Lathe turret clearance

[DDoug]

Finally fingered out the spelling....:
HEYLIGENSTAEDT

looks like they use (2) separate turrets up top, one near the chuck for turning/facing
and a separate turret for drill and live tools.

 

[cnctoolcat]

SD,

This isn’t the best picture, but gives you and idea of the unique Mazak VDI system, and how each tool station is well separated.

This is a pic of an older SQT15, an 8” chuck machine.

ToolCat

 

[BROTHERFRANK]

Yamazen in Hartford distributes and supports Takisawa Japan. The TCN-2100 machines are 8" chuck with 2" bar capacity and 12 station turret with good clearance. We had a big run on these in the last year so you will need to check availability with your local team.

 

[mmurray70]

I've downloaded the generic QT brochure.
Conveniently they spend 4 pages showing machine outside dimensions, but not one lousy word about turret options.
Not one!!!

Maybe they dont make big deal out of it because they know clearance is no issue. I agree with CNCToolcat, that style turret has lots of clearance. This was never an issue on the QT-200 MSY I used to run sometimes. A neighboring boring bar would not hit chuck, just had to watch the sheet metal behind the chuck.

If its a mazak with 8" chuck and that style turret I dont think you will do any better for clearance anywhere. The OD tools go pretty close to sheet metal though. I think they guys had a parting tool hit one time. This dimension might actually be better on doosan. Im just guessing, but if thats a big deal might want to double check.

 

[Ianagos]

Maybe they dont make big deal out of it because they know clearance is no issue. I agree with CNCToolcat, that style turret has lots of clearance. This was never an issue on the QT-200 MSY I used to run sometimes. A neighboring boring bar would not hit chuck, just had to watch the sheet metal behind the chuck.

If its a mazak with 8" chuck and that style turret I dont think you will do any better for clearance anywhere. The OD tools go pretty close to sheet metal though. I think they guys had a parting tool hit one time. This dimension might actually be better on doosan. Im just guessing, but if thats a big deal might want to double check.

Yes the od tools swing close to the sheetmetal once had a larger tool snack the sheetmetal on the front on the machine because I rotated the turret the wrong way… there was very little clearance there. That was on an older machine with that turret though sqt18ms

 

[SeymourDumore]

Yamazen in Hartford distributes and supports Takisawa Japan. The TCN-2100 machines are 8" chuck with 2" bar capacity and 12 station turret with good clearance. We had a big run on these in the last year so you will need to check availability with your local team.

View attachment 346730

View attachment 346731

Yupp Frank!
At 420mm face-to-face it is 10mm over what the minimum clearance requires!

Too bad that interference diagram is nowhere to be found on the website!
But... what information IS available, shows that it is an 8" machine with only 2" through capacity ....

 

[DDoug]

Yes, look like plenty of room:
Used Takamaz Takamaz Xw-130 CNC Twin Spindle Turning Centers | HGR...

And:
Used Muratec Muratec Mw-180 Twin Spindle CNC Horizontal Lathe | HGR...

 

[Ox]

Cinci:

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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[barbter]

Ox
What's with the "lower turret" if that's what it is?
5 station?
OD tools only?

 

[Ox]

Yeah, the twin upper turrets were pretty common on lathes in the bigger sizes as you go.
Ones that I have seen index together as well. (both turrets index with the same code - a mechanical link between)
IDK if they all did that?


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

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[DDoug]

Cinci:

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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Yup, I recall seeing on of those to, similar "cone" turret as the G&L I posted, and then Cincinnati added the "normal" turret too in your pix.

Too bad you can't turn, face, and bore at the same time like a turret lathe.

 

[SeymourDumore]

OK, so I still did not make up my mind, but....

It would appear that somewhere along the way Haas has changed their standard BOT turret.
Downloaded the solid model of the ST-20, and after disassembling it I found that the turret size is more than adequate for an 8" chuck!!!



So now I'm back to the other issue: The Haas tailstock stops 12" short of the spindle face!
I dunno... am I the only one who does ring work where the part is free-state located on a bung and is secured by pushing a face plate by the tailstock?
I need the live center tip to reach the surface of a standard chuckjaw!

 

[mmurray70]

OK, so I still did not make up my mind, but....

It would appear that somewhere along the way Haas has changed their standard BOT turret.
Downloaded the solid model of the ST-20, and after disassembling it I found that the turret size is more than adequate for an 8" chuck!!!

View attachment 347104

So now I'm back to the other issue: The Haas tailstock stops 12" short of the spindle face!
I dunno... am I the only one who does ring work where the part is free-state located on a bung and is secured by pushing a face plate by the tailstock?
I need the live center tip to reach the surface of a standard chuckjaw!

Too bad the rest of the machine is a pos. Cant believe they are still using flat bed. Some of their lathes are gear driven too and noisy as hell. Mark me down for no.

 

[barbter]

Yup, I recall seeing on of those to, similar "cone" turret as the G&L I posted, and then Cincinnati added the "normal" turret too in your pix.

Too bad you can't turn, face, and bore at the same time like a turret lathe.

Distance from (lower turret) tool tip to main turret tool tip is a long way.
I wonder how many people punched a hole in the metalwaork behind the chuck while turning with the lower turret....!
Interesting concept tho

 

[gregormarwick]

Seymour, can I ask why the reluctance to go up a size on the machine and spec with 8" chuck?

Footprint, spindle speed... - are there obstacles beyond the obvious financial aspect?

 

[Ox]

Distance from (lower turret) tool tip to main turret tool tip is a long way.
I wonder how many people punched a hole in the metalwaork behind the chuck while turning with the lower turret....!
Interesting concept tho

I believe that most of those type machines have an extended pocket above for the long tools.


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[DDoug]

I believe that most of those type machines have an extended pocket above for the long tools.


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

I've seen them with "not much" sheetmetal up there, more like just the sliding door for the operator.
Warner & Swasey Engine Lathe 400 RPM SC32 Slant Bed
This one has the sheet metal all enclosed. a bit higher up:
J&L Slant Bed Lathes Project - Peiffer Machine Services

 

[Vancbiker]

I believe that most of those type machines have an extended pocket above for the long tools.


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

A feature too frequently overlooked by some builders.

 

[SeymourDumore]

Seymour, can I ask why the reluctance to go up a size on the machine and spec with 8" chuck?

Footprint, spindle speed... - are there obstacles beyond the obvious financial aspect?

Gregor, 2 reasons.
First, typically the 8" and 10" machines are only different in spindle bore size. The turrets are either the same on both, or the 10" version offers a 10 station turret.
Second, there is no way to downsize a chuck, only up. IOW you cannot get a typical 10" machine with an A2-8 spindle taper and put an 8" chuck on it.
There is no such adapter in existence as the interface differences are too large.

 

[Ox]

Well, you could very easily roll your own adaptor.
Only catch is that it will chew up an additional 1.5" (?) of daylight.
On the flip side tho - the smaller chuck may be about that much shorter too?

A2 adaptors are not rocket science.


With that said tho - once your tools get past the Z length of the smaller chuck - they will still need to clear the spindle casting behind it.
The adaptor may not be bigger than the chuck tho?


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox