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Japanese finds

I have no issue buying Japanese products, especially those related to general engineering and machine work, including a facsimile of that square level.
It is disappointing to see buyers here equate Japan with "import", which is never equivalent grade. Singly, a portion are good, but takes very careful examination. Won't measure up in comparison.
Related earlier exposure in depth to Japanese tools and the people themselves working in Reno. Absolute top 5 of my most unforgettable work experiences.
 
Someone out there knows what stone that is, and someone else knows that person and will someday read this. They say the best way to solve a quandary on the internet is not to ask the question, but to give the wrong answer. I'm sure someone will correct my ignorance. :LOL:
This strikes me at most dives into the 'net; more so when a naysayer pipes up "Good job responding to an old thread, bucko".
Confident an honest query outweigh weak insults.
 
So not a lot of love for the Gepy stuff, a little too niche I guess. 🤓 So today I'll show something a bit more mundane, the humble and ubiquitous Optical Flat.

Flat1.jpeg

This example is is an ~80mm LapMaster single sided 1/8th wavelength unit I picked up for ~$20. In the picture above you can actually just make out some colorful fringes in normal light, but ideally you want to use a monochromatic light source. Forgive me for nerdsplaining if you already know all this, but the fringes are created by the light constructively and destructively interacting as it is reflected back on itself. Kind of like how noise canceling headphones work, a waveform of the same frequency, but opposite phase cancels out the sound. When the tiny air gap between the glass and the reflective surface is a multiple of the frequency of the light itself it either amplifies or dampens the light, creating the fringes seen. Knowing the frequency of light (He is mostly 587.6nm) you can actually calculate the distance between two bands, this amount is usually quite small, and if the flat is properly seated you can count the bands across the object and calculate the overall flatness.

Why would anyone want to do that, and what does this piece of glass have to do with anything? Well the glass of an optical flat has been ground to an extreme amount of flatness and using the light and these fringe patterns, one can determine the flatness and contours of a secondary reflective surface with extreme accuracy.

As mentioned above, to get the best results requires using a monochromatic light source, typically low pressure sodium or helium, powered by a ballasted high voltage supply. Other than low pressure Sodium, these light sources are not really monochromatic, they actually have several frequencies of light they emit due to the different electron band gaps, but an overwhelming amount of output is usually at one frequency making it essentially monochromatic for our purposes. Secondary filters can be used in professional settings to get even cleaner results. Partially due to advancements in solid state lighting, and the limited use of such things, these lights have become a lot harder to find than the optical flats themselves, and I've been searching for some time.

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Today's the day! I finally got a hit for an Electro Technic Products experimental light source here in Japan with a helium tube for a reasonable price. There are some people using laser diodes and ping pong balls as a diffuser, but I have enough projects and just wanted to have something that worked.

Our test subject today is a Mitutoyo base plate that is included in their square gauge block accessory set, these square gauge blocks are not as common (especially over here) so I've been able to build up quite a collection as they are not as desirable, but they can be really useful as they can be fastened together thanks to having a hole through their center (also super useful for calibrating depth gauges!) This unit was shiny and a similar size to the flat, so a good first light candidate.

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What you want to see is nice straight lines, from edge to edge, and honestly the fewer bands the closer the fit between the optical flat and the surface to be measured. I didn't attempt to optimize the fringe count, and I didn't make a lot of effort to get a good photo either. The light needs a diffuser and to be better positioned for photography as the picture induced some curvature to the lines that actually isn't there, as with many things this looks better in real life.

So other than verifying that your Mitutoyo accessories are properly made (a waste of time, of course they are!) what's the use for this? Well, hand lapping has come into vogue again in the YouTube community, and along with scraping for flatness the idea of lapping in some of my harder surfaced items is really appealing. This equipment allows one to do so and be assured that you have achieved the desired results. It's also just kind of neat.
 
Like many of you, I'm very much a completionist. When I get something, I want to get all the optional attachments, often with no clear need identified. As a big fan of Nakanishi stuff I picked up the smaller Emax Evolution and have been collecting all the various tool heads for it when I see them come up cheaply. But that's for another time. A while back I picked up an old NEWS BS-1 dividing head, it being a licenced clone of the ubiquitous Brown and Sharpe units. It came with all the plates and was in good shape and the right price, but didn't include the chuck or the tail stock. An appropriate 6" NEWS chuck was easily obtained for $20, and I've seen a number of the tail stocks in fair condition listed, but as the same unit is still being manufactured in Taiwan and China I've been a little bit picky about the condition of a used unit and have been waiting for the 'right one' to show up. (It's not like I'm actually using any of this stuff yet... :cautious:)

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Well, today's the day. $80 delivered, it came (double packed) with the original oiled box and still coated in many spots with the original cosmoline. Seems to have been used once, then put back in the box. After giving it a good scrub, she's ready to go.

For some bonus content, I picked up this pair of "Junk" Haimer's (one branded in local Big Daishawa livery) for $300. Nothing significantly wrong with them, a few new set screws, plastic polish for one of the lenses and a simple recalibration couldn't solve.

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I have a couple of the shorter probes for these, but they are packed safe in their boxes. I can already picture clutching the pink shards of ceramic in my hands with tears in my eyes.
 
Nice. I've got a NEWS/Yuasa BS-2. I like mine very much. Mine came with everything but the gears for compound indexing, in great shape.
Oh, very cool! Whenever I see NEWS items come up, I'm always tempted. The BS-1 is already too big for my current machines, if it hadn't been an impulse buy because it was cheap I would have maybe tried for a BS-0, but I envy that helical cut ability and fine feed the big ones like yours has. I'm sure I'd never use it, but I love capabilities, even if they are never tapped. 🤓
 
One of my original purchases that kicked off my metrology 'collection' was a Mitutoyo granite block square. I bought it assuming the price of ~$50 was good (I think it was) and at the time I had no reference surface, so I thought it could be used as a little surface plate (kind of awkward for that, but the infected do what we have to to convince ourselves of utility...)

I just love the look and feel of granite, and the fact it doesn't rust makes it a less stressful material for me as most of my stuff just gets packed away. Last weekend, a largish (450x250) Mitutoyo square was listed at auction for about $250, but I was going to be away skiing in Hokkaido (★★★★☆) so I wouldn't be able to camp it. I threw an auto-bid on it and was happy to find I was the only bidder, but being remote I wasn't able to encourage the seller to package it carefully. When it arrived I was disappointed to find that one of the (non-critical) corners of the otherwise pristine square had been chipped 😔 and I recovered a few fragments from the box.

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This sort of thing hits me harder than it should, and after sending a restrained complaint to the shipper, I immediately started thinking about how to repair the damage. As this was a non-critical surface, and on the back side as well, I didn't want to go overboard. I collected a bit of baking soda out of the refrigerator and overnight ordered some Loctite 380 (Black Max over in the US.) By doing a layer a day, and embedding the chips I recovered, I was able to stabilize and build up the area enough that I could then use the Nakanishi with a right angle head and a set of sanding discs to reshape the corner close enough to the original that it wouldn't haunt me. Shortly after finishing the repair, the vendor credited me %20 bringing the cost down to under $200, so I think it worked out okay.

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This bigger square had a hand made sheet that mapped it's accuracy included in the box, it wasn't the original calibration or something from a lab, it was clearly from the original owner who was compensating for any errors, but if I choose to trust it, it showed it was under 2 microns out across the length. The two reference surfaces on it seem pristine with the subtle silky frost that differentiates them from the highly polished surfaces of the rest of the instrument.

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Long lost siblings reunited.
 
Optical flats are cool. Years ago I ended up with an old 1940's Van Keuren catalog that in addition to having their metrology tools listed had some good documentation on the how and why of optical flats. We have a a couple flats but no calibration documentation for parallelism. Building a nice wood monochromatic light cabinet is still on my to-do list.

Yuasa News stuff isn't uncommon over here, but I don't think I've ever seen a piece from the "News" generation that was in that good of shape! We have a couple of News lever action 5C collet indexers that are 90% stripped of paint and the tags are beaten pretty bad. One needs parts but they're still affordably available from OEM.
 
I made a 3D model of the Haimer and created a custom insert for the cheap and ubiquitous Japanese steel tool boxes over here to store the two units and a spare probe safely.

Haimer_Render2.jpegHaimer_Case.jpeg
They are isolated from the 3D printed liner with neoprene inserts that fit into pockets I designed into the tray.
 
This JAM AP100 precision angle block was sold as "Junk"

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It came in the original wood box and as you can see it was pristine. I have another, more battleworn example of this angle plate, they have tapped holes on all faces so they are really handy for fixturing. They are also ground to within a few microns on all faces, the factory evaluation was lost at some point, but JAM stuff is always top notch.
 
I guess it isn't surprising that people afflicted with the illness I suffer from 'collect' stuff they are quite likely never going to use. Just yesterday I finally used the Kato power tapping arbor that I spent months collecting every optional chuck for (it worked really good, so there's that...) But I have more wire EDM and precision grinding accessories than anyone who is unlikely to ever get his hands on either of them should really have. Do I regret it? HELL no! I've got the bug, ain't nothin gonna change me.

Anyway, another day, another JAM session. This DF30 is fairly common on the auction boards, as I think it is niche even for grinder people. It's a dual face wheel dresser, and was a lot larger than I expected. They make a little parallel dresser (AD30) that is tiny, smooth and is actually something I could potentially use, but this thing is about ten times bigger, so I was surprised when I opened it up.

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Some notable things other than the mass. It's actually made up of a lot more pieces than I would have expected (or it appears) as the counter rotating threads complicate the assembly quite a bit. You can't just drop the moving jaws in there and thread in the screw, so the main body is actually 5 pieces of hardened steel. Once it is assembled they grind it into their 3 micron tolerance, which due to the wonderful fit makes all the seams invisible. I have to admit to you that when I first got it I was wondering what the hell all the cap head screws were for :LOL: They use three sections of bellows to protect the screw from grinding dust, and there are small drain slots in case coolant gets in there, but it was a bear to clean. Normally I take this shit apart, as it makes cleaning easier, and you learn things that way, but the chance of me ever getting those seams realigned was zero, and I'm not going to ruin a tool no matter how curious I am. So it was a tedious 4 hours to clean and get all the grit out of her.

It came in the original box with a pair of flat polycrystalline diamond dressing rods. I paid under $100, they usually go for closer to $500 on the auction sites, and can still be had at ~$2000 new. I guess if you need to grind precision slots, dressing both faces simultaneously helps deal with any potential deflection that a single sided dresser might induce? I'd love to know from you grinder guys more about the problem they're trying to solve with this thing. Next time we'll look at some EDM stuff.
 
So between an EDM and a Surface Grinder, I'm not sure which I'm less likely to own, but that hasn't stopped me from collecting various bits and bobs related to them. This thread is my attempt to show off unusual stuff that maybe isn't seen very often either due to different practices over here, or just rarity. This post is one some of the EDM related items I have. I actually picked up two different EDM drill spindles, one made by System 3R which you may know as a Swedish manufacturer, the other one (below) made domestically but I've never been able to identify who made it (other than some very high quality local parts.)

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One of the first things I picked up was a Fanuc wire EDM squaring block. I bought it because it looked like a nice little block of granite (which is irresistible to me) and I figured I could hack it to be more general purposefully useful, something I still intend to do. The fact the seller didn't know what it was and was selling it for nothing helped. I'm sure someone out there has an old Fanuc and really needs one of these, sorry man...

Fanuc EDM Square.jpeg

The next item was also sold for nothing ($5) not because the seller didn't know what it was, but because they didn't know what it was made out of. Sodick is one of the EDM pioneers, and this little magnetic block is used by the wire EDM to zero its XY offsets. The laser etched markings show the center of the hole's offset from the two magnetized faces, the little cut out allows the wire to enter and exit the jig. Wire EDM's are not energized when zeroing, but still detect the wire shorting to the block when contacting, so it can quickly touch off on the four cardinals of the hole and calculate the coordinates (something I can just as easily do with a standard probe on my future CNC.) It is made of stainless steel, so when it was sold as badly corroded and the photos showed it still factory sealed in discolored plastic wrap, I took the correct gamble that the packing preservative had spoiled and the unit was fine.

Sodick Jig.jpeg

And from System 3R, a 20mm test bar, intended to be used with their fixturing system, but just generally useful for calibrating and testing any number of systems. Unlike many items of this vintage it was flawless and still has its sub-micron runout and parallelism factory calibration papers.

sytem3R bar.jpeg
 
Okay, this post is just because I'm a bit shocked. A few months ago I saw a nifty pair of what I recognized as magnetic hold down clamps. They are designed with a bit of spring steel flexure that lifts up the jaw side a small amount and when the magnetic field pulls them down, the arc of travel applies a clamping force. They are primarily used to clamp and support non-magnetic items on a magnetic chuck. I first saw something similar used to hold down bench stones for diamond grinding to make them precision flats. As I use my mag chuck for general purpose clamping, it adds a lot of mass to small items and is itself easily fixtured to my MFT table, I thought they could come in handy.

Spring Supports.jpeg

They were unmarked but looked well made, I wasn't quite sure if they were factory built or just someone doing some good work, but I was totally happy with the $5pr. price. While searching for something unrelated (I've been on a bit of a Kanetec spree) I discovered they are actually Kanetec YS-10A supports that sell for an eye popping ~$500 a set!! Sometimes I'm astonished at the retail cost of tooling like this, the thin slots the tempered flexure is captured in and all the little finger cuts certainly couldn't have been cheap to do, but still...
 
I like Kanetec stuff. I have a bunch of their mag bases and my surface grinder mag chuck is Kanetec too. Good stuff.
Agreed, I'm happy with everything I have so far. I just picked up a smorgasbord of uncommon items from them, so I'll post them after they are cleaned up. The only good thing about dirt and rust is that it lowers the price :LOL:
 
So I suspect serendipity has more to do with just paying attention, but as often happens with me, I decide I need a thing, do some research, learn about other things tangentially related to that thing, then those things find their way to my pile of things.

makita bandsaw vise.jpeg

This search started because I was frustrated that the built in vise on the bandsaw I have is about 3 miles (~60mm) from the blade and creates difficulties when I'm trying to cut small parts with it. The cast Iron Makita bed is very well made, but has no coplanar surfaces to clamp to. After having a ton of trouble cutting some very short stock where my large magnetic chuck rescued me, I wasn't crazy about it being in the line of fire of the bandsaw blade, so I was looking for something a little better suited.

I decided what I needed was a magnetic v-block that would be compact enough to fit in the tight quarters of the cutoff area and do a good job of holding small round or flat stock to be cut. This led me to looking at magnetic V-blocks (or drilling and tapping holes in the base so I could clamp some standard ones.) Magnetic V-blocks come in a number of configurations, what I soon realized is I needed one that would simultaneously attract on the top V as well as the bottom so it would self clamp to the cast iron bandsaw base. It didn't initially occur to me, but most of the blocks out there do not actually do this. I think the intention is to have them held by the main chuck or some other fixturing.

Obviously, the more faces of a magnetic block expressing the flux, the less net power per face, and you may want to have some flexibility in how it is fixtured, so it makes sense to limit this. But I identified a good candidate, the Kanetec KVS-1B and I started looking and found one at a decent price, as with most Japanese tooling the retail pricing is astonishing and costs more than the bandsaw itself.

mag v blocks.jpeg

Switchable magnetic blocks come in all shapes and sizes, but looking at the pictures, even with the dimensions supplied, I wasn't really prepared for how hefty and large this unit actually is, and it's the smaller version. It is clever in that it has different sizes of V on either side, so you have a lot of flexibility. It seems astonishingly powerful, and should do a good job holding little stock, well have to see.

In my search I had also identified what I thought was a much larger unit, a Kanetec KY(B)-10A which is mounted in a 100㎣ 'Mass Block', a cast iron cube form that is very popular over here. It was cheap and I figured it would make another good scraping project so I ordered it as well, but I was surprised that they are almost the same size!

I had basically been deep diving the Kanetec catalogue ogling all the cool things they made, discovering to my surprise the little hold down clamps in my previous post were actually super expensive. As a poor child I spent a lot of time looking at literature of stuff I could never own, and now that I can afford things, especially when I see a deal, well...

Long story short long, one of my sources posted a bunch of items. I have in my head a mental image of an extremely old guy who buys machine salvage very cheaply. He has a system where he assigns basic ID numbers to the items, he doesn't typically post any model numbers or often even the manufacturers name, so you have to really know what something is. You just get a blurry photo of a dirty item on the same stained cement floor and some very basic two or three word description. He is leaving so much money on the table, but I think he's getting the stuff so cheap that it just isn't worth his time. Twice before due to this number 'system' he ended up sending me a completely different item that shared the same number. When he got it wrong, he always promptly sent me the correct item, and I got to keep the wrong ones, not worth a lot, but not nothing, so if anything I always feel a little sorry for him and try to buy his stuff despite the risks.

And as I said, he doesn't clean anything whatsoever, and just throws things loosely in a box with zero internal packing of any kind. Thank god for the tender care of the local shipping companies.

Two of his items looked particularly juicy to me, he had a big Kanetec magnetic chuck that he didn't realize was pictured upside down and a JAM vise mislabeled as 'JMA' so it was not picked up by my saved searches. I asked him for pictures of the top side of the chuck fearing that it was badly damaged and that's why only the bottom was shown, but on seeing the updated photo I bought it immediately.

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The reason for his confusion was that it is a Kanetec RMWH-2F double face chuck, with independent magnets on the top and bottom. I think because of the grime and poor vision he could only make out the large loops on the bottom of the unit, and assumed that was the top (despite the label being upside down), but it cleaned up nicely and had all the original hardware. Perched on top of it is YAJV (yet another JAM vise) a CSV100 compound sine vise that I have yet to disassemble and deep clean, but is in quite good shape. This vise has two built in sine plates and retails for the ungodly sum of over $5000, but he was listing for $150.

The spacious 150x300mm chuck is designed to throw on a table and self fixture with the independently controlled bottom magnet. I'm uncertain how useful that really will be, but two times the magnets in one unit can't be bad, right? :LOL: The top uses their micro-pitch pole design, which is optimized for thinner and smaller items, and it still has the factory surfaces on both sides, so if I ever get a grinder there is still a lot of life and precision left in this thing. ~$3000 new, I got it for $200, about the same price I paid for the smaller Kanetec RMT-1325 I've been using as a general purpose third hand and for my scraping experiments.

Kanetec_1325.jpeg

Okay, the last item in our Kanetec deep dive is kind of an oddball as it is non-magnetic. I came across a new indicator stand from them, that I hoped would be useful for transferring squareness for my scraping projects. The ideal stands for this have a curved front face that you butt against the square (and test object) and that allows you to swivel it to quickly establish the minimum distance to the object so you can compare that value to the measured item.

Kanetec Stand.jpeg

So my hope was that this round granite stand might come in handy for that. It's extremely well made, but only the bottom surface is precision polished, the outer edge is nicely finished, but I'm not sure if it will be effective for what I hoped to use it for. I actually have a squareness transfer tool make by the esoteric Nishimura Jig, but it relies on a 20mm ceramic rod as its contact surface which is a different approach I'm not completely sold on.

Nishimura Jig Square.jpeg
So that's the Kanetec update I promised.
 
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A few questions and comments:
1. Is there a country of manufacture listed on your granite square? I bought one new from Mitutuoyo a few years back and was surprised to find Germany as the country of origin rather than Japan.
2. You're just showing us the System 3R test bar as an excuse to show off the ceramic v-blocks aren't you?
3. The ceramic bar on the surface gage is quite interesting. What is the contact point at the rear? If it is a circle, what is the diameter? The more I think about it the more I think that 3 circular pads of at least the diameter of a repeat-o-meter are most in compliance with both stability and how surface plates are measured in the US. That said, using a long cylinder solves many of the same problems as having too small a pad (falling into local small spots), but also seems reasonably resistant to getting stuck on a piece of grit.
 
A few questions and comments:
1. Is there a country of manufacture listed on your granite square? I bought one new from Mitutuoyo a few years back and was surprised to find Germany as the country of origin rather than Japan.
No place of manufacture on either granite block, but I doubt very much either were made here in Japan. I think we just don't have the ideal granite for it here. Mitutoyo has factories around the world, and granite is one of those things where processing it close to the source makes sense. They've been known to OEM stuff as well, although I totally trust their QC and wouldn't mind finding out it was made by another company.

2. You're just showing us the System 3R test bar as an excuse to show off the ceramic v-blocks aren't you?
Correct. Aren't they lovely?

3. The ceramic bar on the surface gage is quite interesting. What is the contact point at the rear? If it is a circle, what is the diameter? The more I think about it the more I think that 3 circular pads of at least the diameter of a repeat-o-meter are most in compliance with both stability and how surface plates are measured in the US. That said, using a long cylinder solves many of the same problems as having too small a pad (falling into local small spots), but also seems reasonably resistant to getting stuck on a piece of grit.
It is made from two precision ground ceramic cylinders of the same 20mm diameter, the front is 100mm wide and the rear is 38mm wide. These are set into the base in right angle pockets, similar to how a sign bars are typically made. The nitrided riser is offset on the base and has a slot to keep the vertically adjustable slide properly oriented. The slide holds and centers the micrometer to land on the centerline of the instrument. So the concept is that the cylinder makes contact in a line across the front, but that feels like a lot of contact area compared to a ball or small rounded semicircular face. I haven't actually measured if it is accurate enough to translate the squareness without rezeroing it each time, but the amount of slop in the keyway leads me to believe it is only useful for transferring from a set position, which is fine.

It's quite old and well used, I bought it mostly because it was from a company I like and I've been using it as a display stand for my giant Mitutoyo branded East German made micrometer. Until recently I didn't have a big reference to use it with anyway, although I really need a cylinder square in my collection. Their current design uses a linear rail and can sweep across the whole range (but still uses a wide contact surface with the item to be measured), it also uses three ceramic disk feet as you propose. However, the simplicity of dialing in the maxima by rotating across a curved front seems better, but I don't have enough experience to really know. I'll post better pictures and do a deep dive on it when I start using it. I have some practice scraping items that I want to step scrape into squareness, and I will use it to measure how far out the items are.
 
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One of the local brands I really respect but just never found a good entry point with is Kitagawa Iron Works, primarily known for their lathe chucks. Despite not having a need for it, this JN07T reversible three jaw just kept getting lower and lower priced to the point where I had to pick it up just in case it would be useful.

JN07T.jpeg

I gave it a full disassembly and cleaning, there was virtually zero wear internally, the outside has some staining and some tappy-tap-tap marks on the steel body, but nothing a tiny swipe with a stone wouldn't handle. The only apprentice marks were on one of the jaw screws, and the faintest circular mark above the logo, leading me to believe this was used in some sort of milling fixture and never spent time on a lathe. I really hope I have a chance to get a real lathe that I can use this on some day.
 








 
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