dayton 31tr86 wiring to a drum switch. check and opinions?

[ooeric]

Hey newbie to this forum.
Not sure if this is the correct sub forum, please move if not.

so i got a used cavallin rolling mill from a work buddy
it originally had a forward reverse switch
but some time years ago, motor crapped out and they replaced it with a dayton 31tr86 running on 110v not 220v.
they removed the switch and just connect power directly to the L1 L2, and grounded to the motor housing.
the machine only ran in one direction off a foot pedal for their uses.
its an oily mess, so im going to wipe down stuff, and put in new wires as seen as on attached pic.
so far, i have only removed the hot, neutal, and ground wire off and touched nothing else for easier viewing.


so the genius i am, i wanted to put back the switch for my uses.

i see on the dayton diagram it only requires flipping the black 2, red 4 leads (top right corner)
and the voltage (hot?) white 1 and blue 2 are where power actually come in from?
on the center and lower L2 terminal. each of those terminals has 3-4 spades to attach leads onto it.

is it possible for me to wire the switch like this? please pardon my crude drawing.
with learning videos i keep watching, and googling all over,
is it safe to conclude the 2 reversings leads (black 2 , red 4) , be called U1 U2 ?

on the switch photo, one direction is in blue, the other in red, the yellow are the bus bars on the switch itself.
so when i go forward or reverse, power is only sent to either "u1" or "u2" thus making the motor go CW or CCW respectively?

i would like for power from wall into switch, then into the motor.

i have not done any work yet, but would like a second opinion
before i blow anything up by trial and error.

im not a pro at all stuff electrical, but have a basic understanding how the motors work
the capacitator start is stuff im still learning.

 

[SAF]

The only way to accurately help you, is if you take the motor out of the housing and submit a clear readable photo of the motor tag, with it's connection diagram. The one posted from the Grainger site may be of a different vintage or manufacturer. The same Dayton model number can be made by different manufactures at different times.

Same thing applies to the drum switch you have, you would need to submit the actual wiring diagram that came with the switch, and a make and model. Without the proper equipment diagrams, it's a shot in the dark and not worth wasting time over, and risking damage to the equipment.

 

[ooeric]

The only way to accurately help you, is if you take the motor out of the housing and submit a clear readable photo of the motor tag, with it's connection diagram. The one posted from the Grainger site may be of a different vintage or manufacturer. The same Dayton model number can be made by different manufactures at different times.

Same thing applies to the drum switch you have, you would need to submit the actual wiring diagram that came with the switch, and a make and model. Without the proper equipment diagrams, it's a shot in the dark and not worth wasting time over, and risking damage to the equipment.

Its the same. I even looked at the wiring board and it all matches up.

The thing is all bolted down and tensioned correctly with twin belts going up to a oil filled transmission reduction gearcase.

So i likely would prefer not to remove the motor out and most with tension.

The unit is like 400lbs, it wont be a one man job for me if i ever need to lay the unit down to realign stuff.

Please ignore my scribbles on the switch box lol

 

[SAF]

What voltage are you trying to wire it for?
Where are the ratings for that drum switch?
That drum diagram does not provide a schematic of the switching logic, does not even say what the diagram is supposed to be for? Where is the schematic on paper supplied with it?

 

[ooeric]

What voltage are you trying to wire it for?
Where are the ratings for that drum switch?
That drum diagram does not provide a schematic of the switching logic, does not even say what the diagram is supposed to be for? Where is the schematic on paper supplied with it?

standard wall 110v
the drum is from a basic 60A from amazon.

visually, when i flip the switch, the copper contacts connect for :
(im counting the actual physical contact # left to right sequentially, unlike the switch's diagram, which skips a number)
position 1 : 1-2 5-6 9-10
position 2 : 1-2 3-4 7-8

my earlier post shows the internal bus bar connections.
and how it power flows in blue and red marker.

 

[Almost Retired]

so you actually have all the info you need to do this your self

first determine your motor wiring ... what stays one way all the time ... what swaps, then draw it out

second determine if your switch is rated for the applied volts and amps
third get an ohmeter and ohm out the switch in FWD and REV and draw it out in the same pattern, as though it were a photo of the switch guts

fourth get a lot of paper and start making drawings with jumpers of what you think will work
(I prefer to do this stage in the drawing program on the laptop called "Paint".
save your basic drawings then copy them to a new drawing for adding jumpers etc.. it is faster and easier than paper)
check the operation of the switch and jumpers (is everything getting connected like i want it ? )
then check the operation of the switch the other way (is anything getting connected, or disconnected that i dont want ? )

eventually you will see a pattern to the jumpers and the switch operation that makes sense and then you can say
I Did It !
better than that .... you now have experience and can do it yourself the next time, no begging for help

now to let the smoke out lol, but seriously, this is where you check one more time

 

[Almost Retired]

the motor tag shows how to connect for 120V and CCW direction
for CW direction it says swap red and black leads to their respective terminals

CW and CCW are normally viewed from looking at the motor fan end, and shaft away from you
you will have to extrapolate through any gears or other power train that may swap directions
but even if you get it wrong just swap the red and black wires in the motor or switch

so your switch needs to connect power to the motor for both directions and disconnect for Off (SO cord colors of B, W, G).
it also needs to swap motor leads Red and Black
you need a three conductor SO cord rated for applied volts and amps, from the supply to the switch
you need a 7 conductor SO cord rated for applied volts and amps, from the switch to the motor
use the other four colors of the cord for motor leads red and black to the switch,, then back to the motor terminals 2 and 4

include all relevant motor wires and colors (most of them never get moved on the motor and dont need to be included), as well as SO wires and colors, including power supplied, on your drawings

all that is left is to figure out how the switch works and where you need jumpers

 

[Almost Retired]

Hey newbie to this forum.
Not sure if this is the correct sub forum, please move if not.

so i got a used cavallin rolling mill from a work buddy
it originally had a forward reverse switch
but some time years ago, motor crapped out and they replaced it with a dayton 31tr86 running on 110v not 220v.
they removed the switch and just connect power directly to the L1 L2, and grounded to the motor housing.
the machine only ran in one direction off a foot pedal for their uses.
its an oily mess, so im going to wipe down stuff, and put in new wires as seen as on attached pic.
so far, i have only removed the hot, neutal, and ground wire off and touched nothing else for easier viewing.


so the genius i am, i wanted to put back the switch for my uses.

i see on the dayton diagram it only requires flipping the black 2, red 4 leads (top right corner)
and the voltage (hot?) white 1 and blue 2 are where power actually come in from?
on the center and lower L2 terminal. each of those terminals has 3-4 spades to attach leads onto it.

is it possible for me to wire the switch like this? please pardon my crude drawing.
with learning videos i keep watching, and googling all over,
is it safe to conclude the 2 reversings leads (black 2 , red 4) , be called U1 U2 ?

on the switch photo, one direction is in blue, the other in red, the yellow are the bus bars on the switch itself.
so when i go forward or reverse, power is only sent to either "u1" or "u2" thus making the motor go CW or CCW respectively?

i would like for power from wall into switch, then into the motor.

i have not done any work yet, but would like a second opinion
before i blow anything up by trial and error.

im not a pro at all stuff electrical, but have a basic understanding how the motors work
the capacitator start is stuff im still learning.

you are not interpreting the motor tag correctly
look at the right half of the tag, read All of it carefully several times
do you see where it says L1 and L2?
L1 is the hot supply wire
L2 is the neutral supply wire
you must feed a normal hot and neutral to those terminals through the switch so they can be de-energized for off
the blue and white are to change from 120V to 240V do not move them
your switch should only move the black and red between terminals 2 and 4

the tag tells you all of this

what you have drawn will blow up the motor

an understanding of how motors work does not allow anyone to deviate from what the motor tag says

 

[ooeric]

you are not interpreting the motor tag correctly
look at the right half of the tag, read All of it carefully several times
do you see where it says L1 and L2?
L1 is the hot supply wire
L2 is the neutral supply wire
you must feed a normal hot and neutral to those terminals through the switch so they can be de-energized for off
the blue and white are to change from 120V to 240V do not move them
your switch should only move the black and red between terminals 2 and 4

the tag tells you all of this

what you have drawn will blow up the motor

an understanding of how motors work does not allow anyone to deviate from what the motor tag says

Thanks. This is why i didnt didnt try anything yet. The motor as is runs the machine. So i thought best idea is to ask around first. Lol

So with this motor. I should feed hot and neutral through the switch on contacts that are constant to l1 l2. This will just be responsible to turning the motor on and off.

Then i need to extend the black and red wire leads (the ones to swap for direction). Into the switch, so the switch can reverse them when needed. Then run a new wire from the switch's output of these two leads back into the motor.

Leave the white and blue leads as is (which was what i was going to do)

Does that sound correct?

 

[Almost Retired]

pretty much .....
but if the drawing on the inside cover of the switch is correct
you will not be able to switch the neu. just wirenut it and also the green