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Is a Brother the right choice?

Thanks for all the continued discussion guys, appreciate the input on the 4th Axis options. Prices were... HIGH. While I may have lost some leverage now that I purchased the machine, hopefully the guys will work with me now that I am a hooked customer. Everything I was quoted was at list price... and those options really add up.

The guys at Yamazen have been great so far and are working to meet my.... ah, shall we say, aggressive timing. They received the down payment and PO on the 27th, today the order was received in Chicago. I challenged them to have the machine delivered to the rigger in time for install in my shop October 9th. Which happens to be my birthday.

Likewise Yamazen Tooling division is scrambling to get some goodies to me by the 9th so I have tooling to do test cuts on the machine at install.

Will be putting in an order with Mari, just to make sure I have some holders in hand.

Thanks a ton for all the discussion and input guys. There are a lot of things I would love to do differently, but the money has to come from somewhere, and until the money printer is set up...

For the sake of discussion, I wasn't PLANNING to buy a machine until next year. So I did not have a healthy reserve of cash built up like I had intended. My Yamazen sales rep dropped a bomb in my lap Wednesday morning, so I had LITTLE time to react.

The boss of my sales guy told me over the phone while they were all at imts that after payment they'd have it on the truck in 2 days. I paid a week ago down, and this week I'm out of town, but next week doesn't seem like it will happen so is the 15th or after for me. Schedules certainly can change fast, I hope you get yours installed!

I'll just be happy if things go OK and I get mine into my garage, at the moment I'm not confident. I bought a lathe, but had no concerns on height like I will with the VMC.
 
When I worked field service for machinery companies, we were told to not tell the customer anything beyond the manufacturer's published requirements for power, location, air, etc. Corporately they did not want to expose themselves to the liability of advising a customer that their RPC would run the machine fine and then face it possibly not working or that trying to run higher or lower voltage than the manufacturer stated would be OK. The company position was "show these power requirements to your electrician so he knows what he needs to do for you". We were responsible to verify correct power (voltage and phase rotation) during the install.

Freight charges were sometimes negotiated into the deal instead of a discount. Would have been very much out of the ordinary though. Buyer always handled rigging, either DIY if capable, or contracted to a rigging firm. I don't recall ever seeing rigging negotiated into a deal.

Helping the buyer with further disassembly of a machine to be installed was a common thing for us to do. If schedule allowed it, we tried to be on hand during the uncrating/rigging to keep an eye on things and make sure someone was not about to do something wrong.

Thanks for the feedback, that is probably the case. Yamazen tech still said 230+-10% is fine, with the caveot that he's never installed or heard of one on an RPC so didn't know.

I know that would be the blame as soon as there's over voltage alarms and I'd be the first and only person this has ever happened to. So might as well take care of it up front!
 
The Japanese machine tool internal voltage of operation for standard CNC machine tools is 200 volts --- the servo and spindle drives are designed to operate at that voltage.

Yes, there is an acceptable tolerance, but 230 volts is near the TOP of the tolerance....240/250 is really pushing your luck!

Feed the machine what it wants...unless you are on 208Y utility power, you need a transformer to drop the 230/240 to 200, going into the machine.

The drives and power supplies will thank you later.
 
The Japanese machine tool internal voltage of operation for standard CNC machine tools is 200 volts --- the servo and spindle drives are designed to operate at that voltage.

Yes, there is an acceptable tolerance, but 230 volts is near the TOP of the tolerance....240/250 is really pushing your luck!

Feed the machine what it wants...unless you are on 208Y utility power, you need a transformer to drop the 230/240 to 200, going into the machine.

The drives and power supplies will thank you later.

I agree, give the machine what is designed for...are you sure that's 200v? Many are stepping down to 220, and spec sheets say 230v. Yamazen says 230....But Brother website says 200v.

Conflicting info makers it harder to decoder what's right, at least for me.
 
I agree, give the machine what is designed for...are you sure that's 200v? Many are stepping down to 220, and spec sheets say 230v. Yamazen says 230....But Brother website says 200v.

Conflicting info makers it harder to decoder what's right, at least for me.

you will have no issues between 200 and 230. I have seen machines run at 195 and 240. Out here 208 is the most common.
 
200V is the design voltage for the vast majority of Japanese servo and spindle drives. 208V-230V is within the allowable range for almost all of them. I have seen many Fanuc drives work fine at 245V, but that is very borderline.
 
IME, my Speedio was OK with 240V, but 245-247V caused the machine to fault. I tried running it straight off of the PP at first, and it ran OK, most of the time, but when the line voltage drifted high (PP only passes through the line voltage), the Speedio would fault. I installed a buck transformer to drop the PP output to 208V.

So, it is possible to run it off of North America line voltage, but only if your line voltage doesn't drift much above nominal 240V.

Regards.

Mike
 
you will have no issues between 200 and 230. I have seen machines run at 195 and 240. Out here 208 is the most common.

Thanks, the confusing thing is just the 200v +-10% vs 230v +-10% specifications that are pubished. If I do my calculations that gives me a valid range of 180-253v. Certainly most people report 240 is the complete top end.

A spec of 210 +-10% is basically what you are suggesting, and what I'm guessing looks better. Although somewhat a complaint, my main reason for bringing up was just to try and find out what I should ideally get the voltage down to. 220, 208, 200? Or, what's the "best".
 
Japanese machines don't like anything above 235 volts. 240 max. After moving our new shop location had 238 and we had to rush and get transformers to step everything down to 225-220. Machines kept on alarming out.
 
The boss of my sales guy told me over the phone while they were all at imts that after payment they'd have it on the truck in 2 days. I paid a week ago down, and this week I'm out of town, but next week doesn't seem like it will happen so is the 15th or after for me. Schedules certainly can change fast, I hope you get yours installed!

I'll just be happy if things go OK and I get mine into my garage, at the moment I'm not confident. I bought a lathe, but had no concerns on height like I will with the VMC.

First, I must apologize for whoever led you to believe that the machine could ship in 2 days. That is the rarest of rarest events in our company and not recommended. It certainly was not going to happen the week before IMTS. We have a full approval process that usually takes about a week. Anything quicker would assume an established existing company or 100% prepayment. My customers would tell you that the prepayment is not uncommon for a start up or small shop. We are a publicly traded company and have stringent rules for credit before final acceptance of the order and releasing for shipment.

Secondly, the power is your responsibility and Vancbiker is exactly right that our people can not advise you on how to get the correct power to the machine. Most of the garage users of Speedios are my customers. At least half have added buck transformers. Residential power can float a great deal more than commercial power. My advise is buy a buck transformer if your power is drifting close to 230. If you were in 190 range, my advise would be the same except the buck transformer would be an up transformer.

As far as freight and rigging. My understanding is that you were supplied with quotes or even offered a package including freight and rigging. The special IMTS pricing had zero room for any additional costs to be added to the deal. Not one dime. We are just fine with you arranging your own freight. I almost always add freight into my deals as part of the calculations of cost. However, I can't remember the last time, I took responsibility for rigging. It is too much of a variable. What is access to your garage space, how steep, is your door frame actually above 82 inches tall. All of those are variables I can't really foresee. Also, the machine must be picked up by an insured trucker with an air ride trailer and the crate must be tarped.

I just spoke with Matt. We will have someone there when your rigger slides the machine in. Most likely, the wire track will have to be undone to allow it to slide in. Remember, you are paying for the rigger to uncrate, and place the machine so please make sure they understand the scope of the job.

Please let me know if you need any further assistance.

Andy Dukes
 








 
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