i recently bought Starrett 3202 12" dial calipers

[Bakafish]

Using good calipers for a scribe bugs me. If I'm watching a video and they scribe lines with them, I usually quit watching. But that's just my opinion.

I used to feel the same way, but found that it is really a practical usage pattern. On soft metals it poses zero harm, and on steel I use marking fluid and gentilly make sure I'm just cutting the ink and not scribing the metal itself. That said, as soon as I find a carbide tipped pair of Mitutoyo's for a good deal I will buy them.

 

[jccaclimber]

I used to feel the same way, but found that it is really a practical usage pattern. On soft metals it poses zero harm, and on steel I use marking fluid and gentilly make sure I'm just cutting the ink and not scribing the metal itself. That said, as soon as I find a carbide tipped pair of Mitutoyo's for a good deal I will buy them.

I’m in the same camp as you, though I’ve always wondered how likely the carbide jaw ones are to chip if used as scribes.
I have a dedicated set near my mill that I occasionally scribe with. Five years in and the tips are still perfect. On the other hand I’ve seen new ones get all bent up within a week of buying them by people scribing too hard.

 

[Bakafish]

I’m in the same camp as you, though I’ve always wondered how likely the carbide jaw ones are to chip if used as scribes.
I have a dedicated set near my mill that I occasionally scribe with. Five years in and the tips are still perfect. On the other hand I’ve seen new ones get all bent up within a week of buying them by people scribing too hard.

For me, the fear of using tools and damaging them is always a battle*, but the whole point of the carbide inserts are so one can have the peace of mind to scribe with them. I have to trust that Mitutoyo knows what they are doing and has identified the right materials and tested them (although I'm sure someone will insist they are as fragile as glass.) A good tool serves its purpose, and using it for that purpose is the only thing that really gives it its value; hiding replaceable items in a box instead of using them is just another aspect of wastefulness.

*Which for me has lead to countless duplicates of items 'just in case.' I don't need 2 Biax, but the thought of selling one of them after going through such difficulty to acquire it gives me chills.

 

[jccaclimber]

I wasn’t thinking damage with use, I was thinking damage with abuse. Part of it is working with a lot of non machinists, but every couple years my calipers take a ride to the floor. The mill set hasn’t dinged yet from this, so my concern is likely overblown. On the other hand, as an engineer and infrequent machinist, I’ve never worn out a pair of Mitutoyo calipers either. Given the 40% up charge and my use case, I’d rather keep saving funds in my search for Toto ceramic v blocks .

 

[just Dave]

Striving for perfection is a good place to start. You will do well. Your calipers sound normal. It would be wise to get a 6” for everyday wear and tear. You don’t need the most expensive brand for most things. Be carful of non tangible advice. The parts you make are your truth. How they measure up to the print is your reality and the your guide to your next move.
Good luck

 

[michiganbuck]

I am surprised that anyone uses a caliper for a scriber, such a scribe line would likey be .005 to .010 short of full size. I do have a caliper that I use for drafting/print-making measures.
I still have my old German Helios vernier calipers that I bought back in the
60s and they are still good, but the lines and numbers are still crisp like new but have become smaller.

I never had such V locks as these: but I do have a lab grade and utility grade Jo block set. My utility set is just an old lab grade set.

Starrett Five-Face Granite V-Blocks (Pair) 6"L x 6"W x 6"T - Grade A Inspection - 81532

Offering a huge selection of industrial tool sales online. Find over 100,000 metalworking products, precision measuring tools, power tools & accessories.

www.penntoolco.com

 

[Bakafish]

Update on the Carbide Calipers.

 

[AdamC]

I recently bought Starrett 3202 12" dial calipers

First question is if i run my finger over the jaws to remove an little particles will that cause them to rust?

Second question is...is it normal to have a very small light gap when the jaws are touching....the gap is less than a thousandth...i opened them 1 thousandth and it was bigger than the gap...so is it normal to have a very very small light gap or should i have them inspected?

its normal for Chinese products. Only Starrett 120s are made in the US. If you could return them I would. And welcome to rest of your life. Lesson #1: global trade.

With all due respect to your Dad, 12” are useful, but not as handy as 6” or even 8”.

I would surf eBay for second hand, made in USA machine tools. They are ridiculously cheap.

 

[EmGo]

its normal for Chinese products. Only Starrett 120s are made in the US. If you could return them I would. And welcome to rest of your life. Lesson #1: global trade.

Yeah well my Etalons did the same thing. I was young so asked the grumpy bastard nearby. He said, "So you see light, hunh ? Do you think these are meant for measuring light waves ?"

 

[AdamC]

There may be reasons why a tiny tiny gap is desirable. Wear or static defections of the jaws due to measuring force may be among them. But in these instances, the closed calipers should be sub zero (could be a line width).

I guess my point is, why take a chance with a precision tool that could serve you your entire life? With machine tools, especially any manual tool or tooling, prices for used are so low compared to their utility or quality, OR COMPETITION, it seems pointless to spend more money on second quality goods.

 

[EmGo]

I guess my point is, why take a chance with a precision tool that could serve you your entire life? With machine tools, especially any manual tool or tooling, prices for used are so low compared to their utility or quality, OR COMPETITION, it seems pointless to spend more money on second quality goods.

You gotta be kidding. We're talking CALIPERS, not gas chromatography equipment. Jesus.

And btw, NO, Etalon is not "second quality". Kick Starrett's butt left right and center any day of the week.

Sometimes I have to wonder about people ....

 

[plastikdreams]

its normal for Chinese products. Only Starrett 120s are made in the US. If you could return them I would. And welcome to rest of your life. Lesson #1: global trade.

With all due respect to your Dad, 12” are useful, but not as handy as 6” or even 8”.

I would surf eBay for second hand, made in USA machine tools. They are ridiculously cheap.

I have a set of 12" calipers...they are really handy when I need to measure over 8"...

 

[EmGo]

I have a set of 12" calipers...they are really handy when I need to measure over 8"...

Over 8" I went to verniers. If you didn't need good eyes they are lighter and handier, especially if you buy Etalon instead of that Starrett crap

 

[AdamC]

You gotta be kidding. We're talking CALIPERS, not gas chromatography equipment. Jesus.

And btw, NO, Etalon is not "second quality". Kick Starrett's butt left right and center any day of the week.

Sometimes I have to wonder about people ....

I guess I wasn’t clear.

I’m saying with certain items, tools like the OPs for example, the
low price of new imported Asian tools isn’t worth the risk compared to potentially worn second hand, top quality US made stuff. Tools are complicated. I wouldn’t say this as a blanket statement. Some tools wear over time and that wear really degrades utility. But dial calipers, I’d buy second hand. Take the chance on cheaper, older tools.

As to Etalons with gaps in the jaws, I’d suspect they do that on purpose. I suggested some possible explanations. Could be that the Chinese Starretts are similar for similar reasons? I don’t know for sure, but wouldn’t trust a Chinese manufacturer to get a feature like that right.

 

[EmGo]

I guess I wasn’t clear.

I’m saying with certain items, tools like the OPs for example, the
low price of new imported Asian tools isn’t worth the risk compared to potentially worn second hand, top quality US made stuff.

I needed some dial calipers for some reason, nothing special, went down to beijing lu to all those little stores and grabbed a set for I think 80 rmb, would be about $10, they were better than Central. Didn't have the feel of etalon or starrett I don't know about mitutoyo won't touch them but anyhow, they were fine. For no money at all, to speak of. This concern over "asian" is out of date. Maybe walmart can still scour the countryside for cheap shit but low cost, decent quality stuff is the rule now.

Times change .... I had all Snap-On wrenches and other tools, now Harbor Freight is just about as good for 1/10 the price. Perhaps won't hold up to abuse as well but fits the bolts as good, looks as good, feels as good, resists rust as good, without the name engraved in you couldn't tell the difference.

It's not 1980 no more. Or even 2010.

 

[AdamC]

I have a set of 12" calipers...they are really handy when I need to measure over 8"...

For sure. I just think the maximum utility of this tool is quick one handed usage. Of course 12” calipers are great for measuring long parts. How are they for an 11th grader checking if an end mill has a 5/8” or 3/4” shank? (Actual question, not rhetorical. I like 6” more than my 8”)

 

[EmGo]

How are they for an 11th grader checking if an end mill has a 5/8” or 3/4” shank? (Actual question, not rhetorical. I like 6” more than my 8”)

Depends on how big his hands are. Some of them 11th graders have paws like Godzilla these days !

btw, have had a fair amount of Starrett stuff. It's okay, better than average, but not that great. Maybe Lufkin is a little nicer, even. Honest. If you want to hold up something for admiration, better choose something really good.

 

[AdamC]

This concern over "asian" is out of date.

yeah obviously Japanese manufacturing isn’t plagued with the challenges of Chinese manufacturers.

Times change .... I had all Snap-On wrenches and other tools, now Harbor Freight is just about as good for 1/10 the price. Perhaps won't hold up to abuse as well but fits the bolts as good, looks as good, feels as good, resists rust as good, without the name engraved in you couldn't tell the difference.

Great example. It’s a popular sound bite, but not reality. So many YouTubers are testing HF products. Their sockets and wrenches are not “just about as good”. They are very often the worst of the bunch.

I think it’s true, however, that they may well be “good enough”. I also think, tho I have no evidence, cheap modern Taiwan tools (pretty sure most HF sockets and wrenches are Taiwan) are significantly better than my old (1990s) US made craftsman tools.

I’d offer the exact same advice on sockets as I’m suggesting for dial calipers. Working on cars is hard enough without struggling or risking failures associated with using the cheapest possible tools. I bought a lot of my snap on tools on eBay at roughly half retail. The difference in price between that and new decent quality Taiwan (like Matco or Gearwrench) wasn’t big enough for me to roll the dice.

I hope this helped someone.

 

[plastikdreams]

For sure. I just think the maximum utility of this tool is quick one handed usage. Of course 12” calipers are great for measuring long parts. How are they for an 11th grader checking if an end mill has a 5/8” or 3/4” shank? (Actual question, not rhetorical. I like 6” more than my 8”)

My every day carry is a 6" mit digital, I have used the 12" for small stuff but only because it's what was available lol.