DoAll table feed cylinder leaking

[Barry 16"]

Well I finally got my D10-30 running and cycling and I noticed that the table cylinder is leaking quite a bit around the shaft. Has anybody ever rebuilt one of these cylinders ?
I am assuming I will have to lift off the table and remove the cylinder to do this although I would like to just remove the end cap and put a new seal in the cylinder I don't think ill get off that easily. Does anyone know of a source for the rebuild kit and how to lift off the table ? Is it as simple as just lifting it up off the saddle with an engine hoist ?

 

[eKretz]

I've had the one apart on my Brown & Sharpe and it's just an o-ring sealing on the shaft at the end. There are literally no piston seals, just an ~ .005" slip fit from the piston to the bore. That's not to say yours is going to be the same, but it might be. All you can do is pull it apart and see. Look underneath for any belt and connections for the end of the cylinder shaft. After getting anything like that disconnected it should lift right off.

 

[john.k]

i did a feed cylinder where the hardchrome had all pitted and partially come off.............got a quote on new chrome,no way .....next step was to grind the rod down to a smooth surface (actually 1" ground down to 25mm)......used store bought 25mm sintered bushing ,and two O rings for seal ......fixed.

 

[Richard King]

I will look for a a manual. for now I think the cylinder has a Garlock split V packing on the shaft end that seals it. Sometimes you can just tighten the cylinder caap a little or replace it. You maybe able to move the table to the far left and disconnect the table from the feed cylinder shaft. The knob on the top tight of the table and hand crank the table to the right. and sit under there to access the cylinder...tight but may not have to take off the table I'll keep looking for a parts manual.

I was looking for a parts manual and found this Operations Manual. It's got a lot of info any brand of grinder could use. Eric...maybe make this a sticky?

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/256/26909.pdf

 

[Richard King]

I have to get up super early and can't look now....will do it Monday.... Good Luck

 

[eKretz]

I was looking for a parts manual and found this Operations Manual. It's got a lot of info any brand of grinder could use. Eric...maybe make this a sticky?

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/256/26909.pdf

Still debating how I want to do that, about half the fellas here said they would rather have no stickies at all. Seems kind of silly to link off-site, I may try to attach some things in a sticky post and see if that works. We could always put a few interesting/useful things in one sticky post.

 

[Richard King]

I like them as Charles has them on the rebuilding forum.. did you look at that info. really good...can be used for all brand machines - especially good for rookies....

 

[metalmagpie]

I have rebuilt a few cylinders lately. On one of them, I noticed a rebuild kit was available for about $95. I tore the cylinder down and took it to the local packing and seal company. It needed 2 O-rings with backing rings. I got out of there for under $5 in parts. Moral of the story is before you spend the money on a rebuild kit, take the cylinder apart (you'll have to do that anyway) and have a go at sourcing the parts yourself.

metalmagpie

 

[Barry 16"]

thank you for your input guys

 

[Barry 16"]

I wound up taking it to hydraulic shop and the guy told me the rods were scored and had to be replaced. I had to take to a hydraulic rebuild shop and when they took it apart informed me that the inner bore of the whole cylinder was scored also and needed to be replaced. The final estimate is $1,000 to repair. uuhgg

 

[eKretz]

Did you get a look at it yourself? Got any photos? Not saying it's impossible, but it doesn't seem like it should be a $1,000 fix. Let's see it. On my machine the inside of the cylinder is basically non contact. I can't imagine that there's any high force contact there, it would drag like crazy.

 

[Barry 16"]

Did you get a look at it yourself? Got any photos? Not saying it's impossible, but it doesn't seem like it should be a $1,000 fix. Let's see it. On my machine the inside of the cylinder is basically non contact. I can't imagine that there's any high force contact there, it would drag like crazy.

I don't have any pics of it. But I went to the shop and they showed it to me. It is a double ended cylinder with shafts out both ends that screw into a plunger in middle. The seals around plunger were shredded and there for the plunger was probably riding on the inner bore of cylinder for how many years. Much of the cost is in machining and I know I could do a lot of it myself or find someone to do it; but I have a couple of little jobs that I could be doing and making a little extra beer money on that I can't do with the machine down. As is the same case with my Selectron magnet control. I can't figure out to get it to work and no one I contact will even look at it. Also, I can't even buy a new controller because mine is only 24 volt and no one makes a 24 volt. At least no one I contacted. I know its probably something simple for someone that knows what he's doing ; but I'm a tool and cutter grinder not an electrical engineer.
eKretz. did you get a chance to look at the photos I posted in my Selectron LV-24 post. ?

 

[metalmagpie]

Just replace the piston seals. Are they O-rings with backing rings? Sure, the scored walls will reduce the seal life but in the meantime you can limp the machine along making beer money. Oh, and you might hone the cylinder bore a little too.

 

[Barry 16"]

Just replace the piston seals. Are they O-rings with backing rings? Sure, the scored walls will reduce the seal life but in the meantime you can limp the machine along making beer money. Oh, and you might hone the cylinder bore a little too.

Ok, I got the cylinder rebuilt and decided to clean out the hydro tank to see what got in there to wreck the cylinder.

When I took the side cover off and looked in there; I immediately saw what happened. Some idiot took a saws-all and cut off the intake pipe for the pump and didn't bother to debar the cut or clean up the shavings. So they went through the pump to the cylinder.

I just can't believe there are people out there that are that stupid. Well maybe I can. But what really sucks is being the one paying for their ignorance !!

So I cleaned up the tank and put it all together tried cycling the table and it hardly wants to move. I have to push on the table to get it to go back and forth even on full speed . I turned up the pump pressure to around 300 PSI. Not sure what it should be at. So, maybe I'm one of those stupid people I mentioned but, could my problem be that I have too much air in the lines and it needs to be bleed out? I figured it would force the air out going full travel in each direction but I have done that several times and it still doesn't want to move on its own. If I need to bleed it out; the only way I can think of is to pick up the table again and open up the cylinder with the pump running and switch side to side to blow the air out of the cylinder.

Does anyone know how I should proceed ?

 

[Milland]

If you're up for it, try draining the oil from the cylinder (everything shut down, of course), and manually push the table/cylinder to the extents of travel and get a sense of the mechanical drag.

If it's excessive (can't move the table with the cylinder ends open) , then you have to find out where the drag is. If it does move without significant effort, perhaps it's air in the hydraulics or some other aspect of the pump that's not working correctly.

Could there be any other choke points in the fluid control?

 

[eKretz]

Re: can't believe that there are people put there that stupid.

Ha! Believe it now, don'tcha? Been there, done that. More times than I can remember.