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Cost of not disconnecting a scrap vehicle's battery...

Milland

Diamond
Joined
Jul 6, 2006
Location
Hillsboro, New Hampshire
Where does it say vehicles were to be scrapped ? Used vehicles from developed countries are often sold in large quantities to the developing countries.

Yeah, fair enough. My brain was overwhelmed by the idea of the whole ship and cargo being scrap, and jumped to a conclusion it shouldn't have.

[This time it really is Tesla's fault! Elon made me mistype!]
 

Milland

Diamond
Joined
Jul 6, 2006
Location
Hillsboro, New Hampshire
p.s. Pintos got a bum rap. If you park just over the crest of a hill, in the fast lane not the median, and don't put out any kind of warning, well ... bad stuff can happen.

I was about to castigate you, but you saved it with the P.S. I had a Pinto, and it was actually a fun little car. Added good tires, adjustable cam timing pulley, header, Koni shocks, etc. Vastly better than the Vega even in stock trim, but that's not saying much.
 

crickets

Hot Rolled
Joined
Jul 3, 2021
Lol someone in a article said rocket the radioactive stuff into space that is Nuclear material waste from Nuclear energy. Turns out making them go into the sun requires more fuel and expense so they say just launch it up and away. Don’t think the batteries would be cost effective to do that.

Space factories may be the future some insist. I have heard that before just like I heard electric cars would bring down one of the big ICE companies a while back. Guess they moved into the future a ways once again.

EV battery recycling gets a bad upfront rep because... of the consumer electronics. Smartphones, drills, toothbrushes, toys, vibrators - millions of these items being tossed away without battery removal because of the effort necessary to pull the battery out of the assembled unit that is often not even designed to be serviceable and can't be opened without crushing. The quantity of the materials, and relative ease of accessing them in EV batteries makes them fairly lucrative. They are also designed for a much longer service life - up to 20 years. Nobody keeps a cellphone that long, hence one of the reasons for a problem. But yeah, doomsday predictions, how would we stay amused without them ?
 

Trueturning

Diamond
Joined
Jul 2, 2019

Interesting. Researched not yet implemented for first there has to be a large enough market. Too they say proprietary and yet they have no patent pending it seems . I may have missed it. A lot of breakthrough things connected to green are merely promotions. Many are written in the interest of raising money from investments and including the personal investments from stocks they can buy those back if things go good and they can dominate the market. Did I understand this well as they seem to claim this process will extend the useable life estimated 54%?

That means it is a increase of 1/2 approximately yet the batteries themselves must still at that point be recycled or thrown away.

It can be considered on the solution side of things if for real this stuff is not in fact just a money grab before they find some major point of established science allows a reversal of forcing highly expensive alternatives those which the major polluters in the world have rejected out of hand.
 

CarbideBob

Diamond
Joined
Jan 14, 2007
Location
Flushing/Flint, Michigan
This event leads to a question.
If you have a car in storage and the battery on trickle charge should it be disconnected from the vehicle?
The odds of a short, mouse or squirrel low but?
Bob
 

standardparts

Diamond
Joined
Mar 26, 2019
EV battery recycling gets a bad upfront rep because... of the consumer electronics. Smartphones, drills, toothbrushes, toys, vibrators - millions of these items being tossed away without battery removal because of the effort necessary to pull the battery out of the assembled unit that is often not even designed to be serviceable and can't be opened without crushing. The quantity of the materials, and relative ease of accessing them in EV batteries makes them fairly lucrative. They are also designed for a much longer service life - up to 20 years. Nobody keeps a cellphone that long, hence one of the reasons for a problem. But yeah, doomsday predictions, how would we stay amused without them ?

Maybe there should be an impact fee applied at purchase similar to years ago with containers redeemable when item is turned in for a refund.
 

barbter

Diamond
Joined
Oct 27, 2007
Location
On Tour...
This event leads to a question.
If you have a car in storage and the battery on trickle charge should it be disconnected from the vehicle?
The odds of a short, mouse or squirrel low but?
Bob

I charge my best Chy-na batteries on my home brew eleccy bike, in the downstairs garage (we live in a block of 12 apartments with an adjacent block of 9).
In my garage are 2 other eleccy bikes, a harley and a classic triumph so a few gallons of fuel.
It's a worry....
:WipingBrow:
 

Ries

Diamond
Joined
Mar 15, 2004
Location
Edison Washington USA
I dont see how this applies to electric cars- this was entirely the fault of Grimaldi, the shipper who had leased this boat.

It turns out Grimaldi has had 4 or 5 similar incidents in the last few years- cars catching on fire on board ships. There is a huge industry of shipping complete used cars to Africa, and to the Middle East, where they are in high demand.

Often times US middlemen buy damaged cars from insurance companies, pack them with replacement (used) body parts, and ship them to Africa, where they are repaired and resold.

The reason these cars go to Africa is because they are old and cheap, and fixable.
It seems pretty unlikely that, instead of a 15 year old Toyota that needs a new front end, somebody would ship a Tesla that needs a 25k battery pack to Kenya or Haiti.
 

standardparts

Diamond
Joined
Mar 26, 2019
I charge my best Chy-na batteries on my home brew eleccy bike, in the downstairs garage (we live in a block of 12 apartments with an adjacent block of 9).
In my garage are 2 other eleccy bikes, a harley and a classic triumph so a few gallons of fuel.
It's a worry....
:WipingBrow:

Your mention of e-bikes reminded me a a vid from Louis Rossman......"front door goes BOOM courtesy of UnitPackPower battery." Man-O-Man intense fire.

Louis' front door goes BOOM courtesy of UnitPackPower battery. - YouTube
 

crickets

Hot Rolled
Joined
Jul 3, 2021
Maybe there should be an impact fee applied at purchase similar to years ago with containers redeemable when item is turned in for a refund.

Unnecessary. The reason for impact fees is because small toxic items are relatively easy to throw away, and people (individuals) aren't bothered with finding a way to recycle them properly. I really don't see that with cars - too big, too heavy. Also a fun datapoint - LFP cells don't contain toxic compounds and are safe for the landfills.
 

barbter

Diamond
Joined
Oct 27, 2007
Location
On Tour...

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BillE

Hot Rolled
Joined
Dec 6, 2010
Location
Sydney Au
I dont see how this applies to electric cars- this was entirely the fault of Grimaldi, the shipper who had leased this boat.

It turns out Grimaldi has had 4 or 5 similar incidents in the last few years- cars catching on fire on board ships. There is a huge industry of shipping complete used cars to Africa, and to the Middle East, where they are in high demand.

Often times US middlemen buy damaged cars from insurance companies, pack them with replacement (used) body parts, and ship them to Africa, where they are repaired and resold.

The reason these cars go to Africa is because they are old and cheap, and fixable.
It seems pretty unlikely that, instead of a 15 year old Toyota that needs a new front end, somebody would ship a Tesla that needs a 25k battery pack to Kenya or Haiti.

Did the vehicle cargo actually originate in the US or in the far east? I'd expect a RORO rather than a container ship as shown, if the battery wasn't disconnected??

None available in the US now - and it seems an unlikely preference for thieves, but the Hilux is one of the most stolen vehicles down here and extremely popular in Africa....which gives me cause to think that's where they might end up. On the other hand, Nth American product would seem an unlikely preference for sale over there. I'd just imagine the looks on faces if something like an F450 monstrosity turned up on the docks.:D

CarbideBob said:
This event leads to a question.
If you have a car in storage and the battery on trickle charge should it be disconnected from the vehicle?
The odds of a short, mouse or squirrel low but?
Bob

A workshop fire nearby killed several hundred grand worth of historic cars via trickle charging a light weight battery. I'm circumspect even leaving a drill or trouble light Li-ion unattended now!
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
If you watch the Tesla traders on u tube,there is a very good reason they dont go to West Africa......cheapest Tesla youll find is around $15k's......way beyond cheapo cars trade.......As to recycling ,there is recycling and recycling...as in rebuilding a Tesla battery pack with parts salvaged from other tesla packs........seems the going price on a used Tesla pack that tests OK is around $1200....and there is up to 18 of these in the full pack.......if you want to know Tesla recycling ,look on ebay ..........and on a similar front,going price of a stolen cat is now $300+......dont park in the street.
 

john.k

Diamond
Joined
Dec 21, 2012
Location
Brisbane Qld Australia
AS to fires,a restored car and garage set on fire by a solar charger just down the street..........the solar panel generates a few amps,but the battery its connected to can peak at 1000A for the few seconds it takes to heat wires white hot.
 

PDW

Diamond
Joined
Jul 24, 2006
Location
Australia (Hobart)
I know that but a whole new world is coming and fast.
So often we do think about these things until too late.
Lite a gasoline car on fire and the normal. These are different and will take over a lot of the normal ICE based fleet.
A car is one thing. Long haul big trucks are going to have much bigger batteries.

This one a fluke. Know a guy with a car repair shop and a very expensive older car lit up at night for no reason.
They said it was a short in old wiring. Took out his building and 10 other cars so this not just in shipping.
The guy does exotics and normal. Are you going to disconnect the battery on all when not being worked on if you own a car shop?
My old cars not driven but on trickle charge so that they will fire and move that old gas. Should I pull one cable in fear of rotted wires?

Engineer friend of mine advised me that this sort of thing had happened to boats too and sometimes, rarely but sometimes, the engine could get started and then cook itself because the salt water cooling is off, or the starter burn out.

I have a master disconnect switch between start battery and starter.

There's no perfect answer just the usual likelihood/consequence matrix.

PDW
 

Bill D

Diamond
Joined
Apr 1, 2004
Location
Modesto, CA USA
Reminds me of thew guy whose Tesla battery caught on fire as he was driving down the road all innocent. tesla exchanged it for a. new one to study the problem.. Fire department took hours dumping water as it keep relighting. he forgot to mention he shot a pistol into the battery while,driving and it got shorted out. When TESLA saw the bullet they recalled the new car and gave him his old one back.
Bill D

Tesla says someone fired a bullet into battery pack of a Model S that caught on fire - Electrek
 

crickets

Hot Rolled
Joined
Jul 3, 2021
Reminds me of thew guy whose Tesla battery caught on fire as he was driving down the road all innocent. tesla exchanged it for a. new one to study the problem.. Fire department took hours dumping water as it keep relighting. he forgot to mention he shot a pistol into the battery while,driving and it got shorted out. When TESLA saw the bullet they recalled the new car and gave him his old one back.
Bill D

Too soon. He should have waited for the Cybertruck before discharging one into the floor.
 








 
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