But how do you get the decision makers to understand? I am told what is wanted, and have to produce - something.
..........
They want a magic machine that will do it all.
This is going to be a long post, but bear with me...
Everyone wants the one machine to do it all.
How do you convince them? You have to show them.
Get a quote for...
Japanese 12" chuck CNC Lathe with 3" bar capacity, sub-spindle, y-axis, live tools, parts-catcher, bar feeder, 65kg robot with multiple end-of-arm tools to cover the entire range, safety perimeter guarding, turn-key integration for the whole shebang, and a couple months of paying the machine dealer's AE to program
EVERYTHING like they want.
$450-500k easily. Go mill-turn, and you're pushing $700-800k...
Build a tool library to run
EVERYTHING they want through that machine. Now, you have to fit it on a 12-station turret. Figure $4k for a 90* head live-tool, $2k for a straight live-tool. Capto tools are the only way to go for quick-change-over. The receivers are about $1k a piece, the heads are $250-300 a piece.
Say it takes about 3 minutes per turning tool to swap the Capto heads, and touch-off to the tool-setter. About 8 minutes a piece on the live tools. 5 minutes to change chuck-jaws. 10 minutes to change the robot's end-of-arm tooling. 10 minutes to change programs & verify offsets. 10 minutes to dial in the 1st part.
Then, do a time study on the cycle times of some of your high-runners. Make sure you do a bar-fed part, and a chucker part.
What you need to do then, is take... Total production time (5 days a week x 1/2/3 shifts) - Setup time = available production time x .75% efficiency = your total production capacity time. Remember to add extra setup time, to accommodate changing over between bar-fed jobs, and chucker jobs. Now, divide that production capacity time by part cycle time. Remember that cycle times will be a mix of bar-fed & chucker jobs.
What you'll end up with, is XXXXX chucker parts, and YYYYY bar fed parts produced per day/week/month/year, at $$$$$$$ capital investment.
There's the cost of their fantasy machine.
Now, to compare....
Get a quote on a machine for chucking work - a 12" CNC with y-axis live tools, and a sub-spindle if your work requires, plus the 65kg robot. My estimate is $350k for a Okuma/Mazak/Mori + Fanuc Robot, turn-keyed. Run the same exercise, but this time ONLY with the chucker-parts. Now, you have XXXXX chucker parts produced with $$$ capital investment.
You might even consider one of the inverted spindle lathes for the chucking work too, and eliminate the robot altogether...
And another quote on a 8-10" CNC with a collet nose, barfeeder, parts-catcher & live tools, y-axis & sub if you need them. $250k? Or even a big swiss machine if the parts will fit. Run the same exercise but only for the bar-fed parts. Now, you have YYYYY bar-fed parts for $$$ capital investment.
It is a lot of work, but it will be worth it. The winner might be surprising, or it may be tighter than you think.
I have some tools to help with all of this, but I'd probably have to charge in the "high priced consultant that's too expensive for them to ignore without looking foolish" range to take on a project such as this, in Oregon...
Best of luck - Don't be scared - you just have to try to *think* like them, and then be prepared to show them some data that they can't ignore.