You don't want to hire problems if avoidable. When you ask up front, there's something to hold them to if they behave badly later. It wouldn't be a bad idea to have a written mission statement that lays out the goals of your 'team'. Have pre-hires read it and even sign that they read and understand it. (I've seen way too many non team players poison companies and short circuit progress).

Consider implementing 'lean' from the beginning instead of 'later'.
See: https://paulakers.net/what-is-lean

Just some thoughts....FWIW

 

[DanielG]

It sounds like you're currently a one-man show.

I would start by figuring out what you do each week. You'll find that it falls into a few categories: stuff YOU need to do (business decisions, maintaining relationships, etc.), stuff that someone skilled needs to do (programming, setup, quoting, etc.), and stuff that someone needs to do (sweeping up, sending out RFQs for materials, unloading the truck when it comes in, pressing buttons, cutting stock).

Are you trying to grow slowly, or make an immediate jump to big shop status? If the former, there are two approaches. One is to hire someone skilled who can take on work wholesale. The other is to hire someone conscientious and trainable who you can offload a bunch of your work to. I took the latter route for my first full-time employee and it's worked very well for me. I hired someone who had mostly worked in construction, but was conscientious and trainable. Did I have enough paying work to keep him busy all the time? No, so I now have some nicely organized foam-cut out toolboxes. It's worth it because it frees me up to do the work that I'm better at. He's since learned to run the CNC mill. Mostly I do the programming and we do the first article together, but for the rest of the parts I can leave him alone.

The key thing is to hire someone that you can give a task to and be confident that it will get done, and he'll come to you with questions. If you can find this person, you'll really be able to leverage your time.