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A36 steel milling help

Hardplates

Stainless
Joined
May 8, 2019
Location
What once was a free country
I've been thinking about doing that, just have not had time to tinker yet. I literally just made my first parts on it a couple weeks go. The compressor issue never happened till the last batch. I'm slowly learning the quirks of my setup.

Who is the dynapath/yaskawa guru that can help with that? I've bugged ZPS and dynapath a lot while getting this going. I think they need a break from me.

Do you have the manuals? Should be under spindle parameters. What model controller is it?
 

bastarddsm

Aluminum
Joined
Feb 18, 2014
Location
Southern Illinois University
Unfortunately no, All I have is the dynapath programming manual. It's a Yaskawa 626VM3. I have seen a manual for it online a while back, but only looked for trying to make it run on single phase (can't). So, I suspose that's the path. Go find that again and figure it out. I've been getting by on my current methods so I have been trying to put out other fires first, since I wasn't even sure that I could do what I wanted to.
 

1953chevB

Cast Iron
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
I'm sure this is pretty trivial to many of you, but, I have a few parts to make out of what I assume is A36 structural steel. These are hitch parts for tractor pulling. The customer has supplied a 1.5"x8"x36" bar of hot rolled steel, that I assume is A36, and I need to make 4 of these out of it. I'm just starting with this stuff, and have a pretty good handle on running aluminum but not steel.

I have a Tree VMC 1060,(16klbs, 40 taper, box way, 20hp, 40x24 for those who don't know) and it's on a 15hp rpc, so I don't have all the spindle power available. I have 2 china 6" vices. I don't have much budget for tooling at this time. I bought a couple 3/4" 6 flute carbide endmills, and a few 1/2" ones as well. I

What's the best plan of attack? Minimal tooling expense is favored over quickness, I don't have a lot of other work to do on the machine right now. I also have tons of other stuff to do while this is cutting, so it needs to not need babysat.

My plan was saw cut the bar into blocks just a bit over 8". Put the jaws on the outside of the vice, and set them on the vice, grabbing the saw cuts and square up the as rolled sides so I have something to locate off. After that turn them 90* and square up the saw cut on one side. Then profile it down to a little over half depth. Probably use a drill to start the hole, then endmill to carve the pocket down to a little over half depth. Flip it over, then start the profile and pocket routine over. I planned on making a negative of the part I could bolt on a 90* angle plate to hold it to drill and then thread mill the bolt holes.

I have no idea on depth of cut and speed. Only steel I've cut has been on a bridgeport, and it was slow and suck, so I have no idea what to do on a real machine. I planned on running the 3/4 6 flute since it's the biggest thing I have that will fit in the corners and and it has the right corner radius. How deep and how fast should I be running it? Should I be using a different tool? Should I use coolant, it has flood and has QC 215C in the machine.

View attachment 296231
crappy drawing it does not list the material on it.
suggestions
secondly contact the customer and ask them for the exact steel & and which condition its in (annealed or heat treated)
do you know any one with a Rockwell hardness checker , verify the exact hardness.
then based on the material and hardness , look up the starting feeds and speeds, in the catalog specified by the
manufacture of the tools purchase, use the over ride to slow the spindle and feed to 10-20% and work your way up from there.

this is a very simple and wide open part, should be fine.

I have my opinion on how to run it but the guys here are better at than I am.
 

Hardplates

Stainless
Joined
May 8, 2019
Location
What once was a free country
Unfortunately no, All I have is the dynapath programming manual. It's a Yaskawa 626VM3. I have seen a manual for it online a while back, but only looked for trying to make it run on single phase (can't). So, I suspose that's the path. Go find that again and figure it out. I've been getting by on my current methods so I have been trying to put out other fires first, since I wasn't even sure that I could do what I wanted to.

VS-626 VM3 Descriptive Manual - Yaskawa

page 165 would be a good place to start looking. If I had to guess C1-10 could likely be the parameter for accel. I've only ever done this on Fanuc and Mitu controls and drives so take what I say with caution.

If it were me I would prefer to adjust it from the controller rather than the drive itself, but that can't be done on all machines. I don't know which Delta control you have so its tough to look up.
 

bastarddsm

Aluminum
Joined
Feb 18, 2014
Location
Southern Illinois University
VS-626 VM3 Descriptive Manual - Yaskawa

page 165 would be a good place to start looking. If I had to guess C1-10 could likely be the parameter for accel. I've only ever done this on Fanuc and Mitu controls and drives so take what I say with caution.

If it were me I would prefer to adjust it from the controller rather than the drive itself, but that can't be done on all machines. I don't know which Delta control you have so its tough to look up.

Yep that's the book I found before. It's a delta 50. I've kinda wanted to try rigid tap, but figured this issue would probably cause quite a bit of trouble. Side note, will screwing with the drive to slow down the ramp rate, will that mess up rigid tap?
 

BT Fabrication

Stainless
Joined
Nov 3, 2019
Yep that's the book I found before. It's a delta 50. I've kinda wanted to try rigid tap, but figured this issue would probably cause quite a bit of trouble. Side note, will screwing with the drive to slow down the ramp rate, will that mess up rigid tap?

I would probably be fixing the power supply issue first, sounds like you are running on a 50A circuit.
for a 20HP mill you need a 30HP RPC to power it.

as if its A36, it cuts like butter with anything. HSS or Carbide mills are cheap. both will cut, just HSS i would suggest MQL or flood coolant. as once the cutter gets hot, it just anneals it and starts getting dull quickly.

I have a 3 HP manual mill and carbide cuts like butter even at 30IPM and 1800 RPM. HSS only liked about 650rpm and 10 ipm
 

Ox

Diamond
Joined
Aug 27, 2002
Location
West Unity, Ohio
Well, I'm not concerned with the application as I was just asked to make the part, not design it.
And since I didn't even follow the few reply's surrounding the actual "how to make" question, then I guess that I will inject how I see it:

I would stand the part up in the vice and mill the 3:00 side to clean-up.
Flip over and bring 9:00 in to spec - whatever that is...
Maybe that dim is off the print that we see, or maybe you need to trig it out?
Looks ridiculously dimensioned to me, but ...

Zero value in squaring up the other two sides. *

Go ahead and lay it down on the movable jaw like you said.
However - hopefully you already know this, but apparently some others don't:
Put the jaw on the front side of the moveable with the counterbores hidden so that you are compressing the counterbore, not pulling on it, and use some 2" bolts, or at least 1.5" long ones.

Make a new back jaw (soft is fine) and have it only 3" wide and 1" thick.

Put the 3:00 side of the drawing to the back jaw.
Slip a cpl "thin" parrallels under the part - laying down - to git the part up off the moveable segment 1/8".
Actually - a cpl pieces of (sacrificial) 1/8" cold 1018 would be best if you have access to that - so that your tools don't hit your parrallels.
At this point your front jaw will only be catching an 1/8".
That may be enough if you don't push it. (or crash it for that matter?)
Otherwise - maybe you want to make a new jaw for up front too???

From this point - you can doo all the OD, the through pocket, and the top pocket all in one clamping.

Now flip it over and place your 1/2" cutter at X1.24 (Or X-1.24 if you are a rebel)
Bring your tool down by hand and locate the part agginst the cutter and tighten the vise.

Finish the second side pocket.

Use your 3/4" tools for the OD and the through pocket.
Use the 1/2" for the rest.

Note that the print does not spec it, but it looks like they are wanting (or at least accepting?) a .030 rad on the blind pockets.


That's how I would doo it, but I'm just a dumb farmer out in the middle of the corn field, so follow directions with spoon full of sugar.



EDIT:

You will use these "new" jaws again one day.
This is not lost tooling expense, and won't take any longer to make than squaring the other sides of 4 pcs that you are going to mill away later anyway.




* Die Science: Unnecessary detail work can cut into your stamping profits



-----------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox
 
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ss_user

Aluminum
Joined
Jun 2, 2013
Location
WA USA
Oh! More fun. If it is A36 then pretty much the only controlled spec is yield at 36 ksi. That is the figure that counts when the part is in tension. If in compression the use tensile. I'm in a love affair right now with AlCrN coated cutters. My local machine shop says he got a mile of path with the roughing and another mile with the finisher. Will have to follow up with the rest of his cutting parameters. I have no idea what material he was cutting.
About the only good thing about A36 is that is welds well. ;-)
 

laggeddag

Aluminum
Joined
May 21, 2016
evaluate the geometry you will need to cut and make a best guess at what a reasonable toolpath will probably look like (radial and axial depths and chip thickness)

combine that with some conservative numbers from a feed/speed calc

make some test cuts that are usefully similar to what you would figured out from the first step

if all goes well incrementally increase radial/axial/chip thickness, tune rpm to reduce bad effects

make sure you have EXCELLENT workholding or as good as you can get, dont compromise

most likely you will only run into trouble tuning axial full width plunging but maybe you can avoid that by predrilling or what not
 








 
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