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Advice on first time being burned

RandoTL

Plastic
Joined
May 19, 2020
Small Claims Court does not allow lawyers or witnesses.

Do not assume that because you think you are right(certainly seems so) that you will win. You could lose and that will cost you,including their lawyer.

Small Claims Court does not allow lawyers, nor witnesses. Documentation, SOLID documentation is what wins.

Although not a machinist, I've sued several people for exactly that same thing: refusal to complete payment on delivered work. And with documentation of the agreement, documentation of the work, documentation of the delivery, I won every time.

And, it was all simple. However, there are caveats: small claims can't be brought across state lines, and there are limits to the amount claimed. It often takes a while for the case to go through, and sometimes the f*ckers will simply not pay up even after a court order. But, there are ways even in that case...the court can be very helpful in these matters, and having the county Sheriff show up to serve them papers and seize assets can be a fun thing.
 

triumph406

Titanium
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Location
ca
Company I've done some (exceptionally profitable work) for just laid off 30% of it's workforce, got about $6500 in invoices outstanding.

Wonder whether I'll be like the OP and coming here and crying like a baby if they don't pay?

Probably have to put this in the loss column of the win/loss table of work paid/unpaid.

Not the first time it's happened. Probably won't be the last.
 

triumph406

Titanium
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Location
ca
Apparently I'm going to be paid so panic over.

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edited by removing last paragraph
 
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otrlt

Guest
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I'll go back to crying myself to sleep over the injustice the OP is suffering.

oh the humanity.....

Hello triump,

You seem to poke fun at the OP's problem, while gloating of your sudden resolve of your own business debacle.

That is not good... for you.

Don't step on any cracks on the sidewalk triumph.
 

triumph406

Titanium
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Location
ca
Hello triump,

You seem to poke fun at the OP's problem, while gloating of your sudden resolve of your own business debacle.

That is not good... for you.

Don't step on any cracks on the sidewalk triumph.

For the first time ever I agree with you, the last paragraph was not neccassary.
 

Newman109

Diamond
Joined
Sep 4, 2006
Location
Sacramento County, California, USA California
Small Claims Court does not allow lawyers, nor witnesses. Documentation, SOLID documentation is what wins.

Although not a machinist, I've sued several people for exactly that same thing: refusal to complete payment on delivered work. And with documentation of the agreement, documentation of the work, documentation of the delivery, I won every time.

And, it was all simple. However, there are caveats: small claims can't be brought across state lines, and there are limits to the amount claimed. It often takes a while for the case to go through, and sometimes the f*ckers will simply not pay up even after a court order. But, there are ways even in that case...the court can be very helpful in these matters, and having the county Sheriff show up to serve them papers and seize assets can be a fun thing.

The limit on small claims in California is $10,000. Witnesses are allowed. Plaintiffs may appeal a loss but defendants may not.

Even with a judgment, a plaintiff will have difficulty collecting, especially if the defendant is a corporation.
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
The good old $2 paid up corporation.....the maximum they stand to lose is the cost of the company registration fees ,about $2500 ,when the company is deregistered.........which as I said earlier is where the bikies come in......you cant hurt a company,but the directors can feel a lot of pain.
 

neilho

Titanium
Joined
Mar 23, 2006
Location
Vershire, Vermont
Small Claims Court does not allow lawyers, nor witnesses. Documentation, SOLID documentation is what wins.

... having the county Sheriff show up to serve them papers and seize assets can be a fun thing.

The law for small claims, and enforcement, varies state to state. New Hampshire will put people in jail, eventually, for not paying a small claims judgment, Vermont, no way. Eventually, they'll send the sheriff out to inventory assets for an auction to pay the judgment, though. That was satisfying. :D
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
The biggest losers in small claims are the solid competent trades and businesses who assume the court will see the nonsense in a ridiculous claim by a plaintiff for release from payment,and for damages.....Very often they come unprepared for the spurious documentation presented as evidence by the plaintiff.
 

PDW

Diamond
Joined
Jul 24, 2006
Location
Australia (Hobart)
The biggest losers in small claims are the solid competent trades and businesses who assume the court will see the nonsense in a ridiculous claim by a plaintiff for release from payment,and for damages.....Very often they come unprepared for the spurious documentation presented as evidence by the plaintiff.

I got involved in something like that 20+ years back. The bastards, I found out, immediately counter-sued for fraud if you went to court to recover money owed. The fraud case had to take priority so then they'd endlessly stall and run up the costs.

Once I found this out I went in on the weekend, removed all the servers they hadn't paid for and took all copies of the source code I was developing for them with me. Told them that as I'd never been paid anything, the contract wasn't enforceable and to sue me. Meanwhile good luck getting the source code back.

I never did get paid but they went down the tubes. Lesson learned. I never started another software development project without an up front payment.

PDW
 

Old-Red

Plastic
Joined
Jun 28, 2020
I know I am late to the thread and you've probably settled the problem one way or the other. Did you ever talk to the guy that ordered the parts or the owner of the company? As others have noted troublesome customers can become good business if you can solve your mutual problems.

I worked for International Harvester from 1970 through 1972 now and then someone would get the president of IH on the with a complaint and it would get fixed with all possible haste often by the people that had been stalling the customer.

Until you talk with the person that ordered the parts or/and the owner of the company working out billing problems with office workers can be like pushing a log chain in bin 6ix feet overhead while sitting on the floor. Many so-called accounts only know how to punch keys on a computer putting numbers in a computer program. They don't know what they mean and have no understanding of accounting or the business where they work.

In the early 80s, I wrote accounting software for small businesses for Radio Shack computers. The bookkeeper of that time had a good grasp of what they did and what the available software was missing. It was appalling how much bad debt was on some of their books.

If you have collection problems with a small to medium-sized business you need to discuss it with someone in management that can pay the bill before taking any action to eleinate human screw ups.
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
Good example of risk in Oz right now.....multinational construction co has cut loose its Oz subsidiary with $200 million+ losses,due to various legal issues.....about things like view from apartments............anyhoo,maybe 1000 subcontractors will be bankrupt in the short term.........now these are likely good people,but if any of them owe you money,then you are not going to get it .
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
Condev this month,Probuild last month.....estimated 80% of the construction industry is trading into insolvency.......aaaand....Angry subcontractor trashes $5 m penthouse with an axe.........nope not mine...my penthouse is safely hidden inside a falling down hundred year old mansion where no one would suspect.
 








 
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