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eBay Aloris CXA - Real or Counterfeit?

PDXFactory

Plastic
Joined
Dec 8, 2023
Good morning,

I'm a long time lurker hobby machinist, finally setting up a lathe in my personal shop. I recently bought an Aloris CXA quick change tool post on ebay that was "new in box", and it showed up last night. It looks a bit different than any other Aloris QCTP I've seen, and I'm curious if it's legit or a good Chinese copy. Is this real Aloris? (They also shipped the kit, which included two tool holders, with only a couple of cardboard boxes to separate them and no padding...but that's another issue. Some of the ground surfaces are now damaged, and the handle is beat pretty good. Ugh.) It's mostly the round engraved logo on the face that is different from anything I've seen, and lack of any Aloris 'shield' engraved anywhere else.

Thanks!
 

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The logo looks completely different than what is on the Aloris website. The logo background has rough tool marks from an endmill, and the logo stamp looks pretty crude and poorly defined.

I am calling it FAKE. The font used for the Aloris name is completely different from what they currently and historically have used. The logo is also completely different - they use a custom font in the logo and this is nothing like that. The spacing of the letters in the words is also poor.

Recent examples on the Aloris site say "Aloris Tool Tech" not just Aloris.

In years past the branding was via a riveted badge and those were often lost. Then you had to identify the toolpost by more subtle features. Aloris and Dorian were always pretty easy to spot vs imports, but telling them apart isn't always easy, depending on the variations of the era.

I would ask Aloris.

Edit: Add more details about font and logo difference.
 
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I have a CXA setup buried in a box somewhere, but my problem is also with the logo.

My thinking is... other then the fact that I don't recall it being machined in, I doubt a company as old as Aloris who has made this very part for decades, is taking the time to machine the logo with standard tools. Even if they did, I'm sure by now the results would be vastly improved from what is in the pictures.

In searching I see they use a red metal stick on tag. I remember that. I thought that milled logo looked fishy.
 
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I did send an email to Aloris and will try to get in touch early next week. Just got the tool last night after they were long gone on a holiday weekend. I know they've moved from the red riveted on badge to a different, apparently engraved, logo like the attached pic shown on their website. It's clearly possible that they changed it up (maybe even to fight counterfeiting), but...it's a bit fishy. I agree that the font is not like what they've used on anything I've seen. The tool holders do look identical, but I've worked in Asia for half of my career and some are certainly skilled at copying...
 

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I doubt a company as old as Aloris who has made this very part for decades, is taking the time to machine the logo with standard tools.
I'm sure those badges were a hassle and expense to rivet on, and not get scuffed up in the process. I assume laser engraving would have advantages. From the photos on their website it looks like they have moved away from the riveted badges.

Having a unique and challenging logo process is a good way to fend off fakes. Unique fonts, spacing, etc. Aloris does not provide clear logo photos on their site, and the photos of the current logo are at an angle. Why make it easy for someone to steal the badge artwork from your website?

I'm not going to spell out all the ways that logo is garbage, but there are so many. If that is a genuine Aloris TP, then they've really lowered the bar to making it hard to tell what is real.

I think I see the ebay seller for this product and I notice they don't show the logo on the TP. They only show one photo, which is a redflag. If I pay $800 for a new TP, the handle better not be dinged up.

Here's a side by side.

aloris.fake.compare.jpg
 
Going off what has sold on eBay in the last month, I'm guessing this is the listing. If so, it's interesting that the logo on the box matches their current logo. The logo on the box, the style of sealing, etc all looks just like what I've received from Aloris twice in the past six months or so when I bought stuff from them.

This eBay seller moves a lot of NOS stuff that I can only guess got lost/misdirected in shipping, or something odd because it's often stuff like this. They've sold a lot of Wilton bullet vises that are still on the factory plywood, and/or in the factory box...sort of like this.

They also have 27 negative or neutral feedbacks in the last 12 months and their listings always seem to be "private" so you can't go look at negative or neutral feedback to see what the item was. Short version....shady listing practice if you ask me.

With all that said, it's possible the tool post is legit and Aloris has changed their logo.

 
Going off what has sold on eBay in the last month, I'm guessing this is the listing. If so, it's interesting that the logo on the box matches their current logo. The logo on the box, the style of sealing, etc all looks just like what I've received from Aloris twice in the past six months or so when I bought stuff from them.

This eBay seller moves a lot of NOS stuff that I can only guess got lost/misdirected in shipping, or something odd because it's often stuff like this. They've sold a lot of Wilton bullet vises that are still on the factory plywood, and/or in the factory box...sort of like this.

They also have 27 negative or neutral feedbacks in the last 12 months and their listings always seem to be "private" so you can't go look at negative or neutral feedback to see what the item was. Short version....shady listing practice if you ask me.

With all that said, it's possible the tool post is legit and Aloris has changed their logo.


Yep, that's the one - I had been keeping an eye out, and just pulled the trigger when the alert popped up. I did roll the dice on the listing given it was only one photo. I can't swing full price for Aloris direct for hobby stuff, but under $400 for a new full kit...sure thing. When it's 'new-open box' I definitely would expect it to show up pretty much new. It's certainly useable/fixable, and half the Aloris CXA's on eBay sell for more than I paid for the TP and two holders. If it's a China copy though, I'll send it back. I am just hoping someone has purchased one recently and can chime in with 'yes, this is exactly what I got from Aloris'. If not, I'll report back next week on what I hear from Aloris directly.

Funny (not funny) - when I was checking out it even told me "you've bought from this seller before"...and I didn't think much of it. I dug into it after, and last time I ordered from them they put 12 huge 8" Hamilton casters in a single box with zero padding, and of course everything got beat up. So, I immediately messaged them and said "this is a precision tool...PLEASE add padding to the box". Nope. Just a few pieces of cardboard. They move a ton of product, and I think however it shows up is how it goes out. Minimal packaging. They give zero sh^ts. If it does turn out to be legit, I'm going to see if they will cough up some money for their negligence.
 
The real question is...... How much difference is there these days between a real deal Aloris and a clone? I only have older Aloris stuff so I don't know. They are pretty simple fixtures so maybe the difference is not worth the price Aloris asks.

It will take some people with both real Aloris and clone copies to chime in and tell us ilif the Aloris brand is really worth the huge premium.
 
I think the only practical difference is repeatability. I have a knock off CXA at home and a real one at work. My lathe is heavier than flimsy Servoshit at work and I can’t tell a difference other than I can take deeper cuts at home. When I bring in my own tool holders (I have a better equipped shop at home that the engineering dept) my tools lock up the same and work fine. I ground the spacer under our work lathe toolpost so I don’t even have to adjust center on my own holders. I can’t even tell a difference in to a lever position between any combo of parts I’ve tried.

YMMV but unless you are using it with a dro and tracking offsets you can get 10x the number tool holders for same cost as a legit Aloris kit. I think that’s especially true for the toolblocks themselves, just buy new hardware and use them.
 
I use both genuine Aloris and Chinese knockoff CXA holders. They're different.

Aloris height adjustment is much easier to use because stud is securely locked into block, knurled nut runs true, and there's a special non-influencing washer that keeps height when tightening jam nut.

Aloris knurled nut is entirely within the footprint of the holder. Knockoff stands proud and gets in the way when doing large facing like on soft jaws.

Aloris CXA-1 holder slot is tall enough to accept metric tool sticks. Chinese version ironically is too short.

On a holder that involves some accuracy like Morse taper a reputable brand is the only way to go.

Only advantage of knockoffs is cost. They're ok if tool stays in holder permanently. A complete pain if height ever needs to be adjusted.
 
I have an import (Phase II) BXA post, and both Aloris and Phase II holders. The Aloris holders are better, as noted above. It seems that all the offshore holders have junk setscrews. So soft the sockets cam out quickly even though they're not wrenched down all that tight.
 
What does the Aloris logo look like on the holders?
Mine are embossed into the steel.
The holders look legit - other than being slightly different black colors, they have the appearance of being the real deal. I doubt most Chinese copies would include a custom tabbed spring washer, but I could be wrong there.

Just for fun, I've also attached a pic of how this set was shipped to me. They were willing to put some random boxes in there, but couldn't swing a few more cents for any additional packing. Definitely recommend staying away from that particular seller...
 

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It seems that all the offshore holders have junk setscrews.
That's been my experience, too. And the height adjusting studs (as already noted above) aren't secured. Fortunately, replacing setscrews is an inexpensive fix, and it takes maybe 15 minutes to remove, degrease, Loctite and torque down a stud on a new import holder. One time expense, which to me is worth the difference in price for the toolholders.
 
I think that seller is one who buys damaged , lost or somehow misplaced freight. We used to have a very good one here.
Never knew what he would come up with. After hurricane Andrew in Miami he had trailer loads of stuff.He had a bin ,aprox3'x3'x4' full of lathe top jaws,new standard probably for 12" or larger chucks,he didn't have a clue what they were. Also had some computer gear with a Navy tag on it. He called NAS Jax and they came and took it.It was parts for an F18 that were sent back to the mfg for repairs and was lost in transit.
 
I bought a NOS 6-jaw set-tru chuck from them years back for a sweet price. Just have to be selective on what you buy from them. It's definitely reclaimed lost freight and such stuff!
 








 
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