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Advice for a laptop to fit my needs

This is to say that just because you have a I5/I7/I9/Xeon/Ryzen/etc doesn't necessarily mean that you've git the bomb processor. There are many variants of each of these.
That's why I gave you those links, so you could research all the processors BEFORE making a purchase. When I say i9's are faster than Xeon's, I mean that the fastest i9's are faster than the fastest Xeon's, and also dollar for dollar you'll get more performance out of an i9. If you want bang for buck, choosing the right CPU is the first step.
 
Quadro is supposed to be the most reliable, and it's backed, and supported by SolidWorks, AutoCAD, etc where GeForce is not.
Officially this is true, and those cheapest two laptops on the Newegg link do have Quadro cards. But I'm running Mastercam and Solidworks perfectly well on a Geforce 3070. In theory, if you get into VERY large and complex parts and assemblies, a Quadro will perform better, but the point at which that matters keeps increasing with each generation of card. It's also a necessity for the FEA, fluid dynamics, and raytracing functions in Solidworks. If your parts are of a sane level of complexity (they'd better be if you're using a laptop) and you're not using those special functions, you don't need a Quadro.

BTW, video card performance has almost no effect on modelling and toolpathing speed.
 
You came here asking advice on something I know quite a bit about. I offered my advice. You ignored my advice.

You paid about $2100 for a suboptimal laptop. The cheapest laptop in the Newegg link is bout $2200, with an i9-12900HX CPU, which has 8 efficiency cores and 8 performance cores, and benchmarks at a full 150% of what your Xeon will do. For about $2400, you can get the same thing with 32GB RAM and 1TB storage. That's a little more money, but certainly not what I would call "many more moneys".

But hey, it's your money, not mine. You do you.
I paid $570 for a laptop with 32GB RAM, a terabyte of storage, a Xeon processor, and the top Quadro GPU offered in a 15" Dell Precision in 2018. (Unless the P4000 was an option, but not sure, I think it was offered in the 7730) When comparing $2400 to $570, I would consider $1,830 to be many more moneys

Here's the thing, I posted Saturday morning. I get no real responses until maybe Sunday afternoon.?.? I mean I figured y'all weren't intrigued by the thread or something. The system's purchased by noon or so on Sunday, so now it just becomes ridicule. "Why a Xeon?" The better question is, "why not get a Xeon?" because that question = a short, simple answer. Explaining the reasons to buy a Xeon becomes more involving. That's like asking, "why get Michelin tires?" when "why not get Michelin tires?" is the simpler/shorter answer in that "they're expensive." No, I don't currently have Michelin tires on any of my cars or trucks.

Here's a good video explaining why I was glad to get Xeon, but again the CPU wasn't the primary selling point for me, but I do appreciate the computer having it.

 
Hello fellow tool makers. I am in the market for a laptop to fit two different needs. I was hoping to get some good, honest advice on what I need so that I don't spend for more than I have too.

The first role it needs to file is it needs to be able to run the software for my HPTuner. The minimum requirements for this are:
-Windows 7 and newer OS for PC. (Will not work with MAC or Chromebook)
-4GB RAM
-2GHz x86 (ARM processors are not supported)
-Microsoft.net framework 4.6.1

Second I want to get invest in some good CAD software. I'm pretty efficient at 2D programs like AutoCAD and DraftSight, and have spent many hours on these 2D programs at jobs I used to havs, but I'm interested in learning some 3D programming. The only 3D programming I have personal experience using is MasterCAM, but I never found it to be the best for drawing, but mainly used it for programming and editing, and drawing some simple parts. There are some nice workstations out there, but a new laptop with your nicer, dedicated GPU's, and bigger SSD's, 32+ GB of RAM, etc are not cheap. I'm looking at refurbished units on Ebay and others and am wondering if some of your older systems are still relivant and worth their lower price points for supporting software like SolidWorks, Catia, and other 3D programming? I've really been looking at models like your older Dell Precision 7520, 7530, 5540, etc. Are these units outfitted with their higherup but older GPU's still capable of running newer CAD programs efficiently? The internet will try and tell you that you need to invest in the latest and greatest stuff. I've also looked at some more gaming or higherend home focused PC laptops like a Dell XPS or MSI Stealth M15. Is a gaming PC good for running CAD or is a good workstation the smart way to go? I like the idea of running a GPU that the CAD creators endorse like the older Nvidia Quadros, etc. As is Xeon worth it over your Core processors like your i7 or i9, or competitive AMD stuff? Obviously there are different generations of all these processors, and they progress with every generation so that's likely a loaded question, but just speaking in general. I've heard that the newer Xeon processors have gotten really fast like your better Core processors? I'm not a huge computer expert though so I'm no big brain on talking computer processors, but I have a general gist of things. Basically I'm wanting to know how much computer do I need to run good CAD software without worrying whether or not my computer can support it.

If y'all could recommend some good CAD programs as well that would be great. This is just a home computer for me that I'd like to be able to design on. This doesn't need to support a business or anything like that, so I'm not needing to spend 4 figures a year on a subscription. Free CAD programs like DraftSight used to be seem to have gone the way of the dodo bird.






You might like linux os better than windows , it's less buggy and they offer a lot of cad software free. You can build your os like you want it with linux and avoid all the clutter associated with windows. So I am guessing you do not have a laptop at all now is that correct? https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-lm&q=Linux+cad+software. You might ask around if any Cad machinist run Linux . It's a much faster OS than windows and updates take minutes not all day.
 
I paid $570 for a laptop with 32GB RAM, a terabyte of storage, a Xeon processor, and the top Quadro GPU offered in a 15" Dell Precision in 2018. (Unless the P4000 was an option, but not sure, I think it was offered in the 7730) When comparing $2400 to $570, I would consider $1,830 to be many more moneys
Moving goalpost much? You said you just paid $2100, and now you're trying to compare to something else you bought five years ago. If you can get a top end laptop for $570, why didn't you just do that again instead of paying $2100?

Here's the thing, I posted Saturday morning. I get no real responses until maybe Sunday afternoon.?.? I mean I figured y'all weren't intrigued by the thread or something. The system's purchased by noon or so on Sunday

So you allowed 24 hours for responses on a business and industrial forum over the weekend. Most users here only log in during the business day, while their machines are running.
 
Moving goalpost much? You said you just paid $2100,
To be fair, in that same post he did mention that he cancelled that order and bought the one for $570.

He's just another one of those people that ask for advice, but don't take any because they are the smartest person in the room and know more than we do.
 
BTW, video card performance has almost no effect on modelling and toolpathing speed.
Not true. Dell with i7 Quadro a2000 is slow and laggy. Old hp with them top of line FirePro and slower i5 so much smoother and quick. Desktop with 1060 lightning fast- but crashes with organic curve surfaces. Graphics cards matter, I am amd loyal because they write drivers for you (free) on the pro cards.
 
Geeze y'all are cranky this week lol.

Everyone in this thread knows more about computer specs than I do. Sometimes; "good enough is good enough" - unless you're on a web forum, then it becomes"if you don't chew Big Red then f@#k you!" 😂

The op's question was; "advise for a laptop to fit my needs". Not "what's the most awesome thing I can buy"

I need a new laptop for solidworks and Mcam as well. A solution under $600 sounds great to me. I do not do crazy technical work like @mhajicek and some of you other guys. Someone like me would never notice the performance of a cutting edge pc.
 
To be fair, in that same post he did mention that he cancelled that order and bought the one for $570.

He's just another one of those people that ask for advice, but don't take any because they are the smartest person in the room and know more than we do.
Correct, I am smart, and I did say that in the first paragraph of my 2nd post. Apparently reading is an issue for your boy. Probably something to do with the company he works for allowing him to goof around on an internet forum while they pay for his time to do works for them. Multitasking is more suited to women. Still it must have sucked working Sunday before the Super Bowl I'm thinking, seeing as noone gets on here outside of work.?.? This thread went well over 24 hours before any real advice other than someone saying, "I have a capable laptop with a good GPU. I recommend getting one." Cool, but now that's it's bought why are we going to start critiquing things, when noone was giving any advice for over a day? The deed is done. Any advice is now a day late, and a dollar short....or whatever that old saying is. I never said I bought the biggest powerhouse setup, but it's specs are decent for a 2018 system, and should be easily capable of running most 3D programs, and from everything I've seen on it you can max out it's RAM at $128 GB for around $150, but ole dude wants to start throwing up all these new, 4 figure machines, and 12 GEN Intel processors comparing them to the 5 year old refurbished model I bought for under $600. The reality is the original computer I ordered and canceled is more capable than any of those machines on that Newegg link. I decided I didn't need that much computer, or want to drop $2,100 (around $1,930 or so before taxes) on something that won't get enough use from me to justify that cost even though that was a lot of computer for that $.

But seriously, what's your beef with Xeon? Is there a legitimate issue with it other than it may clock a little slower than some of your top model I7/I9/Ryden processors? I don't understand why someone would frown upon one in a workstation.?.? Maybe not the best choice in a high-end gaming setup, but that's not what I'm prioritizing.
 
You might like linux os better than windows , it's less buggy and they offer a lot of cad software free. You can build your os like you want it with linux and avoid all the clutter associated with windows. So I am guessing you do not have a laptop at all now is that correct? https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-lm&q=Linux+cad+software. You might ask around if any Cad machinist run Linux . It's a much faster OS than windows and updates take minutes not all day.
I've never owned a Linux, but the main reason I require a PC is HPTuners only supports Windows. They now have Apple, and Andriod apps that you can tune with if you have a newer RTD+ programmer, but I haven't been able to get it to link up reliably using the app on my phone, so I just stick with connecting it to a laptop with Windows.

BTW, I'll just mention that if I didn't need the mobility of a laptop to tune a datalog with then I would likely go with a desktop.
 
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My current laptops are LG Gram 17 inch machines. Soo tired of lugging a 17" workstation laptop. Like traveling with an empty computer bag now. Very loaded units under 2k. A laptop is for moving around, and site to site (even house and garage). Weight and size matter, performance too. I used to take a MS surface on the road if communication was all that was needed. Now take the LG Gram.
Laptops are expendable now days. Try and remove the battery. Soldered in.
 
My current laptops are LG Gram 17 inch machines. Soo tired of lugging a 17" workstation laptop. Like traveling with an empty computer bag now. Very loaded units under 2k. A laptop is for moving around, and site to site (even house and garage). Weight and size matter, performance too. I used to take a MS surface on the road if communication was all that was needed. Now take the LG Gram.
Laptops are expendable now days. Try and remove the battery. Soldered in.
I actually started looking at those, but the one thing that kept me from seriously considering one is that all I saw was built-in graphics. I assume this is required for their compactness and light weight for such an otherwise very nice looking machine. Do you think that the built-in Intel graphics would work well for things like 3D programs, or light gaming type stuff? Other than not having a dedicated GPU I thought those looked great.
 
Those of us who use our computers to make money, i.e. professionals, know that buying a close-to-top-of-the-line computer saves "many more moneys" in the long run. I usually build my own, which usually saves about 25% on cost, while letting me get exactly what I want. My cheapest build ever was $1600, and took first place in the Mastercam benchmarks for a few months. My current rig was $2500, which I bought complete, as I needed it while video cards were in short supply. As the owner of the business, I'm not going to waste my money by buying hobbyist level equipment; the computer equivalent of a Tormach. Every time you find yourself waiting for your computer, just think about how you're waiting 50% longer than you should be. Add up all that time over the life of the computer and see what it costs.

Edit:
I went back and reread your second post, where you described that you waited only a few hours before ordering your $2100 laptop, then trying to upgrade, then cancelling and buying something old and cheap. I need to correct myself; the Xeon E-2176M, which appears to be what is in your cheap laptop, is less than half as fast as what you could have gotten for $2200, so you'll be waiting more than twice as long as needed. But if that's fine for your application, then ignore everything I've said. If you had asked for the cheapest machine capable of limping along in Mastercam, I would have given you different advice.
 
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basically, if you want a Cad laptop, you need to get into the gaming laptop territory, newest best processors like the 11000 or 12000 series, and a dedicated graphics card, as laptops are a pain to upgrade them afterwards, a tower computer is better but obviously less portable, but has much more room for upgrades, multiple hard drives and SSD slots.
I've got both, desktop for cad design as its nicer to work with a 29" screen compared to a 15 or 17, separate mouse etc.
plus, desktop computers are like $1000 for a tower that will do everything.
laptops are avg double that.

id move away from dell and get into MSI.
 
Hello fellow tool makers. I am in the market for a laptop to fit two different needs. I was hoping to get some good, honest advice on what I need so that I don't spend for more than I have too.

The first role it needs to file is it needs to be able to run the software for my HPTuner. The minimum requirements for this are:
-Windows 7 and newer OS for PC. (Will not work with MAC or Chromebook)
-4GB RAM
-2GHz x86 (ARM processors are not supported)
-Microsoft.net framework 4.6.1

Second I want to get invest in some good CAD software. I'm pretty efficient at 2D programs like AutoCAD and DraftSight, and have spent many hours on these 2D programs at jobs I used to havs, but I'm interested in learning some 3D programming. The only 3D programming I have personal experience using is MasterCAM, but I never found it to be the best for drawing, but mainly used it for programming and editing, and drawing some simple parts. There are some nice workstations out there, but a new laptop with your nicer, dedicated GPU's, and bigger SSD's, 32+ GB of RAM, etc are not cheap. I'm looking at refurbished units on Ebay and others and am wondering if some of your older systems are still relivant and worth their lower price points for supporting software like SolidWorks, Catia, and other 3D programming? I've really been looking at models like your older Dell Precision 7520, 7530, 5540, etc. Are these units outfitted with their higherup but older GPU's still capable of running newer CAD programs efficiently? The internet will try and tell you that you need to invest in the latest and greatest stuff. I've also looked at some more gaming or higherend home focused PC laptops like a Dell XPS or MSI Stealth M15. Is a gaming PC good for running CAD or is a good workstation the smart way to go? I like the idea of running a GPU that the CAD creators endorse like the older Nvidia Quadros, etc. As is Xeon worth it over your Core processors like your i7 or i9, or competitive AMD stuff? Obviously there are different generations of all these processors, and they progress with every generation so that's likely a loaded question, but just speaking in general. I've heard that the newer Xeon processors have gotten really fast like your better Core processors? I'm not a huge computer expert though so I'm no big brain on talking computer processors, but I have a general gist of things. Basically I'm wanting to know how much computer do I need to run good CAD software without worrying whether or not my computer can support it.

If y'all could recommend some good CAD programs as well that would be great. This is just a home computer for me that I'd like to be able to design on. This doesn't need to support a business or anything like that, so I'm not needing to spend 4 figures a year on a subscription. Free CAD programs like DraftSight used to be seem to have gone the way of the dodo bird.






I bought a Lenovo think pad P series amd have been very happy.
Bit honestly if I had to do it all over I would buy a more powerful/cheaper desktop and just log into it remotely with a cheap/light laptop. More hang for your buck and still portable. If the laptop gets busted in the shop. No big deal. Desktop is far more easy to upgrade single components if need be down the road.
It will depend on your case use of course.
Mine is a home based CNC shop so the computer rarely travels. Even so you can remote log into the home base computer globally as long as you have an internet connection on said cheap laptop
 
Those of us who use our computers to make money, i.e. professionals, know that buying a close-to-top-of-the-line computer saves "many more moneys" in the long run. I usually build my own, which usually saves about 25% on cost, while letting me get exactly what I want. My cheapest build ever was $1600, and took first place in the Mastercam benchmarks for a few months. My current rig was $2500, which I bought complete, as I needed it while video cards were in short supply. As the owner of the business, I'm not going to waste my money by buying hobbyist level equipment; the computer equivalent of a Tormach. Every time you find yourself waiting for your computer, just think about how you're waiting 50% longer than you should be. Add up all that time over the life of the computer and see what it costs.

Edit:
I went back and reread your second post, where you described that you waited only a few hours before ordering your $2100 laptop, then trying to upgrade, then cancelling and buying something old and cheap. I need to correct myself; the Xeon E-2176M, which appears to be what is in your cheap laptop, is less than half as fast as what you could have gotten for $2200, so you'll be waiting more than twice as long as needed. But if that's fine for your application, then ignore everything I've said. If you had asked for the cheapest machine capable of limping along in Mastercam, I would have given you different advice.

Kinda funny to me it all blew up into this. Dude basically admits he's next to broke, doesn't want to go into any sort of debt buying a new computer. Then consider he only seems to have "an interest in learning" 3D programming. I think those were the words he used anyways. In all likelihood does not have any sort of legitimate software for CAD or CAM and is not likely to purchase any seats because of the aforementioned doesn't want to go into significant debt. And Mastercam, which he specifically mentions, is super fuckin expensive. Also seems to have a fixation on gaming rigs despite mentioning what seemed like multiple times not being any sort of gamer in any way. The whole goddamn thread is just weird.

But yeah, Xeon's are slower...they run fine. My rig has dual processors, both Xeons. Another of the programmers in the shop has a single processor, i9. Don't know what it is but his base is somewhere around 4.5 and mine are around 3.2. His rig runs circles around mine as far as toolpath processing goes, like one at a time. I've noticed however that my rig runs smoother when I start loading up and doing more stuff at once. And I'm always loaded up doing more stuff at once, so my rig works pretty well for me.
 
Yeah, maybe that's what threw me off. I ASSumed, that if you're going to be buying Mastercam, you can afford a decent rig, and will want to make the most of your investment.
Yeah...just weird. Reread it to confirm and he doesn't specifically say anything about Mastercam except that he has done some toolpathing on it in the past. Besides that it's "what kind of build do I need to run "good CAD software"? Don't know dude, what's good CAD software to you? Your acceptable minimum is gonna be total dogshit to like 90% of this forum. That's not even considering that 90% of this forum thinks most everything, whether it's related to machining or not, is total dogshit just as a general life rule. So settle in on what kind of software you want to run without regard to what anyone else thinks is good and then go from there.
 








 
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