Hardinge HLV-EM Won’t Shift

[adh2000]

Haven’t threaded for a while on my HLV-EM. I can’t get the English Metric or the 1-2-3 selector to move. Took the cover off the back of the headstock and took a look. Obvious how it works, both selectors slide gears on opposite ends of the same shaft. Lube looks good gears turn fine but won’t slide over on the shaft. How can they be so stuck? Gawd. Anyone else have this problem?



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[AgnewBlues]

Haven’t threaded for a while on my HLV-EM. I can’t get the English Metric or the 1-2-3 selector to move. Took the cover off the back of the headstock and took a look. Obvious how it works, both selectors slide gears on opposite ends of the same shaft. Lube looks good gears turn fine but won’t slide over on the shaft. How can they be so stuck? Gawd. Anyone else have this problem?



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Not moving at all or not going all the way into position? On all HLV lathes, you may need to wiggle the shafts by hand (open the lid for access to where the external gears go, you will see two shafts protruding), while shifting the gear lever or the 1-2-3 knob, to get it to mesh. Obviously with the spindle stopped.

If you have the external gear bracket (banjo) installed, it will mechanically prevent any of the internal gearing from meshing to prevent damage. You need to remove that to use the gearbox.

With the threading knob disengaged and the gear lever in “out”, you should be able to easily rotate both protruding shafts independently of each other.

 

[Richard King]

https://ia601004.us.archive.org/34/items/lathe-manuals/Hardinge HLVU Manuel.pdf

http://www.babinmachine.com/PDF/Hardinge HLV-H Maintenance Manual.pdf

 

[Mtndew]

Sheared key maybe?

 

[MCritchley]

I had the same issue with an HLV-h that I recently bought. Most of the sliding gears in the quick change were stuck on their respective sliding shafts. I simply nudged the slider with a pry bar from back of the machine through an open cover. It was a gentle nudge and I was not quick to jump to that tool.
This was done after a soaking of kroil and generous oiling.
The previous owners grease had hardened and made things sticky.
It’s really a shame Hardinge didn’t do a better job with that gearbox. It would have been much better with an oil bath.

 

[adh2000]

I had the same issue with an HLV-h that I recently bought. Most of the sliding gears in the quick change were stuck on their respective sliding shafts. I simply nudged the slider with a pry bar from back of the machine through an open cover. It was a gentle nudge and I was not quick to jump to that tool.
This was done after a soaking of kroil and generous oiling.
The previous owners grease had hardened and made things sticky.
It’s really a shame Hardinge didn’t do a better job with that gearbox. It would have been much better with an oil bath.

Yes it’s like that. Not a gear mesh problem. The slider has cemented itself to the shaft. I’ve been trying that gentle nudging but no movement yet. Soaking in Kroil now.




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[rons]

It's happened to my lathe about three times. The fix is a wood mallet and a medium force blow to the shaft behind the selector knob.
The blow will move the gear train slightly to the right and then the gears are in line again.

Remove the gear box cover cover first. If you are not sure about this then remove the cover (not the door) and post a picture.

 

[adh2000]

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[adh2000]

OK here’s a pic. It’s the upper shaft in back. I rotated it so the keyway is facing the camera. On the far right you see a gear, that’s the 1-2-3 selector, on the far left is another gear that’s the E-M selector. Not sure where I’d be tapping anything with a wood mallet.


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[rons]

It's the shaft side cover. I assumed it would be apparent that "to the shaft" would mean on the end, Otherwise it's damage.

I just had to do this less that 2 weeks ago. Try taping on the screw gear shaft. What I did was remove the cover UNDERNEATH
the screw gear and tap something. Problem is I was so pissed of that I don't remember if I really didn't have to remove the
cover at all to get at something. I used wedges made from Maple to move the cover off.

The shaft in your picture is one of ones in the back.

 

[adh2000]

Are suggesting taking this end cover off? It supports all the shafts. I know what you mean about being pissed off. Best I take a break for a while before I destroy something.


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[rons]

Yes. The shaft I'm thinking about is low and in front. If you had the cover off you would immediately see the gear train
out of line and know which shaft needs to be pushed inward. I think on mine it was 1/16".

Or you can try gently taping on that lower 22 gear shaft or the one up and to it's right.

One other thread was asking if painting a machine should be done in individual pieces or all at one time.
Now if the lathe was painted all at one time the intersection of the gear box cover plate (soon to be removed )
and the headstock would have a paint crack. So I'm not a fan of full body painting. On the other hand, if a machine has each
part painted then it's possible that damage will occur to pieces on assembly. Then a small air brush is nice.

 

[car2]

Another common issue is one or both of the selector knob shafts will bind up in the bushing due to old/polymerized oi. The shafts fit in those bushings VERY closely. To free the selector shafts, remove the plastic knobs, the access plate near the spindle, the shafts can be moved a little bit axially by pressing on the outside shaft, then on the insider gear, douse the bushings inside and out with isopropyl alcohol (IPA works better on dried up oil than mineral-spirits), work the shafts back and forth. When moving freely, douse with mineral-spirits, the spindle oil.
Cleaned the gearbox without taking apart by placing a pan underneath, dousing with squirt bottle and mineral spirits, clean grease with toothbrushes and bent utility brushes and more mineral spirits, move gears around, rinse with mineral-spirits, regrease with various brushes.

 

[adh2000]

I had thought of that but the selector knob shafts are free. The selector knob can be wiggled back and forth, not much play but enough to tell it’s free. IPA you say. I was thinking maybe douse it with acetone. You think IPA is better than acetone? Right now I’ve got Kroil on it.


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[rons]

This issue is something that should not happen. The fix is taping a gear shaft on the outside left. The other end of the shaft moves either:

- Inside the ID of a bearing, the bearing is held rigid but the shaft is loose in the bearing ID.
- Outside on the OD of the bearing, the bearing is loose in a retaining hole.

My opinion on Hardinge gear box is that going from Metric to English is a PIA. The Metric banjo comes off but then one of the large gears has to be removed too.
One thing about those import lathes is that all the controls can do any thread with any bs. Including this shaft bs.

BTW

You have to remove the cir-clips on each bearing before that cover can come off.

 

[adh2000]

Mass amounts of Kroil, patience, and some nudging payed dividends and both selector gears now shift just as they should. Whatever lube someone used in this gearbox turned into some amazing adhesive.


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[car2]

Usually the stuck selector knobs is a progressive thing, or they're just very difficult to turn--not completely bound up.

Yes, I've found IPA (or ethyl alcohol), is most effective for hardened oil, and it won't eat up the paint, plastic or rubber parts. Alcohol is more effective on *polymerized hardened oil* than acetone, mineral-spirits, and PB Blaster. I had some stuck nuts on the leadscrew/dial assembly of a Hardinge (again, with fine-fitting threads), the only thing that eventually loosened those up was soaking in warm IPA for hours. Acetone is out of the question around paint and plastic anyhow. I also use the hand-sanitizers (contain mostly IPA or ethyl and glycerin) to clean old oil and grime from painted surfaces (using rags and toothbrushes), and on metal surfaces (brass-brushes can be used)--slather on, let stand a couple minutes, and brush/wipe.

 

[MCritchley]

Mass amounts of Kroil, patience, and some nudging payed dividends and both selector gears now shift just as they should. Whatever lube someone used in this gearbox turned into some amazing adhesive.


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Mine may have stuck from coolant working its way into the gearbox. The previous owner used water based coolant that had caused a few issues that i fixed. After use and more soaking my gear box really freed up nicely.