Fanuc 21m tool carousel issue. Probably simple but tried everything.

[RedRider]

Hi,

I usually just look here to find the help I need but this time I cant find the answer.

I have a 96 Excel 5T18 with 21m Fanuc control. It works great usually, but I shut it down for 2 wks for a medical issue and turned it back on and here is the weird problem.

It cant find the tools correctly. If I clear and reset the tools: m100 and m101. The carousel works sorta. I call T1 not adding m6 and it rotates and drops pot into change position. The pot tag is #1 that it does call up. Pot #2 called again by T2 and no M6, it calls the correct pot and moves it into change position. It continues to due this until I call T4. here it always rotates to the pot but never moves it into the change position. Machine basically hangs here. Must do M100/M101 again and rotate carousel again to get it to start at T1 again, T2 and T3, if I SKIP T4...any tool after T4 is "lost" position wise, the carousel just rotates 2 times and times out without finding the correct pot. I can reset in this spinning of the arousel and call up lets say T12 and it will hunt for it but rotates 2 revolutions and times out again.

This is repeatable after every M100/M101 sequence. I assume there is a store tool in spindle issue somewhere that has T4 stuck in it.

It does exactly the same when trying T1M6 it will change the tools up to 4 and gets "stuck" on tool 4 or hunts for any tools 5 and above.

I have tried reading everything I can find to fix this but I am baffled!!!

I appreciate any and all help.

Thanks

 

[sinha]

I do not really have an answer.
What happens when executing T1 M06 T4?

 

[RedRider]

Puts T1 in spindle, carousel rotates and hand on pot/tool 4. I have to reset it again.

 

[sinha]

Possibly a small hardware problem. Hope someone helps you.

 

[DouglasJRizzo]

I had a neighboring shop have a similar issue on a VMC.
There is an encoder on the ATC carousel that tells the control which pots are in position -
If it gets dirty with congealed coolant and/or chips, it can mis read the carousel.
It can also get out of line.
I've give that a look.

 

[dandrummerman21]

Do you have a manual for the machine?

There's surely a few counters in the PMC parameters that need to be tended too. Probably misindexed as Douglas mentioned above me.

On machines we have (mid 90's leadwells with 0 and 21 controls), there's usually a few counters that tell the machine what's in the spindle. For example, there's a counter for how many tools the machine has, how many pockets it has, which pocket is facing the spindle, and which tool is in the spindle.

So, now what you need to know, is are those parameters set correctly, and do they change when the carousel moves? You should be able to view the PMC parameters, and go to COUNTERS, and index the turret while looking at them. Something should be changing as it rotates.

Then it's an issue of, is the sensor on the motor that rotates the turret actually seeing the movement? if it is, then it's probably just a case of bad counter values. but if it isn't changing, or not changing dependably, then the sensor might be out of adjustment or simply bad.

That's my suggestion and general knowledge about how your machine is likely set up. Post pictures if you need further help.


Edit: I googled, and now have the important question: Does the machine have a swing arm tool changer? And is the tool changer "random", meaning what's in pocket 1 might not actually be tool 1?

If that is the case, there might be a whole list of counters so the machine knows what's in each pocket. Slightly more complicated.

 

[RedRider]

Douglas,
Ok, you first. YES! It does have an independent encoder. I wasnt sure that was even a place to look as it seems to know where the "Hard" pot #1 is but I guess the reference pulse could still be working but cant count from there correctly. I can get a refurb one for $150.00. Today I will remove it and have a close look. I will post tomorrow on that.

Now Dandrummer,

Unfortunately no manual just the fanuc parameter manual so I do not know where the machine tool is putting the counters in at. I have searched many times thru the DG and PAR that I can see and have never found any that appear to corallate to the carousel. Yes it is a swing arm random tool carousel. But after using M100/M101 to "reset" carousel, it does always find the pot labeled #1. But before removing encoder I will again take a good look at the counters to see if I can find them.

I will post a couple of pics, especially of the encoder and anything else I think is relevant. Getting this fixed would be the best Labor Day ever! I will post Saturday with my findings. Everyone have a good holiday!

Thanks,

 

[RedRider]

Big Update:

I have found the problem, hard to believe...but it is a mouse problem! See pictures!

 

[RedRider]

This is the wire coming from encoder into back panel and the damage is severe and obvious. Time to buy some Victor Traps!

 

[Garwood]

Been there before. Time for a shop cat!

 

[RedRider]

Unfortunately...The damage is done but not fixed. I have a encoder ordered. After splicing wires, there was no guessing as each color was intact on wire terminal strip to match.

But the machine might be worse now as it will not rotate carousel and seems to have no desire to. Manually it will still rotate.

 

[BT Fabrication]

Im wondering what it doesn't like in the logic why it wont automatically move

 

[DouglasJRizzo]

Head to the local animal rescue and adopt the one really MEAN cat no one wants. Problem solved.
Worked for me!

 

[Garwood]

Head to the local animal rescue and adopt the one really MEAN cat no one wants. Problem solved.
Worked for me!

LMAO! That's exactly what I did.

 

[preston714]

Head to the local animal rescue and adopt the one really MEAN cat no one wants. Problem solved.
Worked for me!

love this! We put machines down in mexico to cut gear forgings and 'needed that cat' for the rats they kept as pets - should have been first thing on my list to do! God Bless!