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1850 lincoln milling machine how it was use (repost cause error in the previous post)

Giu

Plastic
Joined
Feb 2, 2022
I'm a machining enthusiast (hobby) and I own a lathe and a milling machine (chinese import branded.. hope you understand).

Reading the Gingery book on "build your own milling machine" I discover that the horizontal milling was the "starting point" for the milling technology as we know today.

I'm very fascinated by ancient machinery, the gingery book shows the "lincoln miller" a machine without overarm.

Milling Machines

what attract my attention is how could be set up a machine like this ???

seams to me that for set the spindle height you have to operate 2 independent wheels ?? and then set the "tailstock" with another control...
so what i cannot figure out is how they get all the bushings on the same horizontal line and parallel to the table (I suppose it will be the correct setup).

any ideas of sources for detailed drawing or instructions ??

thank you
sorry for bad english i cannot manage to change title
 

Robert Lang

Stainless
Joined
Apr 3, 2007
Location
Minneapolis, MN
seams to me that for set the spindle height you have to operate 2 independent wheels ??
so what i cannot figure out is how they get all the bushings on the same horizontal line and parallel to the table

On the early mills, you operated the large gear/handwheel below,
which then turned the two small gears, which are attached to screws that bear upon the bottom of the two spindle bearings,
to raise and lower both spindle bearings at the same time.

Rob
 

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Jim Christie

Titanium
Joined
Mar 14, 2007
Location
L'Orignal, Ontario Canada
I seem to remember a thread with some pictures of an old Lincoln type mill on this forum years ago but I can't seem to turn it up in the Forum Search feature.
There is a little about them here but it doesn't really show the feature pointed out by Robert Lang that you were asking about .
International Library of Technology; a series of textbooks for persons engaged in the engineering professions and trades, or for those who desire information concerning them : International Textbook Company : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive
Maybe someone will remember one of the older threads on this type of mill.
I didn't review it carefully but here is a link to an article on older milling machines that I saved a while ago.
Unfortunately the pictures are not too clear.
Machinery. v.2 1895-1896. - Full View | HathiTrust Digital Library
another article here and scroll down
Machinery. v.2 1895-1896. - Full View | HathiTrust Digital Library
Jim
 
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Giu

Plastic
Joined
Feb 2, 2022
thank you all for the valuable information.

now that I've noticed the wheel under the bench... it make sense... never saw this picture and in other pictures it wasn't clear that the wheel is in contact with two others little gears corresponding at the bushing positions.

Just because I'm curious.. in a setup like this let's say we set the "tailstock" at lower height in respect to the spindle, there is a possibility to "mill between centers" ? so a straight mill can perform an inclined cut ?
 

Joe in NH

Diamond
Joined
Jul 28, 2007
Location
Stratham, Cow Hampshire
The 1960s book "History of the Milling Machine" by Woodbury is the "tell all" on the development of the milling machine. Seen on Amazon as "not available" History of the Milling Machine: A Study in Technical Development: Woodbury, Robert S.: 9780262730037: Amazon.com: Books it actually is seen frequently from the used book sellers such as found on Abebooks.com or Ebay.

Some originals are pricey - some are not. AND - it is possible to get this as a "combination book" titled "Studies in the History of Machine Tools," which takes in the lathe, the milling machine, grinding machines, and perhaps more. Surprisingly, the combo book is more easily found, and is frequently priced LESS than any one of the singular books, and certainly less than the individual books combined.

It's a little technical. One will read, and have to turn back a page or three to see a pix of the actual machine to catch the discussion. IIRC, he has discussion of the development of the relative motion of parts: which are "adjust" and which developed into "driven" traverse.

One of those books you put near the nightstand, and pull up and read and absorb four or five pages before Morpheus has his way with you.

The end of the previous discussion of the Phoenix Mill is shown at https://www.practicalmachinist.com/...toration-164642/?highlight=Phoenix+Iron+Works

"Curator" of that thread is the curator of collection at the "Canadian Museum of Making" who purchased the mill from board member "Acornut" in another thread. The completed/restored mill currently exists alongside other period tools and is shown online at their Website. Machines Gallery - The Canadian Museum of Making Page 4 of this mostly.

Lotta nice machines done up right. A gift to the next generation.

Hope they're smart enough to appreciate it.

Joe in NH
 

Robert Lang

Stainless
Joined
Apr 3, 2007
Location
Minneapolis, MN
Just because I'm curious.. in a setup like this let's say we set the "tailstock" at lower height in respect to the spindle, there is a possibility to "mill between centers" ? so a straight mill can perform an inclined cut ?

The short answer to this is no.

Rob
 

thermite

Diamond
Just because I'm curious.. in a setup like this let's say we set the "tailstock" at lower height in respect to the spindle, there is a possibility to "mill between centers" ? so a straight mill can perform an inclined cut ?

Meah.. yes. See miter gears, crown gears, and "universal joints". Preferably "constant velocity". Most modern motorcars use several.

But that's just "speculative". Mostly.

Horizontal-mostly mills with movable axis, add-on all-angle, "some" angle, or right-angle heads and/or slewable in yaw tables came to exist where enough need existed.

More vertical mills than not can at least swivel in one axis. Many can commonly do two. "Planetary" articulation exists as well.

There is seldom a need to angle the axis of tool rotation on a horizontal, though. Surely not on small parts. But see also CNC "machining centres", bridge, portal, and gantry mills.

Then, or NOW, where the work is small enough to go onto a "table" that traverses - OR rotates.. or angles ("universal" and "trunnion") or some combination of the above...

.. rather than sits still whilst the cutter-head(s) travel around it - as if deranged woodpeckers were sculpting a massive block of silicone-rubber into the shape of Miss Teenage Armenia's abundant ass..or the stamping dies for a 1950's Kaiser "Manhattan".. the mill-hand simply angles and secures the WORK when setting it up for a cut.

Easier that way. Saves a lot of silicone-rubber as well. Not to mention the sanity of woodpeckers. Kaiser motorcar's can get their own damned cawfee...

You'd have to ken "Cherrying", "Kellering", or simply CNC and live tooling?

"Reading more" could do you a similar service as to asking more appropriate questions?

"Form follows function" and milling in general isn't often classified "Top Secret", after all.

A Short History of Machine Tools by L.T.C. Rolt

For preparation

Whether it can be done WELL or NOT.. It has been "attempted", and more than just the one time.

Lathes + Machine Tool Archive

Read ALL OF Tony's marvelous archives. That can keep you put of pubs, brothels, and drug dens until you are too damned OLD to remember why you would want to go there.

DAMHIKT
 

Robert Lang

Stainless
Joined
Apr 3, 2007
Location
Minneapolis, MN
Just because I'm curious.. in a setup like this let's say we set the "tailstock" at lower height in respect to the spindle, there is a possibility to "mill between centers" ? so a straight mill can perform an inclined cut ?

Again the answer to this is no.

Remember that we are talking about an 1850's Lincoln Milling Machine, not modern mills or CNC.
Aside from the problem of driving the milling cutter, on an arbor between centers, why would you want to do this.
If you want to do an inclined cut with a straight cutter, simply incline the work piece.

Rob
 

thermite

Diamond
Again the answer to this is no.

Remember that we are talking about an 1850's Lincoln Milling Machine, not modern mills or CNC.
Aside from the problem of driving the milling cutter, on an arbor between centers, why would you want to do this.
If you want to do an inclined cut with a straight cutter, simply incline the work piece.
zzzz
Rob

Who cares "why"? Folks just do stuff.

Trivial exercise on a design Burke may have COPIED from some other player's OLDER mill as-of 1903 for what became the #4 AKA /B-100-4.

Repurposed Hook, Spicer, better-yet, Rzeppa joint on #9 B&S tail, arbour, rigid-enough outbaord support and you have it.

What might it be GOOD for?

Separate question.

:D

A MILL is... whatever someone with a need, a dream, time, money, skill, or some combination or all of the above NEEDS it to be.

See Abene and Van Norman, but not-only.
 
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