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Are there to many 1 man shops for young folks to compete?

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CarbideBob

Diamond
Joined
Jan 14, 2007
Location
Flushing/Flint, Michigan
...
Teach, I was thinking about your little snakebite adventure, if that had happened to me my bill would have said "thank you for doing business with BC/BS, !
I hate snakes. Tiny or big.
Dog took on what looked at first to be a big tree branch and then it jumped.
I had never seen a snake this big in Michigan as most are six foot or so tops. Call me a liar but this the things you see in zoo size.
My Sami is all this is my woods and rattle all you want.
Grabbed a tree branch to separate them and I am now worried. The dog did jump out of several strikes by must be luck.
 

Ox

Diamond
Joined
Aug 27, 2002
Location
West Unity, Ohio
I've never seen/heard of a rattler around here, but not sure whynot?
Too wet?

They got'm in the SW.
They got'm in Montana.
(Not a frost line thing)

I've seen dead baby's in the sands of Elkhart, Indiana.
(I have heard that those could have been something else - false rattler - like fools gold?)

Never heard of them in Ohio or Mich tho?

Robert, check your mail


------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox
 

CarbideBob

Diamond
Joined
Jan 14, 2007
Location
Flushing/Flint, Michigan
...

Never heard of them in Ohio or Mich tho?

Ox

No? As a kid my neighbor's shed up north full of "trophy tails".
Grandma took one with a hoe when I was small.
Normally not very big at only 3 foot max usually in my woods.
This one was so huge so maybe not native. Easy well, well over 10 foot.
Dad told me to never shoot one as they could still bite blown in half with a shotgun. Not sure if that true or not.
Mid lower peninsula. They seem to like the CCC planted pine tree areas and sandy soil.
Bob
 

Ox

Diamond
Joined
Aug 27, 2002
Location
West Unity, Ohio
Actually - they say that a dead rattler can still kill you if you get caught in their jaw somehow.

The TV shows all say to bury the heads so's that doesn't happen.

Only thing I ever heard around here is blue racers, and that's been 35 yrs ago at that!


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox
 
Joined
Apr 14, 2018
Location
Airstrip One, Oceania
Only thing I ever heard around here is blue racers, and that's been 35 yrs ago at that!
You must be in the green part ?

Copperhd.jpg


Copperhead Snake Fact Page- What's That Snake? - Ohio Public Library Information Network
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
Not digs. Like I said, none of my comments are specifically directed at YOU the person, just a generalized "you" being people roughly your age who look down on my generation.

And I haven't spiked the hair in like 2 years. At this point, I'm just growing it out so I can donate it to Wigs 4 Kids (They're like Locks for Love, but they don't charge ANYTHING for giving wigs to kids with cancer) before I shave it all off and accept that I'm going to be bald by 40 :D. Then it'll be back to the old cueball look, same as you. Have you tried that stupid little thing that looks like a mix between a hotwheels car and a razor?

Amazon.com: HeadBlade ATX Razor : Beauty & Personal Care

Schick Extreme 3 is my razor of choice. Even though I have been hit in it a few too many times I was fortunate to still have a very smooth head, so I can even shave my head with reckless abandon and usually not get cut.

As for those comments about you coming from the lazy generation I probably have also said a few things you missed.
I have said as a whole, my generation (grew up in the 70's) was lazier than the one of my parents and the parents of my peers, (grew up in the 40's and 50'). I could write a book as to why. First as time marches on, it becomes easier to survive. When my dad was a kid most people had ice boxes, not refrigerators, and they also had ringer wash machines and not clothes dyers. A lot of houses did not have central heat or AC. Space heaters, fire places and electric fans. The average kid of my dad's generation had a hell of a lot more chores than mine. Go back to my grandfather's generation and a kid pitched in even more, many never even attended High School, they got a full time job.

As for the evolution of work place laziness, of course automation has made it where you can still be productive, with out running around constantly. Also back in the day the slackers who work hard to avoid work did not have the options that they do today. It is a lot easier to conceal a cell phone than a newspaper, magazine, or portable TV.
I think if we had the available portable electronic devices back when I hit the working world, it would have flushed out a lot more goof offs.

Not me of course, there was no treatments, thankfully for what I probably had as a child all the way up to my mid 30's. I was wound a little too tight. I used to deal with it mostly by exercise and staying busy at work. To me staying busy also passed the time.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
I hate snakes. Tiny or big.
Dog took on what looked at first to be a big tree branch and then it jumped.
I had never seen a snake this big in Michigan as most are six foot or so tops. Call me a liar but this the things you see in zoo size.
My Sami is all this is my woods and rattle all you want.
Grabbed a tree branch to separate them and I am now worried. The dog did jump out of several strikes by must be luck.

If it was zoo size for it's species it was probably an escaped pet. Zoo snakes don't have to hunt for food, they are the snake version of the coach potato. Only 3 poisonous snake types here, rattlers, cotton mouths and copperheads, all easily identifiable. That is one nice thing about the USA all the poisonous snakes have similar shaped heads and the most common poisonous ones, as in rattlers also have rattles on their tails.

Look at some of the poisonous snakes in other countries, they are very difficult to identify. For a snake repellent tip, most hate ammonia. If you come across a bad snake stay at least it's body length away and chuck some liquid ammonia at it. I found this out by Googling and it worked on a small copperhead, I chased it off into the woods. Of course this was after I chased off an adult a few weeks prior. The damn thing was lounging on the side entrance to my shop one summer morning. Not knowing about the ammonia trick I used a squeeze bottle of charcoal lighter fluid while holding a fireplace lighter. That seemed to work, but it did not move as fast as ammonia snake.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
If I were paying for health insurance I wouldn't have been able to afford to start my shop. I've got duct tape and superglue, that should suffice.

I had a friend who gave me some medical glue that had hit it's expiration date, when I told him I was super gluing cuts together that probably needed a stitch or two.
 

gwelo62

Aluminum
Joined
Sep 17, 2011
Location
ga,usa
Do not sell your house. Pay it off and then start saving the mortgage fee. You will soon be able to set yourself up. Being debt free puts you in control. I wish I was in your position.
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
My old granny lived with snakes in central queensland.....her favourite cure for snake was a long rod of spring steel....about 1/4" dia is whippy and wont bounce back off obstructions.....She had a hard and fast rule that no snake was to be shot inside the house......one night I found a python starting to eat the cat .....dumb cat was just whimpering....it could have shredded the snake,but was paralysed by fear.....I gave the snake a couple of whacks with the ramrod from a musket ,and it just folded up....No blood ,no holes in the wall ,no neighbours calling the cops.
 

mhajicek

Titanium
Joined
May 11, 2017
Location
Minneapolis, MN, USA
Fortunately a .013" endmill is unlikely to penetrate the glass and embed itself in my head when it breaks. And I have bone plates and screws laying round if I need them.
 

Covenant MFG

Plastic
Joined
May 26, 2021
Location
Greater Sacramento
I haven't read through the entire thread yet but just chiming in to say I love it, encouraging and depressing advice alike lol.

I'm in much the same shoes as the OP- 22 yrs old, been programming and setting up at a nice established shop for a few years, paid cash a few months ago for a decent shape TM-1 (yeah yeah I know) and have shipped the first few jobs. Fun, exciting, stressful and learning the gosh dang quoting and job planning stuff the hard way.
 
O

otrlt

Guest
I'm getting a new job in the new year , I am young and have alot of experience and I know enough about quoting that I have a hard time finding anyone that can do small or big parts with the same speed because I stress about making the company money on top of my wage.

For my age I have yet to meet anyone with the experience in cnc machining atleast in ontario and if you sit me infront of a cnc machine and any software, my understanding of the fundamentals and the use of machine I can figure out atleast any mills large or small , horizontal or vertical and 3-5 axis no problem.

I have ran and helped a company understand there new 7 axis double arm plasma cutter for structural beams aswell as got a taste of the 3 spindle and auto saw machine for the same purpose. ( they over bought being new to the automation)

Lathes do not scare me and I have ran them but the last few companies they clearly scared the owners so they never acquired one even though we clearly had the work to do it.

I am tempted to sell my house thats nearly paid off and buy a shop now that shops are seemingly dropping in prices or atleast plateau ing and appearing on the market while house prices are still sky rocketing.

I have good chances at getting work and I know another companies word is essenty meaningless untill you have the work, but I have got good work for a previous employer, but im not sure if its just a fluke.
I can get some decent work from a couple companies and I can most likely afford a 2.5 or 3 thousand square foot shop with high ceiling paid for and maybe a new smaller 5 axis and a larger used 3 axis.

I know I can get some work enough to possibly not need to work for someone else but all I hear is the older guys running shops saying it is impossible to make a living but they have massive overhead and they all rent shops and don't put in alot of hours and most importantly do not buy new fast machines and alot dont even go beyond small or 3 axis machines for some sort of fear factor .

I feel like there's big opportunity for a young person with a bit of money to put up, and a hunger to put in the 20 hour days every day and undercut everyone and never send out, out of tolerance parts because they can get away with it. But a part of me feels like maybe there's something I dont see and these old guys are right , but when I know I can get work and I see the crazy over head and lack of investing and staying ahead of the curve and putting in the hours I feel like there wrong.

Anyways im just asking because there is a ton of 1 man shops out there who do charge lower rates because they are doing the work themselves not employing people but I also notice they all have used and small machines and outdated equipment.

Is there opportunity for young people with the balls to try and out compete and constantly invest in the best equipment while working at a fast pace to make a company? Or is it as terrible as it seems and there's no money and work is impossible to find and I just have some sheer luck that won't go further? Or are these older and in my opinion dinosaurs right and thats why alot of folks don't put capital back into there shops because these isn't anything to make aside from a comfortable wage going on your own. And are overhead costs Killing alot of small shops as well as not understanding today's best hiring practices and finding half decent workers?

I dont know if I need to just throw out this comfortable living and take the leap or if im gunna look back and regret not listening. I really believe there is and also needs to be for manufacturing to thrive in this country people with a real vigor for this industry but its hard not to pay attention when every shop owner says its shit

You are not real, you are not fooling me.
 

Spittingchips

Plastic
Joined
Dec 20, 2021
I am real and yes I live in ontario just outside of Toronto I also have a small piece of land out east in the middle of nowhere as a back up, reading all these comments leaves me still without anseweres to some degree but seeing how many people have a hard time believe a young guy can bust his ass and almost have a house paid off without help in one of the most expensive housing markets makes me feel that my work ethic is something that will probably keep me ahead . I am not asking this question to start a shop half assed like anyone else, at my age its either keep working for other people or if im going to do this I have to go the whole way. I dont want to make friends with other shops I want to undercut them and still make more by reducing machine times and overhead woch frankly sounds like allt of people here don't care about. Anyways I appreciate the comments keep them coming but no im not a troll I spent the last 11 years working every hour I good , I slept at ships, kept a toothbrush in my locker and worked for straight time instead of overtime if it was the only option. Im not some young beginner who doesn't even know the machines yet im just not sure how so many out of date folks are even getting any work specially running out or rented shops or there little garage. And a million dollar machine isn't my first goal, I would hope yo prove myself on 2 smaller machines and if I can jump into the large boring or machining centers. Aswell as having a fair sized shop and no there not complete shit holes, but there do need some tlc , atleast you can fit bigger machines in a shop . You guys are split between the pessimist and optimists but yeah if im doing this it isn't to do thing the way you are , its to undercut you and make better margins and put your garage machine shop out of competition. There is alot of work where I am located anywhere 100 kms around but you guys make it sound like there is no way to do jobs cheaper other than to do it for minimum wages and I dont know if yoh guys are blind or brilliant. I believe the former but its worth hearing you out
 
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