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Export Controls . . . only when convenient?

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motion guru

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Joined
Dec 8, 2003
Location
Yacolt, WA
I have to say, this was surprising . . . having developed quite a bit of machine tool tech with high precision capabilities and ultra high speed spindle apps and jumped through all export control hoops when necessary . . . whoever at Haas has this responsibility is a first class dork.

 
I have to say, this was surprising . . . having developed quite a bit of machine tool tech with high precision capabilities and ultra high speed spindle apps and jumped through all export control hoops when necessary . . . whoever at Haas has this responsibility is a first class dork.

Let's start at the top - took me ten minutes of clicking "do not accept" to get through all the crap advertising and tracking links on pbs. So ... fuck pbs.

Also fuck Simon Ostrovsky who apparently does not know that many times machine tools take time to build. He is dishonestly snivelling that Haas shipped machines from March to October ... but doesn't bother to look into when these machines were paid for.

So because of stupid fucking US "sanctions" Haas is supposed to return millions of dollars in good-faith legal transactions ? Who is going to pay for that? You and me?

Fuck the US government and their "run-the-world" fantasies as well.

Every one of the people in this pseudo-"report" do not have the brains to tie their own shoes. "Oooh, Haas machines so accurate! Even the US military uses them!"

Blithering idiots. Haas are almost the bottom of the barrel, people buy them because they are cheap. Not to criticize Haas, someone has to make an "affordable" machine and they do a decent job but "so accurate" ? Give me a break.

"Oh look ! Oh look ! You can make a part out of this piece of steel ! So technically advanced !"

Idiot US commerce department, idiot PBS, even a $50 Indian or Brazilian or vmc can do that shit, it's not advanced, it's not difficult, it has no reason to be under export controls, it's a commodity at this point.

Fuck all those braindead gushing idiots who don't have a clue.

btw, China must have thirty varieties of VMC easily the equivalent of a Haas. Seriously. Go ahead, morons, cut Haas' nose off, Chinese companies will happily take up the slack. Trade oil and gas for cheap vmc's., pretty good deal and there's even train tracks already there.

Fuck the stupid US government. If brains were dynamite they couldn't blow their noses. PBS is even worse.
 
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Don't believe me ? Here. This place is in the middle of nowhere, not leaders in the industry, just a plain old machine tool builder in the countryside. I don't care for the Haas-style design, so you get a photo of a bad one, don't want to give up better resources :D But the point is, commodity. Cheap. Easily available from non-US-cowered sources. Congress and commerce department are STUPID. NC was an advanced technology fifty years ago, not now. These effing nitwits are playing with fire, they drive people who should be cooperative into being enemies. That's mentally retarded.

haas-ish_5.jpg
 
It seems there's a such an ease from a certain member when posting vitriol against the USA. I would suggest that a more honest approach would be to look at the unbounded cruelty and evil perpetrated by China and Russia, and ask whether they're more acceptable to that poster?

I am disgusted with Haas. They'll never sell me another machine, and if I need repair parts I'll do my damndest to find alternate sources. F them...
 
It seems there's a such an ease from a certain member when posting vitriol against the USA.

The vitriol is towards idiots. These morons literally held up a block of 10L17 and claimed that you could place it on a high-tech machine and make mortar rounds out of it.

The people who say that shit are morons, and the people who believe it likewise. This stinks of aluminum tubes.

I am disgusted with Haas.

You don't know a damn thing about whatever Haas may have or may not have done. You know that some dipshits who claim you can turn lead into gold said Haas was bad boys, but what is behind that ? Neither you nor anyone here knows. And PBS most certainly does not know because their business is not truth, it's stirring up anger, like all the "news" media these days.

Fuck PBS. Dishonest bastards.
 
Haas has enjoyed hefty Russian sponsorship of their F1 racing team for years so likely more than a few favors back and forth over time . . . the invasion of Ukraine has been a huge inconvenience for that relationship.

Milland, no point in attempting dialogue with EG . . . pearls, swine, . . . predictable results.
 
So because of stupid fucking US "sanctions" Haas is supposed to return millions of dollars in good-faith legal transactions ? Who is going to pay for that? You and me?

No, they are totally free to keep the money. Where they fucked up is that they shipped to Russia after global sanctions were imposed. You know, because Russia invaded a sovereign nation and is currently committing countless war crimes - like lobbing cruise missile at hospitals, slaughtering whole villages of unarmed civilians, and bombing schools.

There are solid debates to be had about how involved in this conflict we should be, but it is entirely within the purview of any sovereign government to cut access off to an enemy state from their internal industrial base.

I'm not unaware of the drama between Russia and Ukraine and don't think the Russian invasion was entirely unprovoked, but the video evidence of war crimes being committed by Russia absolutely evaporates the shaky moral ground they stood on to cross the boarder. It is, at this point, just a mark of basic decency to oppose them, regardless of the initial geopolitical drivers.
 
The EG reality distortion field is on HIGH right now. Any time his precious communist (thug) countries are reproached, someone gets upset...

Bad reading skills. Two things determine anger :

1) Stupidity (approach taken by US is blatantly stupid. Look at the calendar. The date will not be 1952).

2) Dishonesty (or dishonesty plus stupidity) -- the entire pbs deal is so loaded with idiotic remarks and comments and so obviously intended to get the rank and file worked up, rather than clarify any situation, that they deserve censure.

But hey, you guys fall for this stuff time after time after time after time after time, and Russia so bad, they killed some civilians ! While the Vincennes, Puff the Magic Gunship blowing up a hospital, precision guided bombing of another country's consulate, my lai, two million vietnamese dead, the creation of the taliban, the creation of the khmer rouge, the chaos in africa, all that stuff was just regrettable small errors, not any sort of indication that US leadership has the brains of a flea.

Yeah, don't listen to eg, he's just a fruitcake (who is cursed with an actual memory).

Must be something in the water ... you guys all drink from the same well ? Norfolk & Southern train pass by there recently ?
 
We never really sanctioned Russia, only the convenient pr things like yachts - which are really critical apparently (sic).
We still get russian oil, because it is essential and money is only for civil purposes, we still get steel, we still use Russian based tech support on industrial machines... We still ship grain.
People can waive flags and say they will never support <insert country> and get a jacket on the way home made in that country.

Some companies will just not care, or do it because they have evil company dna (Siemens). Others might care, then tell themselves their commerce is not big enough to make a difference.

Then other countries do not have to follow our sanctions, their legit right; yet, we will not extend complete sanctions on them- convenience or commerce rules the day.

Personally I do not like this reality.

motion, you just need to find a better logistics partner to handle all the control restrictions. Magically they make shipment possible, of course it is legit - don't ask or tell - but legit.
 
No, they are totally free to keep the money.

In other words, become thieves.

Where they fucked up is that they shipped to Russia after global sanctions were imposed.

This is exactly what I was referring to as American stupidity.

These "sanctions" are not and never will be global. The US does not control the world. Therefore, all they do is redirect transactions.

But worse than that is they are stupidly broad (as well as ineffective) and the other consequences of this retarded shit are negative for a whole lot of people, worldwide. This is like using a flame-thrower to light a burner on your now-outlawed gas stove. There will be effects far beyond the lit burner.

These moron actions by games-players in Washington are fine for them, what do they care ? They have the millions they sucked up from our trough and gobbled up in insider trades. Who will be damaged by their stupid actions ? Regular people all over the world, including US citizens. How come people go bankrupt from needing an operation ? how come you have 1,000 train crashes a year ? How come there's tens of thousands of people living on the streets, in tents and pushing their belongings around in a shopping cart ? You think upsetting the applecart, trying to jam NATO into Ukraine, handing over billions of $$ so the hotshots in worshington can fight to the last ukrainian, none of this stuff effects normal people in the US ?

Of course it does. Your lives are being screwed over so that these assholes can play King of the World.

It's not global. Much, if not most, of the world only pays lip service to the neocon shit. As soon as they are inside the front door they do not say nice things about drooling Joe Biden or Iraq-conquering (whoop dee effing doo, maybe he could quarterback a Pop Warner game in his spare time) George Bush.

One day the US will go broke from this crap, just like every other militarist empire the world has seen.

You know, because Russia invaded a sovereign nation and is currently committing countless war crimes - like lobbing cruise missile at hospitals, slaughtering whole villages of unarmed civilians, and bombing schools.

You really shouldn't put that stuff out in public, as your hypocrisy becomes apparent to everyone on the planet. Russsia has about four or five sovereign nations to go before they catch up to the US, and a hell of a lot of war crimes. They better get busy.
 
Ukraine was a good reason for Haas to dump their Russian driver. His oligarch daddy had paid the full years sponsorship that the Haas team did not return when they offed their piss poor driver. Looks like in the first race this year that they may have a half ass decent car this year.
 
Looks like in the first race this year that they may have a half ass decent car this year.

Do you s'pose they have boxed rods ? :D

Ya know ... if the rod boxers had milled out the center portion before they welded on the side plates ? That'd be the same thing as the newest grooviest hollow rods (in a 50's sort of way).

Maybe our chevy crank guy can try that :D
 
Gene Haas gets himself in trouble again. This maybe a lot more serious then his previous problems
 
Milland, no point in attempting dialogue with EG . . . pearls, swine, . . . predictable results.

Go ahead; quote the book of Matthew to Milland and see just how well it is received.
:popcorn:


No, they are totally free to keep the money. Where they fucked up is that they shipped to Russia after global sanctions were imposed. You know, because Russia invaded a sovereign nation

No, that is theft plain and simple. Russia may be doing things they shouldn't but it doesn't mean that if company 'X' buys a machine, you can all of sudden keep their money and refuse to deliver goods.

Ukraine is not a sovereign nation either. They are owned by BlackRock inc and JP Morgan Chase. People need to stop using this "Invasion of a sovereign nation" line as justification for any and all actions. If ABC Machine orders a VMC 4000 from you, than you are required to deliver it, period.

IIRC; 5 axis machines and operating software are the only ones covered by ITAR.

No, I don't "side with Russia" either. I am merely an observer. If you want source information, I'll bring it.
 
Gene Haas gets himself in trouble again. This maybe a lot more serious then his previous problems

I especially don't understand why they continued any machine shipping if they'd already used the excuse of the war to dump Mazepin BEFORE formal sanctions were in place. And NOW that the sanctions exist, they ship machines and or parts? WTF??
 
Go ahead; quote the book of Matthew to Milland and see just how well it is received.
:popcorn:




No, that is theft plain and simple. Russia may be doing things they shouldn't but it doesn't mean that if company 'X' buys a machine, you can all of sudden keep their money and refuse to deliver goods.

Ukraine is not a sovereign nation either. They are owned by BlackRock inc and JP Morgan Chase. People need to stop using this "Invasion of a sovereign nation" line as justification for any and all actions. If ABC Machine orders a VMC 4000 from you, than you are required to deliver it, period.

IIRC; 5 axis machines and operating software are the only ones covered by ITAR.

No, I don't "side with Russia" either. I am merely an observer. If you want source information, I'll bring it.

I'm not sure if this is parody, or if you truly believe what you've typed.

The mod here doesn't like it when I call out lies like these, so I can only hope that folks here will understand that what you're written is just fiction, with no basis in reality.
 
In other words, become thieves.
No. Most contracts have exceptions for the force majeure of government actions beyond the businesses control.

Besides, we're talking about Gene Haas here for christ sakes. You think this would be the first time a contract hasn't canceled in his favor and he wound up with the cash, but not shipping product? Gene Haas makes Donald Trump look like Jack Welch when it comes to running a business above-board; the things he has done have been notorious and he's a felon for life.

This is exactly what I was referring to as American stupidity.

These "sanctions" are not and never will be global. The US does not control the world. Therefore, all they do is redirect transactions.

Brentton Woods baby. We do control the world. You wanna do global busines? Do you conduct that business in RMB or Pounds Sterling? No... you do that business in American dollars, because we control the world's currency.

You wanna ship anything across the ocean blue? You do so under the loving protection of the US Navy.

You think America is just a bunch of dumb yokles? We have our moments, but we certainly are looking like the best of the worst over the last few years. You wanna live under Honey Bear Jinping? You can kiss my ass with the notion that we're somehow extra savage - the this guy runs a country with a few million people in concentration camps and they have execution busses.

We are the least worst option for global leadership, and we are withdrawing. You don't like us? That's fine... but you're about to watch the world get really fair, really quickly. It's going to be a disaster.

These moron actions by games-players in Washington are fine for them,

I'm no fan of Biden, but we're basically defeating the world's 3rd largest military, a near-peer adversary for the last 60 years, and doing so for probably about $200 Billion when all is said and done, and not a drop of American blood spilt.

You want to talk about governments making poor decisions for their people? America is a place of decadence where sure, like 15% of our citizens live in poverty - you know, in houses, with cell phones, TVs, internet, running water, electricity, and so much food, obesity is a far bigger problem than starvation. Out of the 7 Billion people on this planet, about 6 Billion of them would literally kill to be a "poor" person in America being taken such terrible advantage of by our government.

Putin, on the other hand, has taken a country in the stages of a catastrophic demographic collapse, and decided to throw 20% of his population under the age of 30 into a meat grinder to be chewed up by NATO proxy forces. For what? Absolutely nothing. Again, please shove this notion that America is somehow just terrible to it's people when you've got Putin literally acceleration his demographic catastrophe with no upside. 50% of that remaining population of young men will die of cirrhosis before the age of 52.


You really shouldn't put that stuff out in public, as your hypocrisy becomes apparent to everyone on the planet. Russsia has about four or five sovereign nations to go before they catch up to the US, and a hell of a lot of war crimes. They better get busy.

Public? You dillusional clod... The videos of Russian atrocities currently being committed are on video. You can track their movements in real-time and see precisely what they are doing. Jesus christ - put this stuff out in public. Russia's military is such a drunk, corrupt, incompetent bunch of buffoons they haven't even been able to shut down Ukrainian networks - the entire war is there for all to see from original sources.
 
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