G&L4nahalf
Cast Iron
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2014
- Location
- Temporarily Florida
Thinking about the men who have acquired an engine lathe; and one or more of the following machines : milling machine, radial drill, shaper, Horizontal Boring Mill, surface grinder, etc.; and whom do not have extensive experience in making tooling for manual machines. Those that want to see their machinery working, and do not have the fortune to spend on "off the shelf" tooling. The one man shop.. probably doing one of a kind work; repair jobs, fabrications and unusual configurations. Keep in mind that most of your special tooling may be used only one time; or rarely. Therefore you need to keep it simple; if it takes a little longer to do the job than a 400" speed CNC, it is totally irrelevant, because you might only make just a few passes with your special tooling, and that job will be done. Same with the cutting tool material, a cheap general purpose grade that wouldn't be a start for CNC, will in most cases do just fine..
My background and where I'm coming from..
In 1957, I put on as an apprentice in a medium sized Tool and Die Job Shop - whom had a Govt contract for experimental rocket motor parts. Cost plus.. And all employees cleared for secret work. Govt tolerances were 2 tenths or less. Woe to the person who scrapped anything! The shop tolerance was .0001, and the lead men had their own tolerances of 80 millionths or less. Before long, I was put on lapping parallel surfaces. Not knowing any better, I was striving for 5 millionths or less; and had a "bear" of a time getting it below 60 millionths. We used a "shadow graph" measuring mach with a special "test-type" indicator. The mach had a narrow rectangular screen with large 5 millionths graduations. "Then", I thought everybody did this kind of work; and "now" I know that we were using sub-standard equipment for machining.
In 1962, I moved up the ladder, and put on as an apprentice with a master journeyman mach-tool re-builder. He was then about 40, and looking back, I have seen none better. He was immaculate in work habits and insisted on spotless conditions tho we ourselves got quite dirty. Two crews of 6 men each, were employed to rebuild a 500 man shop; and the equipment had been worked hard, 24/5, 6 and 7. Everything was under 25 years. Before long, he pronounced me as a top scraper; but I could not master small bores and shafts which the old-timers then did routinely. Also, I was inept at artistic decoration; which he assigned to an inept scraper. Before long, I noticed the shop manager was getting highly pissed off when he looked at the decorative scraping. He considered it as a useless waste of purpose. Wasn't long before we stopped doing it. The other team was sloppy and nasty with their work; and after a major disaster with a nice recent Bullard VTL; were all fired. We then had all the work, and that instilled in me the love of looking at a piece of machinery that had been restored to better than new condition.
Through the years, I have "jumped around" at different jobs; an exceeding lot - easily finding employment in places that did very difficult work and extreme tolerances; and this is why I sometimes refer to myself as the "rogue journeyman". I did manage to pick up at least a few - new and better ways of doing things at virtually every place I was in; and since I liked to make a lot of my own tooling, was almost invariably asked by management to "help out" and make shop tooling plus jigs and fixtures. This is where I'm coming from; what is described below was admired in most places I've been in. Also, I was a very heavy recycler before it was PC.
There are many on this forum that can offer improvements to mine and much additional items. I warmly invite them to do so; thinking especially of Tyrone and Sammy but also too many others to list. We will all benefit and be better for it. My sketches were made with the MS Paint program.
Made a set of 6 in different configurations and lengths - covering everything from a 1" hogger to a 6" flycutter. Used them in a 75 man shop and the mill men were constantly borrowing them. They ran smooth in the mach, pretty finish, little need for sharpening, and nearly indestructible. I like to orient the tool so that it throws the chips away from me (backwards from the picture). While welding these, the heads got red-hot and I threw them into a bucket of ashes overnight. The bolts were surplus and the lathe bits were worn. Total time was ~2 1/2 hrs and total cost - a little welding rod and electricity. I would not buy bolts for my self; if I couldn't get them almost free, then I would try another alternative.
I learned a major lesson from G&L who made their in-house boring tools from soft metal. They will greatly out-perform expensive hardened and ground tools. My sources for tooling stock are : a local scrap yard that will sell back metal; say - for ~15% over the buying price. Previously scrapped parts, from either mistakes or left-over repair work; or auction sales. Never from Steel suppliers. Like to make these in sets of ~12 for my own self. Short ones ~14" long not counting the length for the holding end. Longer ~26" plus same for the end. Two sizes, ~.900 dia to work out a 1" drilled bore, and ~2" for larger bores, and the holding ends in at least 4 different configurations - a. 3 flat-sided for lathe tool-holders, b. Morse taper for either the tail-stock or milling machines using it, c. a 1" dia. round end to fit Cincinnati tool holders, with .0005 clearance and two flats drilled for the holding screws. You can locate the positions by squirting blueing in the threaded holes. I do not like to mill flats for screws on diameters, preferring to start the flat with an old center-drill ground into a small two-fluted end-mill, and the clearance circle bottomed with an old stub drill ground likewise as a two-flute end-mill - all in the hand drill-press. d. a HBM taper to fit your spindle. This is the tricky one because you have to coordinate the locking key with the knock-out drift. Remember, nothing needs to be precise on these; you are not making them to sell as a business; only for in-house use - except the threads for the tool holding screws -they need to be tight. If they work loose, you are looking at a major disaster. I use a shim on top of the tool bit for the screws to work into; except if you plan on a lot of tool-steel bit work, then I grind off the cup-point tips to a slightly convex point and tighten directly on the tool-steel bit. Three screws for the .900 size and 4 for the ~2" dia bar. Generally, I could make a set of about 12 in one configuration in a day. The HBM taper needs to be made to fit that particular machine.
These are especially useful for accurately facing large areas on fabrications. Often, there is distortion due to welding heat, along with varying hardness in the metal, also due to welding. This tool works well in the 12" to 24" range. The tool-bit is oriented side-ways to the cut; and cocked out at an angle to give ~1/4" or so clearance from the holding bars. The tool is a bit big for a Bridgeport size; but will work well in a #2 horizontal or bigger. I make them out of 1" plate; cut out with a torch. You may find a 1 1/2" end off a 16" bar, but that is iffy. The procedure I use to make them is as follows : 1. lay out a circle with trammels of the size you want and poss a bit bigger. Allow 1/8" extra for the cutting torch. Cut it out. Grind off the scale on both faces, and bevel with a heavy grinder. 2. Weld your holding system blank to one face. 3. Hold the stub in the lathe chuck and turn the OD and skin the front face. 4. Turn the part around and turn your stub blank to finish for your holding system. 5. Cut your tool-bit holding bars longer than you need; and tap for the allen-screws. 6. Lay out on the face for your tool holding bars and weld them in. It is better to err on the side of bigger, you can always shim under the tool-bit; but it will be hard to mill off the the seat-bar if it is welded above center. * I don't think any cheap tool is designed for fab-plate scale; it is best to grind it off first with the heavy hand-grinder; blue, use a straight-edge to determine the hollows, and set the below depth as your roughing cut. Then you might take a .015 finish pass. This tool will in most cases cut flat over the hardened spots. For really large dia cuts for the HBM, I make the tool out of a 2" square by 6' bar with a roughing tool on one end and a finishing tool on the other, with the finishing tool set inside the radius of the roughing. If you need a bigger pass, I guess you should go with a 3" bar and a crane to put it in the spindle
As I'm getting somewhat tired at this state, for now I'd like to wind up with large V-blocks. And I'm wondering how we are coming on our 100$ budget. Hope that you have found a neighbor that has a large yard of scrap; and he want's to give it to you if you just haul it off. Through the years, I've seen many good men try to make larger V-blocks. Invariably they are inaccurate. I'm sure many of you can make accurate V-blocks; but for those that haven't mastered the technique yet, I'd like to offer my input, and turn it into a simple job; that will be accurate to a couple of "tenths" in all directions.. 1. Determine your need according to the size of your available equipment. What diameter will "max out" your equipment? 2. Remembering that the larger the diameter, the flatter the angle, try to come up with a compromise that in this exception would favor a smaller size dia. A 12" wide V-block can hold quite a large dia, so it's best to do the math, and come up with an angle and width more on the conservative side for your projected need. Once you have determined the best angle, figure at least 1" of metal below the cutter-clearance pocket in the center of the picture. Figure at least 1" for the top flats that could be clamped on. All this will give you the total width, height, and angle. A 24" wide by 2" thick, short V-block is a hefty chunk to tote; and a 4" thick 12" wide is a whole lot heavier. For everything larger than 6" dia to 6' dia, I've never found the necessity for anything thicker than 2". So, for your first job, you might consider the 2" thick option. We're now ready to start the work. 3. Lay out the V-blocks on 2" plate, cut them out with the torch, grind off the scale and slag. 4. Mill the faces parallel off the table. All the milling except the angles and tool relief of the center of the angles should be done with the parts laying flat on the machine table. 5. Mill the base. 6. Set up a semi-precision location guide-block 90 degrees to the cutter, locate the bottoms on this, and mill sides "A". This guide-block will be your master reference point. 7. Locate another stop that will let you clean up sides "B". 8. change the stop to clean up the top clamping surface. 9. Put the V-blocks in a vice or whatever, and cut out the tool clearance pocket in the center. You're now almost home. 10. Set the head and cutter angle and rough mill the angle for side "A". 11. Flip the parts and rough mill the angle for side "B". 12. Without changing anything but raising the part a few more thousandths into the cutter for the finish cut; finish mill the angles for side "B". Then flip the parts and do the final cut for the angles on side "A". While working I chamfer all the sharp edges and put a small radius on the edges of the chamfer with a medium emery. This helps in seating the part precisely. If you have been scrupulous in cleanliness and care, you should have two V-blocks the same in all dimensions to within a couple of 10ths. It works for me
If there's further interest, I'll submit more; Geo
My background and where I'm coming from..
In 1957, I put on as an apprentice in a medium sized Tool and Die Job Shop - whom had a Govt contract for experimental rocket motor parts. Cost plus.. And all employees cleared for secret work. Govt tolerances were 2 tenths or less. Woe to the person who scrapped anything! The shop tolerance was .0001, and the lead men had their own tolerances of 80 millionths or less. Before long, I was put on lapping parallel surfaces. Not knowing any better, I was striving for 5 millionths or less; and had a "bear" of a time getting it below 60 millionths. We used a "shadow graph" measuring mach with a special "test-type" indicator. The mach had a narrow rectangular screen with large 5 millionths graduations. "Then", I thought everybody did this kind of work; and "now" I know that we were using sub-standard equipment for machining.
In 1962, I moved up the ladder, and put on as an apprentice with a master journeyman mach-tool re-builder. He was then about 40, and looking back, I have seen none better. He was immaculate in work habits and insisted on spotless conditions tho we ourselves got quite dirty. Two crews of 6 men each, were employed to rebuild a 500 man shop; and the equipment had been worked hard, 24/5, 6 and 7. Everything was under 25 years. Before long, he pronounced me as a top scraper; but I could not master small bores and shafts which the old-timers then did routinely. Also, I was inept at artistic decoration; which he assigned to an inept scraper. Before long, I noticed the shop manager was getting highly pissed off when he looked at the decorative scraping. He considered it as a useless waste of purpose. Wasn't long before we stopped doing it. The other team was sloppy and nasty with their work; and after a major disaster with a nice recent Bullard VTL; were all fired. We then had all the work, and that instilled in me the love of looking at a piece of machinery that had been restored to better than new condition.
Through the years, I have "jumped around" at different jobs; an exceeding lot - easily finding employment in places that did very difficult work and extreme tolerances; and this is why I sometimes refer to myself as the "rogue journeyman". I did manage to pick up at least a few - new and better ways of doing things at virtually every place I was in; and since I liked to make a lot of my own tooling, was almost invariably asked by management to "help out" and make shop tooling plus jigs and fixtures. This is where I'm coming from; what is described below was admired in most places I've been in. Also, I was a very heavy recycler before it was PC.
There are many on this forum that can offer improvements to mine and much additional items. I warmly invite them to do so; thinking especially of Tyrone and Sammy but also too many others to list. We will all benefit and be better for it. My sketches were made with the MS Paint program.
Made a set of 6 in different configurations and lengths - covering everything from a 1" hogger to a 6" flycutter. Used them in a 75 man shop and the mill men were constantly borrowing them. They ran smooth in the mach, pretty finish, little need for sharpening, and nearly indestructible. I like to orient the tool so that it throws the chips away from me (backwards from the picture). While welding these, the heads got red-hot and I threw them into a bucket of ashes overnight. The bolts were surplus and the lathe bits were worn. Total time was ~2 1/2 hrs and total cost - a little welding rod and electricity. I would not buy bolts for my self; if I couldn't get them almost free, then I would try another alternative.
I learned a major lesson from G&L who made their in-house boring tools from soft metal. They will greatly out-perform expensive hardened and ground tools. My sources for tooling stock are : a local scrap yard that will sell back metal; say - for ~15% over the buying price. Previously scrapped parts, from either mistakes or left-over repair work; or auction sales. Never from Steel suppliers. Like to make these in sets of ~12 for my own self. Short ones ~14" long not counting the length for the holding end. Longer ~26" plus same for the end. Two sizes, ~.900 dia to work out a 1" drilled bore, and ~2" for larger bores, and the holding ends in at least 4 different configurations - a. 3 flat-sided for lathe tool-holders, b. Morse taper for either the tail-stock or milling machines using it, c. a 1" dia. round end to fit Cincinnati tool holders, with .0005 clearance and two flats drilled for the holding screws. You can locate the positions by squirting blueing in the threaded holes. I do not like to mill flats for screws on diameters, preferring to start the flat with an old center-drill ground into a small two-fluted end-mill, and the clearance circle bottomed with an old stub drill ground likewise as a two-flute end-mill - all in the hand drill-press. d. a HBM taper to fit your spindle. This is the tricky one because you have to coordinate the locking key with the knock-out drift. Remember, nothing needs to be precise on these; you are not making them to sell as a business; only for in-house use - except the threads for the tool holding screws -they need to be tight. If they work loose, you are looking at a major disaster. I use a shim on top of the tool bit for the screws to work into; except if you plan on a lot of tool-steel bit work, then I grind off the cup-point tips to a slightly convex point and tighten directly on the tool-steel bit. Three screws for the .900 size and 4 for the ~2" dia bar. Generally, I could make a set of about 12 in one configuration in a day. The HBM taper needs to be made to fit that particular machine.
These are especially useful for accurately facing large areas on fabrications. Often, there is distortion due to welding heat, along with varying hardness in the metal, also due to welding. This tool works well in the 12" to 24" range. The tool-bit is oriented side-ways to the cut; and cocked out at an angle to give ~1/4" or so clearance from the holding bars. The tool is a bit big for a Bridgeport size; but will work well in a #2 horizontal or bigger. I make them out of 1" plate; cut out with a torch. You may find a 1 1/2" end off a 16" bar, but that is iffy. The procedure I use to make them is as follows : 1. lay out a circle with trammels of the size you want and poss a bit bigger. Allow 1/8" extra for the cutting torch. Cut it out. Grind off the scale on both faces, and bevel with a heavy grinder. 2. Weld your holding system blank to one face. 3. Hold the stub in the lathe chuck and turn the OD and skin the front face. 4. Turn the part around and turn your stub blank to finish for your holding system. 5. Cut your tool-bit holding bars longer than you need; and tap for the allen-screws. 6. Lay out on the face for your tool holding bars and weld them in. It is better to err on the side of bigger, you can always shim under the tool-bit; but it will be hard to mill off the the seat-bar if it is welded above center. * I don't think any cheap tool is designed for fab-plate scale; it is best to grind it off first with the heavy hand-grinder; blue, use a straight-edge to determine the hollows, and set the below depth as your roughing cut. Then you might take a .015 finish pass. This tool will in most cases cut flat over the hardened spots. For really large dia cuts for the HBM, I make the tool out of a 2" square by 6' bar with a roughing tool on one end and a finishing tool on the other, with the finishing tool set inside the radius of the roughing. If you need a bigger pass, I guess you should go with a 3" bar and a crane to put it in the spindle
As I'm getting somewhat tired at this state, for now I'd like to wind up with large V-blocks. And I'm wondering how we are coming on our 100$ budget. Hope that you have found a neighbor that has a large yard of scrap; and he want's to give it to you if you just haul it off. Through the years, I've seen many good men try to make larger V-blocks. Invariably they are inaccurate. I'm sure many of you can make accurate V-blocks; but for those that haven't mastered the technique yet, I'd like to offer my input, and turn it into a simple job; that will be accurate to a couple of "tenths" in all directions.. 1. Determine your need according to the size of your available equipment. What diameter will "max out" your equipment? 2. Remembering that the larger the diameter, the flatter the angle, try to come up with a compromise that in this exception would favor a smaller size dia. A 12" wide V-block can hold quite a large dia, so it's best to do the math, and come up with an angle and width more on the conservative side for your projected need. Once you have determined the best angle, figure at least 1" of metal below the cutter-clearance pocket in the center of the picture. Figure at least 1" for the top flats that could be clamped on. All this will give you the total width, height, and angle. A 24" wide by 2" thick, short V-block is a hefty chunk to tote; and a 4" thick 12" wide is a whole lot heavier. For everything larger than 6" dia to 6' dia, I've never found the necessity for anything thicker than 2". So, for your first job, you might consider the 2" thick option. We're now ready to start the work. 3. Lay out the V-blocks on 2" plate, cut them out with the torch, grind off the scale and slag. 4. Mill the faces parallel off the table. All the milling except the angles and tool relief of the center of the angles should be done with the parts laying flat on the machine table. 5. Mill the base. 6. Set up a semi-precision location guide-block 90 degrees to the cutter, locate the bottoms on this, and mill sides "A". This guide-block will be your master reference point. 7. Locate another stop that will let you clean up sides "B". 8. change the stop to clean up the top clamping surface. 9. Put the V-blocks in a vice or whatever, and cut out the tool clearance pocket in the center. You're now almost home. 10. Set the head and cutter angle and rough mill the angle for side "A". 11. Flip the parts and rough mill the angle for side "B". 12. Without changing anything but raising the part a few more thousandths into the cutter for the finish cut; finish mill the angles for side "B". Then flip the parts and do the final cut for the angles on side "A". While working I chamfer all the sharp edges and put a small radius on the edges of the chamfer with a medium emery. This helps in seating the part precisely. If you have been scrupulous in cleanliness and care, you should have two V-blocks the same in all dimensions to within a couple of 10ths. It works for me
If there's further interest, I'll submit more; Geo
