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Can Anyone Recommend a Drill Bit Sharpening Machine?

eKretz

Diamond; Mod Squad
Joined
Mar 27, 2005
Location
Northwest Indiana, USA
Black Diamond's drawback is they need a separate "collet" for each size drill. A set of 1/16-1/2" will cost about $100. need a different set for fraction, letter, number drills. Not sure how much range each collet has. Maybe you can make things fit into the wrong system collets.
They are not really collets. There is one "master collet". which is a real collet with a draw thread to tighten it. All the rest are simply spacers with a outer and inner diameter to suit. They have a slit or two to allow them to closeup. Not too hard to make a few specials as needed. But small inner bores will be harder to get right.
Bill D

I see that as a benefit; the drill is held by a nearly fully circular bushing/collet so it's going to be held about as true as it can get. It's only a drawback if you buy a grinder without the accessories, which most here have mentioned. New bushings are pricy, and used ones don't come up that often. The grinder itself does a great job. I used one for decades at an employer's shop and liked it so much I bought my own.
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
I also have a Herbert Hunt ,big enough to do 4 " bits,if'n anyone ever had one ....my best is 3",never used ,but bought at an auction one day when the auctioneer held up two new 3" bits ,and lost his voice trying to get $300 ....I offered $25....and got them......Anyhoo ,the Herbert Hunt is surely overkill,but its value is in the WTF Is That? factor.......Someone suggested I should put a steam engine onto it to drive all the handles and wheels,and parts going in and out and round and round.
 
Joined
Nov 19, 2007
Location
marysville ohio
Another voice for the Black Diamond. Mine will do 1/16 to 3/4. It works SO much better than the Darex they had where I used to work. I bought mine complete with collets and cabinet from a guy on PM for less than 400.00 including shipping by Fastenal from Connecticut if I remember correctly. works better than any other grinder I have ever used.
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
The Oliver machine is nice ..it makes a special point with increasing clearance toward the centre,obviating the need for point thinning,far as I can see......If I had my druthers ,Id have an Oliver .........Another machine I recall was the Sellers...simple and well made,didnt need any collets or bushes,it had a special indexing mechanism with a thumbscrew that was all was needed in the range of sizes the machine was setup for.....Havent seen a Sellers in years.
 

lucky7

Stainless
Joined
Sep 6, 2008
Location
Canada
Probably pretty much unobtanium in your neck of the woods but I reckon the Clarkson device is nigh on unbeatable for drills from 1/8" to 5/8".

View attachment 331302

6 jaw chuck means no messing with finding the right collet. Simply insert the drill projecting 1/2" from the chuck with the edge to be sharpened horizontal, set so it just kisses the wheel, waggle up and down with the lever to do that edge. Move up so drill is clear of the wheel, release latch to flip 180°, repeat waggle and lift clear to inspect edges. Apply a touch of in-feed and repeat if need be.

I reckon 2 minutes max from walk up with blunt drill to walk away with sharp drill using a ruler to set projection. Bit quicker since I made the handy dandy official gauge.

Now that adequate quality and relatively inexpensive 6 jaw chucks can be gotten from the usual Far Eastern sources I'm surprised that no one has reworked the Clarkson device into a simple pure drill sharpener on a basic X-Y mount to bolt alongside a standard grinder.

the Kaindl BSG20 DRILL GRINDING MACHINE BSG 20/2 new is the nearest that I know of but I'm unconvinced by the suitability of the drill holder and setting methods for the unskilled.

Clive

Somewhat similar to a Clarkson is an Osborne. Also English made, also works well. Seems to be more common in Western Canada. No idea about OP’s area.

L7
 

camscan

Titanium
Joined
Sep 5, 2011
Location
Norfolk
If you have a fat wallet you should look at a Christen. Wonderful machine, does everything you could ever want with a drill.
 

projectnut

Stainless
Joined
Mar 4, 2006
Location
Wisconsin
On a whim I bought one of those back in the day from Home Depot to see what all the fuss was about.
I was already able to sharpen them by hand so if it was junk I wasn't out but only $30 or so.
I must have had one of the good ones because that thing worked perfectly for about 10 years and only struggled on drills that were 1/8 and smaller.

Then about 3 years ago I bought one of the "better" models and it's absolute garbage.

My original drill grinder was also a Drill Doctor 750 Classic. I bought in a pinch when someone stole a used Darex before I could pick it up form the shop I bought it from. Like yours it lasted about 10 years before giving up the ship. In my case it sharpened several thousand drills, but the last thousand or so took way too much time. The machine case had worn and warped making it tough to get the drill positioned in the collet for a proper grind. I also wore out and broke a number of the plastic collets

After about 10 years it was all but a paper weight and parts were nearly impossible to find. I kept putting the dull drills in a box for future sharpening. When the Black Diamond came along I had about 500 drills in the box. After setting it up I spent nearly a week in my spare time sharpening drills. It was a mind numbing experience I don't wish to repeat, but the results were excellent. Rather than repeat the seemingly endless job I'm now back to sharpening them when the box has around 50 that need sharpening. If all goes well, and I don't get too many interruptions the job can be completed in about an hour.
 

CarbideBob

Diamond
Joined
Jan 14, 2007
Location
Flushing/Flint, Michigan
A real and many years working machinist will swear by hand grinding a drill point on a bench grinder.
Fancy fixtures, fancy collets, fancy grinds, tip locators, Oh my.
Of good read is this:
Geometry of Single-point Turning Tools and Drills: Fundamentals and Practical Applications (Springer Series in Advanced Manufacturing): Astakhov, Viktor P.: 9781849960526: Amazon.com: Books
Holy crap what a price tag now.
A normal human like me will have to read it 6 or more times for it to make sense.
I keep going back and reading again on my vacations during laid back time on the beach. Each a new lightbulb but the wife not so happy with my attention buried in a book of chip formation.
Bob
 

eKretz

Diamond; Mod Squad
Joined
Mar 27, 2005
Location
Northwest Indiana, USA
I can hand grind just fine, but not at the speed and level of accuracy of the drill grinder. It splits points a hell of a lot faster than I can do by hand too.
 

projectnut

Stainless
Joined
Mar 4, 2006
Location
Wisconsin
Black Diamond's drawback is they need a separate "collet" for each size drill. A set of 1/16-1/2" will cost about $100. need a different set for fraction, letter, number drills. Not sure how much range each collet has. Maybe you can make things fit into the wrong system collets.
They are not really collets. There is one "master collet". which is a real collet with a draw thread to tighten it. All the rest are simply spacers with a outer and inner diameter to suit. They have a slit or two to allow them to closeup. Not too hard to make a few specials as needed. But small inner bores will be harder to get right.
Bill D

The Black Diamond I bought was missing #11, #13, and #16 collets/spacers. I made 7 new ones to replace the missing ones and add a few smaller sizes. It came with collets 1/8 - 3/4, #1 - #33, and a - Z. I added 1/16", 5/64", 3/32" and 7/64". I made the new ones out of 6061 aluminum. They probably won't last as long as the originals, but they'll probably outlast me.

I tried to order them from the new company. At the time they were $40.00 each. After 4 emails and the same number of phone calls without success I just made my own. They were easy enough to make. I just turned them on the lathe, drilled one size under, reamed to size and cut slots in a horizontal mill. I did have to make a fixture to hold them for cutting the slots.
 

CarbideBob

Diamond
Joined
Jan 14, 2007
Location
Flushing/Flint, Michigan
I can hand grind just fine, but not at the speed and level of accuracy of the drill grinder. It splits points a hell of a lot faster than I can do by hand too.

Hand grind almost always results in a uneven chip load.
This introduces a sideways force or vector which makes for an oversized hole.
At high feed it brings about snaking or curved.
Nothing worse than seeing a drill push out one thick and one thin chip string. A sure sign that bad things are going on.
Bob
 

eKretz

Diamond; Mod Squad
Joined
Mar 27, 2005
Location
Northwest Indiana, USA
Yes, it takes a lot of fiddling and checking to hand grind accurately, that's what I mean. It's a pretty big waste of time if you have access to a drill grinder. In a pinch I will do it but otherwise I go straight to the drill grinder.
 
Joined
Apr 14, 2018
Location
Airstrip One, Oceania
No idea what he is asking but I've seen them for $650 or so at auctions, 'cuz no one knows what they are ? ... really nice drill sharpener

CINCINNATI SPIROPOINT DRILL SHARPNER – TZSupplies.com

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p.s. Why does this same subject come up at least once a month ? Answers are always the same, doesn't 'search' work ?
 

eKretz

Diamond; Mod Squad
Joined
Mar 27, 2005
Location
Northwest Indiana, USA
Funny you bring up the Spiropoint. I was just teaching a pretty green kid on the lathe the other day and he needed to drill a hole, so I went to the rack to get him a drill that looked like it had a sharp point on it. Found one that looked like it had a fresh grind from a Spiropoint. I was all set to describe the grind and let him see how well they cut, until I had a look at the drill from the side to check the clearance and saw that whoever ground it must have set up the machine improperly. No clearance whatsoever. Tossed it back in the rack, disappointed. :wrong:
 

metalmagpie

Titanium
Joined
May 22, 2006
Location
Seattle
Another vote for the venerable Darex M5. And I used to have a Black Diamond also. The Darex was just so much simpler to use and has the point splitter.
 

eKretz

Diamond; Mod Squad
Joined
Mar 27, 2005
Location
Northwest Indiana, USA
Most (newer anyway, you're probably taking about an ancient model) Black Diamond grinders have point splitters also. Even the Vietnam-era one I mentioned that was at a former employer's shop had a point splitter, so that's not really any kind of addition. And I don't see how it can get a whole lot simpler... Put the drill and holder into the setting fixture, lock it down. Put the combination into the sharpening fixture and rotate until it stops grinding. Put the combination into the splitter and grind the first split, rotate and grind the other. Once the grinder is set up correctly the first time it repeats pretty well. How is the Darex any simpler than that?
 

projectnut

Stainless
Joined
Mar 4, 2006
Location
Wisconsin
Most (newer anyway, you're probably taking about an ancient model) Black Diamond grinders have point splitters also. Even the Vietnam-era one I mentioned that was at a former employer's shop had a point splitter, so that's not really any kind of addition. And I don't see how it can get a whole lot simpler... Put the drill and holder into the setting fixture, lock it down. Put the combination into the sharpening fixture and rotate until it stops grinding. Put the combination into the splitter and grind the first split, rotate and grind the other. Once the grinder is set up correctly the first time it repeats pretty well. How is the Darex any simpler than that?


My Vietnam era (1974) Model 65 Black Diamond drill grinder was also equipped with a point splitter from the factory. Unfortunately some of the pieces were lost along the way. Fortunately the splitter function on my Drill Doctor still works.
 

eKretz

Diamond; Mod Squad
Joined
Mar 27, 2005
Location
Northwest Indiana, USA
Then about 3 years ago I bought one of the "better" models and it's absolute garbage.

Before I got my Black Diamond I did this too, but started right away with the newer fancier model "Drill Doctor." It didn't do a very good job at all, and not only that, but it wasn't very repeatable when I actually did get a usable edge. I sold it down the river on eBay (with description mentioning it didn't work well for me) since it was still basically brand new. I surmise that they must be rather hit or miss on quality; when they come up as a subject of discussion it always seems that some like them and some hate them. Then I found an almost new looking Black Diamond with collets for $300 (shipped no less!) and it also came with a CBN wheel. Deal of the year for me.
 








 
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