10ee Micro Gaging Diameter Dial

[rcn11thacr]

HI,
I have searched and not been able to find much information, so i ask: Does anyone have any documents available in regard to the proper procedures for using a cross-feed "Micro Gaging Diameter Dial'?
I have one on my 1963 30 inch 10ee and I'm not real certain how to use it. I found a few comments below which included a document from Monarch, but nothing detailing how to specifically use it.

10EE odd cross-slide dial question, along with a trim strip material question.

I'm refurbing a '50 10EE and I have a couple of questions. First is this cross-slide dial seems a bit unusual. It is longer than others I've seen and has an internally geared extra ring, like what I would assume a metric/imp dial would have, but it is only imperial. I've never seen one like...

www.practicalmachinist.com

Thanks.

 

[guythatbrews]

That is interesting. I've never seen one.

 

[bsg]

HI,
I have searched and not been able to find much information, so i ask: Does anyone have any documents available in regard to the proper procedures for using a cross-feed "Micro Gaging Diameter Dial'?
I have one on my 1963 30 inch 10ee and I'm not real certain how to use it. I found a few comments below which included a document from Monarch, but nothing detailing how to specifically use it.

10EE odd cross-slide dial question, along with a trim strip material question.

I'm refurbing a '50 10EE and I have a couple of questions. First is this cross-slide dial seems a bit unusual. It is longer than others I've seen and has an internally geared extra ring, like what I would assume a metric/imp dial would have, but it is only imperial. I've never seen one like...

www.practicalmachinist.com

Thanks.

The description is pretty clear how to use it........



Kevin

 

[rimcanyon]

The one thing you should do is remove it and thoroughly clean and lube it. I have seen a few of these that were ruined by trying to run them without oil or when they were gummed up. There is a vey small pinion that drives the planetary gears and which will shear off its teeth if there is too much friction or resistance to free turning.

 

[guythatbrews]

The description is pretty clear how to use it........

View attachment 383572

Kevin

Forgive me for being obtuse, but I guess I'm confused by the micro part of the name of this dial. Is it just a dial that counts the 1/4" full revolutions of the crossfeed screw so you can "read the diameter directly", like .759? That is what I understand from the advert. Or can it read less than .001, which is what the micro means to me.

 

[rke[pler]

It's a 'regular' dial with a geared section to count dial revolutions. I have an older one from a round dial and only the regular dial will zero set.

I don't know of a dial assembly with less than .001 indications (maybe a vernier?). There's always the "set the compound at 7 degrees to the work" trick so the compound dial shows tenths on the dial.

 

[guythatbrews]

It's a 'regular' dial with a geared section to count dial revolutions. I have an older one from a round dial and only the regular dial will zero set.

I don't know of a dial assembly with less than .001 indications (maybe a vernier?). There's always the "set the compound at 7 degrees to the work" trick so the compound dial shows tenths on the dial.

Thanks! I get it now. I have seen those. It is a funny name for it though. Maybe some sales guy's idea. It does sound better than "counting" or "accumulating " dial.

 

[Ultradog MN]

Optional on the 12CK too - as was the travadial.
Both dials on this crossfeed can be zeroed.
There is a screw you remove to oil it.
PS, I never use it.

 

[rcn11thacr]

The description is pretty clear how to use it........

View attachment 383572

Kevin

Kevin,
I think one of my main reasons for not fully understanding the process/procedures for using this dial is that mine is missing the switch(?) on the front face of it. I should have mentioned that previously. I'm not sure what to call it (or what its purpose is) but it is broken off on mine. The center bolt with the 2 holes in it that holds the handle was (lost?) and replaced at some point with a regular bolt on mine. Anyone happen to have either or both of these available for sale?

 

[rke[pler]

By 'switch' do you mean the dial locking lever? Here's a pic of the lock bolt and dial lock lever I made for a spareish dial assembly.

 

[rcn11thacr]

Yes sir. Since mine looks like someone cut it off with a pair of dikes, I was not sure what it was. All I can see are threads. That dual locking lever is what I am missing. The little post beside it I am also missing. Not sure what that is for?

 

[daryl bane]

Not sure what that is for?

Just a stop for the lever. If you turn the lever till it butts against the stop , it is fully disengaged. Just alittle typical Monarch attention to detail.

 

[rcn11thacr]

By 'switch' do you mean the dial locking lever? Here's a pic of the lock bolt and dial lock lever I made for a spareish dial assembly.

View attachment 384396

Well now that i have seen it up close and in person, it looks quite easy to make myself. The locking lever that is. Once i take everything apart, hopefully the 'pin' to the left of the lever, is easy enough to figure out. As noted my pin is not there at all, so if it was supposed to hold something in place (like a pin normally does) then chances are that ain't held in place no longer. Does anyone have any specs on re-creating the nut(?) that holds the hand wheel in place? The center circle with the two holes.

 

[rke[pler]

The nut is dead simple. 3/4" diameter, 1/8 thick with a 1/4-20 stud 3/8" long on the back. Pin holes should be 1/8" and mine has them a little under 1/2" apart.

The lock is pretty simple, here's a couple of pics:





The lock lever is about 3/4" long (including the 1/4 post). You'll want to make it a little long and grind/file the face until it locks in the right place, then put in the 1/8" stop pin to retain it.

 

[rcn11thacr]

Very kind of you to share dimensions, pictures, and advice. This was very helpful. Thank you sir.

 

[Cal Haines]

Found this brochure that describes the "Micro-Gauging Dial"

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/2103/19744.pdf

 

[laminar-flow]

I've always wondered about Monarch. Counting in .250 per turn X, amount removed, diameter of stock?? Twenty years ago before I had my DRO on my 10EE, dealing with that dial was a pain. So you put your stock in, take a cut, now set the dial at what? Let's say the stock is 1.010 and you cut to 1.000. Set the dial at 0.0. Now make some passes to get 0.793 Ø. The dial will read .043 or .213 depending on which scale you read. When I do this now, I set my DRO X at 1.000 and 0.793 reads 0.793. My 10EE tailstock used to be .125 per turn but decades ago I made a 10TPI screw and nut and dial. For some reason I can't count in fractions. I understand later 10EE's used 0.200 per turn on X. Look at this link I just posted about Schaublin.

Schaublin Dials, why are they backward in X and some are Radius instead of Diameter

After dealing with my Schaublin 70 English dial reading the material removed diameter instead of actual diameter of the part, (I would always use it to show diameter of the part by thinking of a 8 as a 2 and a 6 as a 4, etc.), I finally made a new X dial. I also have a Metric Slide and not only...

www.practicalmachinist.com

As far as I know, all CNC is done in diameter of the part.

 

[guythatbrews]

I've always wondered about Monarch. Counting in .250 per turn X, amount removed, diameter of stock?? Twenty years ago before I had my DRO on my 10EE, dealing with that dial was a pain. So you put your stock in, take a cut, now set the dial at what? Let's say the stock is 1.010 and you cut to 1.000. Set the dial at 0.0. Now make some passes to get 0.793 Ø. The dial will read .043 or .213 depending on which scale you read. When I do this now, I set my DRO X at 1.000 and 0.793 reads 0.793. My 10EE tailstock used to be .125 per turn but decades ago I made a 10TPI screw and nut and dial. For some reason I can't count in fractions. I understand later 10EE's used 0.200 per turn on X. Look at this link I just posted about Schaublin.

Schaublin Dials, why are they backward in X and some are Radius instead of Diameter

After dealing with my Schaublin 70 English dial reading the material removed diameter instead of actual diameter of the part, (I would always use it to show diameter of the part by thinking of a 8 as a 2 and a 6 as a 4, etc.), I finally made a new X dial. I also have a Metric Slide and not only...

www.practicalmachinist.com

As far as I know, all CNC is done in diameter of the part.

The 10EE scale works both ways, material removed or material remaining. For your example 1.000-.207=.793 material removed, or .750+.043=.793, material remaining. You just have to subtract one .250 dial rev first for material remaining. I do it both ways, whichever is convenient at the time. That is if I don't use the DRO.

The tailstock is material removed which seems pretty natural. I just wish the scale on the tailstock ram had a better index mark.