Getting apron bottom off on 10EE with electric leadscrew reverse

[old_dave]

I'm trying to get the bottom off the apron on my 10EE in order to change the filter on the Bijur oil pump. First I couldn't get the bottom past the circular boss around where the rod for the electric leadscrew reverse goes into the thing (for want of a better term)on the lower right bottom of the apron so I loosened that electric leadscrew thing on the apron (which has caused another problem to be dealt with later). This in itself wasn't easy, I had to cut off the end of an Allen wrench to get at the socket head cap screws holding this on the apron. Once the apron bottom was clear of that, I found the rod prevents the apron bottom from coming down far enough to come clear of the oil pump. Do I have to remove the electric lead screw reverse control rod to get the apron bottom off or is there an easier way? If so, how do I do get the rod off?

 

[daryl bane]

old dave, try this. I am sure there might be a easier way, but this is what I did. Take out the allenhead bolts holding the reverse leadscrew switchbox on the RH end of the ways.It is dowelled on and a precision fit. The reverse leadscrew rod is the only one pinned to the collar on the switchbox.Drift the pin out.The end bearings for both the leadscrew and the feedrod are elliptical and should allow enough leeway to remove the switchbox. The leadscrew and the feedrod should (I said should )pull out of the reverse leadscrew switchbox.The leadscrew should be the only one with a circlip holding it to its bearing but should slip out of the housing as a assy. Now there are a bunch of important wires going in that switchbox thru a hole in the ways and hopefully you should have enough slack to pull it away. This done,you can now pull the reverse leadscrew rod thru the apron away from the main gearbox. It is not attached or pinned to the main gearbox casting. Whew! I didn't say this was going to be easy. Those bearings for the reverse leadscrew rod (in the switchbox)are ulp!! class 7's and veery
expensive. They are a weird size and I never
found cheap replacements. Say it with me "I
love my EE, I love my EE. Now thats better isn't it? Hope this helps. Daryl

 

[daryl bane]

Boy, I always forget something. The pins that align the switchbox to the way mounting boss are threaded taper pins. They are slotted. Remove these from the front of the switchbox and along with the allen bolts, the
whole switchbox can be pulled straight back,
leaving all three rods in situ. Then, as said earlier, the reverseleadscrew rod can be pulled out. Sorry about that. Daryl

 

[Bruce L]

Daryl, I read your post with interest because my 10ee has problems in the apron also. I have the electric leadscrew reverse option. That being the case means that the forward and reverse lever is on the right side of the apron. My forward and reverse lever moves up and down normally but nothing else mechanical happens. Having no previous experience with the 10ee I have to plead ignorance. Isn't the forward and reverse lever is supposed turn the rod for the leadscrew reverse? Since mine does not would you know which part(s) I have problems with? Will they require the same dissassembly you have described?


Bruce Lahmayer

 

[daryl bane]

Bruce, That lever on the far right side of the apron is the forward/reverse lever. You pull the chrome ball end and move the lever up or down to go forward/reverse. This lever is geared to a keyed gear that the reverseleadscrew rod goes thru. When you move your lever, it turns this rod via the switchbox on the RH end of the ways and actuates the microswitches (inside) that control the drive motor. If your lever is
not moving that rod, you might have a sheared or missing tapered pin or there may
be something missing in there. All the actuating gears are in that little box on the RH bottom of the apron, next to the apron
sump. There is a chrome square lockbolt and
little alum. lever on the front. You use this to adjust your electric leadscrew
parameters, along with the rheostats/button
at the butt end of the ways. I hope this helps. Daryl .PS Get the parts manual from
Monarch and you will see how this works.

 

[Bruce L]

Daryl, thanks much for your reply. I am hoping I will be able to effectively repair the forward/reverse mechanism without the major apron disassembly that you have described. This problem really had me puzzled at first because as you know, the mechanism has to be in the neutral position in order for the main solenoid to energize all of the electronics. But then of course the forward/reverse lever has to move those switches to get it to go. I have been just twisting the lead screw reverse rod manually to run the lathe. I have the Manual showing the parts but what I have to look at is a mechanical drawing of the assembly. It is not really an exploded diagram. It is 2D, sort of like looking at an x-ray of the parts all assembled. I found it hard to learn from the drawing what the most likely problem was or how much disassembly would be needed. I thought at first I had an electronic problem when it wouldn't run even though the lever was in neutral just like the book said it should be. Is there a service manual for these lathes?

Bruce L.

 

[daryl bane]

Bruce, If there is a service manual, I have
never seen one. The operators manual has some
basic troubleshooting,but nothing to explain
a comprehensive overhaul,which is what I am
doing at this moment. Daryl

 

[old_dave]

Originally posted by daryl bane:
Boy, I always forget something. The pins that align the switchbox to the way mounting boss are threaded taper pins. They are slotted. Remove these from the front of the switchbox and along with the allen bolts, the
whole switchbox can be pulled straight back,
leaving all three rods in situ. Then, as said earlier, the reverseleadscrew rod can be pulled out. Sorry about that. Daryl

When I take the end cover off the electric leadscrew reverse switch housing/feed rod end bearing/leadscrew end bearing assembly (henceforth known as the "end assembly") there's a round coverplate, about 1 1/4 inch diameter, at the lower left held on with 3 flat head screws. If I take that off, I see the end of the forward/reverse control rod. Once I get the pin out of that rod as it goes into the collar at the side of the end assembly facing the headstock, the control rod will come out of the housing, it'll presumably come all the way out of the lathe unless there's a wall too close to the tailstock end of the machine. It helps to tighten the trip thingy on the rod and tap on it with a soft hammer. Was it a bad idea to do it this way. It did avoid removing the end assembly.Once the control rod is moved far enough to no longer be under the apron bottom (much)I can get the apron bottom clear. What happens if I take the rod all the way out? Will a key fall free inside that component at the lower right of the apron? Will the rod be easy or difficult to get back into that component? Don't want to take it all the way out if it's really diffucult. The thing is when I loosened and slightly lowered the leadscrew reverse thing ("the component") at the lower right of the apron I think the gear train between the control lever and the control rod may have gotten out of synch/track as now the control rod will only go between neutral and up, it will not go down. I'm sure I will have more questions as I work through this

 

[daryl bane]

Old Dave, I don't see why that won't work. I don't know how easy a slip fit the rod is to the collar on the switchbox. But if it pushes through, that is simple enough. Yes, the keyed gear has a removable key that may
fall down once the rod is removed, but when you loosened the reverse/leadscrew thing on the bottom rh of the apron, you probably did lose the gear sync.If you take it off, you'll see how to sync it back up. Its pretty simple. Lots of people don't realize how complex these machines are, especially on a manual lathe. Daryl