Monarch Lathe Identification help

[VicZannis]

I just recently purchased this Monarch lathe. I have not been able to find a data plate, serial number or model number. I think it may be a Model A, but I'm not sure. It is 16" X 32".
Can anyone help with the identification? I also need help with obtaining parts and operation manuals.
Thanks
Vic

 

[Richard King]

Usually the Serial number is stamped on the far top right end of bed just behind the front way in the clearance area. If you find it let me know as I have several serial number books I can look up when they made the machine. Looks like a 1930's machine

 

[johnoder]

Thanks to John Legge and Greg Menke for this scan:

http://pounceatron.dreamhosters.com/docs/monarch/monarch-modelc-setup-bulletin-127-1930.pdf

J.O.

 

[VicZannis]

I can't find a serial number on the ways. I contacted Monarch, and they said that any numbers would be on the right end, on the flat just behind the vee. That is where you said, too Richard. No sign of anything ever having been there. Thanks for the scan -that is definately the lathe I have.
Monarch said they would not be able to help on parts if it had a "lot number" instead of a serial number. Were machines with lot numbers wartime production?
Thanks for the help!
Vic

 

[DaveE907]

WWII Monarch lathes all bore serial numbers (also called sequence numbers). This list is a decent representation of "good enough" for most purposes. There have been some quibbles with it but they're in the small category. It's been posted on this forum several times, just passing it on to new viewers with full thank you to the original poster. Can't recall, it may have been Peter H.

I don't know early Monarchs, however it's likely your lathe predates the beginning of this list.

Your new lathe is older than you estimate, hope she makes you smile.

 

[johnoder]

Were machines with lot numbers wartime production?

Considerably before if you refer to WW2.

The scan is from 1930.

 

[DaveE907]

Thanks to you J.O.

Had the time to view your link,

 

[jlegge]

Monarch Models that have single digets are conehead lathes. To know the model of helical gear head we need to know the swing over the bed. For example a Model AA was a 14-16 ich swing (catalog, actual was more). Hope this helps, Serial number where always stamped between the vee and flat way on the tailstock end. Also note Monarch made nearly 10,000 lathes of all types during WWII and odds are your lathe might be from this period. Other clues to look for is they type of spindle nose your lathe has.

 

[VicZannis]

The swing measures 16". I have looked where everyone says the serial number should be, but it just isn't there. The ways have been scraped, but there is no evidence that there was ever a number there and I don't think scraping would have removed the numbers anyway. On the back of the lathe, below the headstock, there are four holes that look like there might have been some sort of data plate, but it is long gone, too.

 

[mike anderson]

The swing measures 16". I have looked where everyone says the serial number should be, but it just isn't there. The ways have been scraped, but there is no evidence that there was ever a number there and I don't think scraping would have removed the numbers anyway. On the back of the lathe, below the headstock, there are four holes that look like there might have been some sort of data plate, but it is long gone, too.

One way to come close to the year of manufacture is to look at the patents and try to match the year and the item to your lathe. It will take some time but maybe give you a rough idea of when manufactured.

 

[m37]

must be a real late or early mfg Model A, I have a Model A from 1932

the clutch lever arraignment and headstock cover
is different
the top selector lever for the QC gearbox has been moved,
carriage and tailstock looks the same
can't tell in the pic something is different in the leadscrew/feedrod selector

are the spindle speeds on the threading chart?
mike

 

[VicZannis]

Here is a photo of the leadscrew/ feed rod selector; it has a removable pin that locks it in one position or the other. Nowhere is there a spindle speed chart, (that would be helpful) but the threading chart gives TPI and carriiage travel only.

 

[johnoder]

TPI and carriiage travel only

Somewhat typical of oldies - even if they had power cross feed

You can eventually figure out speeds. There is a motor pulley and there is a clutch pulley. There is some ratio between these two. You can turn clutch pulley by hand in each gear untill spindle makes one turn (of course you engaged the clutch). You counted turns and portions of turns on clutch pulley and recorded them.

This is another ratio. Multiply those two ratios together and do the math for the motor speed. You have nailed down one of the speeds in this way.

Example:

2:1 motor to clutch
6.7:1 in speed "X"

2 X 6.7 = 13.4:1

You found motor speed to be 865 (it was 8 pole)

865 divided by 13.4 = 64.6 RPM in speed "X"

J.O.

P.S. What is on the brass tag on the gear cover?

 

[m37]

here is the speed chart
phone camera photo not super clear
reads at the bottom of chart
for 500rpm pulley speed

my leadscrew/ feed rod selector doesn't have the lock
your speed selector handles are more heavy duty looking

mike

 

[VicZannis]

P.S. What is on the brass tag on the gear cover?

The brass tag on the gear cover is the TPI speed chart in the photo. I rotated the photo 90 deg clockwise for the post.

Thanks for the speed chart, that does help

 

[jlegge]

must be a real late or early mfg Model A, I have a Model A from 1932

the clutch lever arraignment and headstock cover
is different
the top selector lever for the QC gearbox has been moved,
carriage and tailstock looks the same
can't tell in the pic something is different in the leadscrew/feedrod selector

are the spindle speeds on the threading chart?
mike

What you have is a model AA. Model A's were cone head lathes that were discontinoued by 1930. Monarch really didn't make many A's once they had the helical geared headstocks in the mid 20's.

John

 

[VicZannis]

OK, I'm convinced it is an "AA". Is there anywhere to acquire an operator's manual? I found a parts list online.
I got it bolted down and leveled up yesterday - it runs true, quiet and I can actually make BLUE swarf! I was never able to do that with the small Clausing I had before!

 

[johnoder]

Is there anywhere to acquire an operator's manual?

Link in post #3 is some, and here is some more from John L.sales related:

http://pounceatron.dreamhosters.com/docs/monarch/monarch-lathe-brochure.pdf

If you have the parts, that and other brief info (as in Post #3 link) is what the manual consists of.

J.O.

 

[VicZannis]

Thanks, J.O. This is very helpful!

 

[Bubba45]

Big Monarch Lathe ?

Just picked up a big Monarch lathe and am curious about it .

On the tailstock end ,right side top it is stamped with inspectors mark and CBB3438,and a U. an anchor and an S.

On headstock cover is an oval brass tag with 251 and underneath that is 006377 and U.S.N. stamped under that .

It is 18" from center to ways and around 58" between centers .

Any idea as to model and vintage ?

Thanks !