Advice for a younger generation.

[mhajicek]

I would say the number 1 skill to develop is sales. Making the parts is often easy enough after you have a PO. A clever person can trudge through it even if they are a novice. Getting the PO in the first place is what takes skill or divine luck. Finding a sales job might be more helpful than becoming a machine operator.

I'm going to disagree with you on that one. If you have the skills, and people know you have the skills, the work will come. No salesmanship needed.

 

[Garwood]

I'm going to disagree with you on that one. If you have the skills, and people know you have the skills, the work will come. No salesmanship needed.

I agree that is true currently, but I don't believe it was that way pre-pandemic.

When the supply of machine shops outpaces the demand then your salesman's hat is more important than your skill.

 

[michiganbuck]

Don't buy basket case machines.

 

[F35Machinist]

I'm going to disagree with you on that one. If you have the skills, and people know you have the skills, the work will come. No salesmanship needed.

Marketing yourself to make sure people know you have the skills is the salesmanship. Finding customers that are even open to new vendors requires effort and skill. Bigger customers have approved vendor lists that they can't work outside of. Many of them rarely if ever add names to the list. Presumably, a brand new shop would have no existing customers and would have to find all new work.

 

[ttrager]

Hello, hope this is the proper forum for this dialogue. I am a younger man, 29, interested in diving into the manufacturing industry and launching my own buisness. I would like to start a conversation on what wisdom/tips some of the older folks in the manufacturing/metal-working industry would view as important to pass on to the up and coming generation. I mean this in the broadest of sense; there is only so much one can read in a book... and I am personally fascinated by the wisdom of older, fellow, craftsman. Hope this will be a fun thread where we can all walk away feeling a little wiser and accomplished

You have to layout and understand the three dynamics that either drive success or contribute to failure depending on what is being handled well or handled poorly. You have to learn to monitor, manage, and CALIBRATE each as needed.

1) Business Sense. This covers all aspects of running the business. Accounting, purchasing, Customers, evaluating the market, etc.

2) Technical. What products are to be made, what machinery is needed, what inspection tools are required, what machinist skills/disciplines are needed by employees.

3) Leadership and Management. This one cannot be underestimated, but in my experience very often is. This is because we have all sorts of distinct ways to measure technical performance on tasks, and almost none for Leadership and Management.

This is "The People Thing". And regardless of industry, including the bluest of Blue Collar, you will come to find that virtually every single instance of failures or problems, as well as great successes, are directly traceable to People Issues of some kind. That job just get scrapped because the machine failed to repeat? People Problem (as example) because someone didn't perform the necessary PM when they should have. That job just get scrapped because the wrong material was cut up and used and no one noticed? Either someone failed to mark the steel correctly when received or the Supplier themselves sent the wrong steel with the right paperwork because one of their hi-lo drivers grabbed a wrong bundle when shipping (real occurrence where I'm at).

"Leadership and Management" is often overlooked in the "fog of War" during job production. People are getting stuff done, no time for anything else. Supervisors or "bosses" are busy checking on their delivery numbers heads down in that, or buying new fancy machines while black-boxing in their heads the overhead necessary to implement them and get people trained (focused on the purchase, not enough on the impacts on the floor).

Consider the infinitely repeated refrain we hear throughout our lifetimes working: Success or Grief at work is almost always talked about in terms of a really good "Boss" or "Boss Problems", or "that guy sure knows what he's doing" vs "Worker Problems". #1 and #2 above are the more easily picked fruit on the tree in relation to #3. Don't fall for that dismissing #3 as a get to it when you can.

All three of the above, all three, are managed well in every successful business on the planet.

Read all you can, consider and learn all you can about "The People Thing" in addition to Business and Technical.

 

[EdDanzer]

Having started my business in 1975 at age 19 during a recession and still running a small machine and welding business at age 67 it is important to be highly motivated. It is best to have a type A personality with a high level of personal integrity and be willing and able to work long hours when you start out. I still work 50+ hour weeks. Chances are you will either have too much work or not enough to hire people and keep them working. You will spend most of your money on tools and equipment so plan on giving up all your hobbies and vacations for 5 to 10 years. When the next recession hits you will face many difficult decisions. You will have to make decisions when the best decision is still a bad choice. Try to be diversified in the types of customer base you work for as every industry will have ups and downs.

If you do good work at a reasonable price and warranty your mistakes, sales ability is not as important at broad skills and integrity.

Some customers will be slow paying and you will have some bad debts to cover. Make sure you work with your vendors when things get bad and pay them before you pay yourself. Without good suppliers you cannot be successful.

 

[jscpm]

You have it in reverse order. You don't "start a business" and then try to figure out what to do.

The way successful businesses start is that checks start piling up on your desk, until finally you say, "Gee, I better start a business so I can deposit all these checks in something other than my personal account."

If you are young, your priority should be building your skills and abilities until you can do something nobody else can do better. For most people this never occurs. For me it did not occur until I was over 50 years old, and I am an ivy league graduate who was ranked #13 in my high school class of 525, and it was an elite high school, one of the top rated high schools in the country. Getting the picture? Making money on your own is no easy thing.

One of my employees (a college graduate) expressed interest in doing some special advanced work for me, for which I offer extra high pay. So, I give him a book and I tell him, "You need to learn the stuff in this book." It is not a particularly hard book, nothing he couldn't do--just a matter of WORK and applying himself to get through the book of about 250 pages. So, the next week, I am like, "How are you doing in the book?" He has read like one page in the book. Every week this whole summer I am asking him, "How is the book going?" It's the whole summer and he has read just bits and pieces out of the first couple of chapters in like a 20 chapter book. One time he asked me, "How long would it take you to read this book?" I answered it took me one day of solid work to read that book and that I knew everything in it which is the truth. You can see the pattern here: businesses are run by a few old guys like me with high IQs and demon-like ability to work and the employees are, well, the employees.

 

[john.k]

There are that many specialists advertizing online for debt 'elimination" services ,and the machinists ability to collect payment electronically either pre,during ,or COD,that there should be no bad debts........but I do know of very many shops that have been landed with very big losses by large companies going bust.........everyone in the trade should realize that an order from a big company isnt as good as money in the bank ,until the money is in the bank.

 

[Ox]

You have it in reverse order. You don't "start a business" and then try to figure out what to do.

The way successful businesses start is that checks start piling up on your desk, until finally you say, "Gee, I better start a business so I can deposit all these checks in something other than my personal account."

If you are young, your priority should be building your skills and abilities until you can do something nobody else can do better. For most people this never occurs. For me it did not occur until I was over 50 years old, and I am an ivy league graduate who was ranked #13 in my high school class of 525, and it was an elite high school, one of the top rated high schools in the country. Getting the picture? Making money on your own is no easy thing.

One of my employees (a college graduate) expressed interest in doing some special advanced work for me, for which I offer extra high pay. So, I give him a book and I tell him, "You need to learn the stuff in this book." It is not a particularly hard book, nothing he couldn't do--just a matter of WORK and applying himself to get through the book of about 250 pages. So, the next week, I am like, "How are you doing in the book?" He has read like one page in the book. Every week this whole summer I am asking him, "How is the book going?" It's the whole summer and he has read just bits and pieces out of the first couple of chapters in like a 20 chapter book. One time he asked me, "How long would it take you to read this book?" I answered it took me one day of solid work to read that book and that I knew everything in it which is the truth. You can see the pattern here: businesses are run by a few old guys like me with high IQs and demon-like ability to work and the employees are, well, the employees.

And when he says "old guys like him", he's not kidd'n either!
I was under the impression that we are almost completely out of vets from the Second Great War, but here this fella is of the graduating class of 525!




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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[Reddog2]

Would you be interested in living in Reno NV. I am a retied design engineer doing prototype product development on my own machines. Manual lathe, Bridgeport mill, cnc mill, 2 cnc lathes and support equipment. The machines are not in use most of the time, and I could use some company. I figured on finding a retired machinist. It would be a good location to get your feet wet in the business without major investment. I know a few shops that might feed you some overload business. As I have had a few offers of outside work. A temporary e-mail for me is [email protected]

I read this forum on occasion and the advise is often quite good.

 

[Sam I]

I think a lot depends on your area, who your customers are likely to be and what skills and machines you currently have access to. You also need to think about support. Accounting for instance is an area I know very little about. This has caused me problems in the past before hiring a good accounting firm. But it's another expense and the expenses add up quickly. Not a problem when the work is flowing in but, for me at least, there are two quiet spells that come round every year. School holidays mostly when all the purchasing agents are out of the office and everything seems to move more slowly. From your original post it sounds more like an interest you have so why not take it up as a hobby before starting a business? It's one thing to learn the machines, make a good product etc. but turning that into a profitable business is a completely different game.

If you've got the choice you'd be better finding a niche and making some products for that market as has been suggested. Do it part time while you can and broaden your range until launching a full time business venture makes sense.