Haas VF3 vs DN Solutions DNM 4500

[EchoScorpion]

As the title says, I was wondering what y'all's thoughts are between the two machines. My boss is looking at getting the company's first CNC machine. He is pretty set on the Haas as it is made in America, but after running a Haas at another company, I feel that the "Half-assed American shit" is a pretty good acronym for Haas. We ran both Haas and Mori Seiki at the other company I worked for and the Mori Seiki, even though between 5 and 10 years older, ran circles around the Haas. Both machines are pretty comparable in price with the DN Solutions costing a bit more, but comes standard with both 4th and 5th axis drives. We wouldn't start with 4th axis, but it would be nice to be able to grow into it without having to buy additional drives like we would with a Haas. Our parts aren't super tight tolerance, but the additional rigidity out of a DN Solutions seems nice.

What are y'all's thoughts between the two?

P.S. He is also looking at getting a TL2, have any of y'all ever run production on a TL2?

Lastly, what are your thoughts on having two different brands of CNC. I know many shops run different brands of machines, but if we are buying them together, wouldn't it make more sense programming wise to share the same machine ecosystem.

 

[MaxPrairie]

The Haas VF2 used to be the go-to CNC for machine shop start ups. Haven't bought a new Haas since '18, but going to my dealer's machine show in a couple weeks. Last time I wasn't excited about the new designs but we have a couple to upgrade here.

TL2 isn't really a production machine, more of a light use machine.

If that is what Haas stands for does DNS = Do Not Service?

Most people with the DNM seem to say it's a solid machine.

Hopefully this thread will get moved to General or CNC machine section, doesn't really belong in Mat Hand/rigging.

 

[EchoScorpion]

The Haas VF2 used to be the go-to CNC for machine shop start ups. Haven't bought a new Haas since '18, but going to my dealer's machine show in a couple weeks. Last time I wasn't excited about the new designs but we have a couple to upgrade here.

TL2 isn't really a production machine, more of a light use machine.

If that is what Haas stands for does DNS = Do Not Service?

Most people with the DNM seem to say it's a solid machine.

Hopefully this thread will get moved to General or CNC machine section, doesn't really belong in Mat Hand/rigging.

I didn't even realize I put it in Material handling/ rigging. Must have clicked the wrong button.

 

[Donkey Hotey]

Some things to consider that will be unique to your specific location:

• What is the reputation and general vibe you get from your local machinery sellers? This could make or break a decision, based solely on what your address is.
• What is your local market looking like for getting other trained people to run these machines? You may have a local community college or even high school pumping out people with at least beginning level of experience with Haas. That won't be the case with DNS.

A TL-2 for "production"? That would depend on what you mean by production. If you have the contract for 150,000 of something for the auto industry, no, the TL would be an awful choice. If you get batch jobs of a few hundred parts, the answer is 'maybe.'

If you start equipping a TL with the turret and everything else, it starts to get into ST-20 territory. Buy a collet closer and a few more bits of tooling and you could easily spend every dime of ST-20 money with much lower performance. I'd look at the ST-20 with a bar puller if you're really doing production. It's going to have a hydraulic chuck, which means you can program the chuck which means you can pull the bar as part of the cycle, which means you now do entire bars unattended instead of reloading each part.

Or consider the DNS equivalent lathe.

 

[david n]

Don't buy the Haas...............the DN4500 is better iron by a country mile...........I have both Doosan(now DN) and Haas in my shop..........I'm down to my last Haas and I have 4 Doosan machines. They are better built, better value, and will require less maintenance.....................and sure Haas are made in the US.............but that doesn't carry over to a better machine.............lot's of cheap foreign components on them.............

 

[empower]

As the title says, I was wondering what y'all's thoughts are between the two machines. My boss is looking at getting the company's first CNC machine. He is pretty set on the Haas as it is made in America, but after running a Haas at another company, I feel that the "Half-assed American shit" is a pretty good acronym for Haas. We ran both Haas and Mori Seiki at the other company I worked for and the Mori Seiki, even though between 5 and 10 years older, ran circles around the Haas. Both machines are pretty comparable in price with the DN Solutions costing a bit more, but comes standard with both 4th and 5th axis drives. We wouldn't start with 4th axis, but it would be nice to be able to grow into it without having to buy additional drives like we would with a Haas. Our parts aren't super tight tolerance, but the additional rigidity out of a DN Solutions seems nice.

What are y'all's thoughts between the two?

P.S. He is also looking at getting a TL2, have any of y'all ever run production on a TL2?

Lastly, what are your thoughts on having two different brands of CNC. I know many shops run different brands of machines, but if we are buying them together, wouldn't it make more sense programming wise to share the same machine ecosystem.

thats a very clever acronym! i'm gonna steal and use it from now on, lmao.

and yeah, doosan HANDS DOWN. its easily 5x+ the machine that haas is at only about 10-20% more price.

 

[david n]

"Half-assed American shit"

Yeah...........I like that one too.

 

[LockNut]

I work for DNS. Just so you know, none of the DNM's come equipped with 4th and/or 5th drives. But they are included in the price if you purchase a table with the machine. Rotary table price includes everything. The control is a 4+1 setup.
If you have other questions, you can contact me at [email protected]