More new Haas issues.....

[smallshopwrench]

the machine is down under warranty needing a Z servo and possibly an amp. I am just a mechanic here, the only one in a shop of 40+ employees for multiple different machines ( CNC, shears, brakes, welders, saws, forklifts, facility maintenance, plumbing, electrician), all of it. The owner of the company prefers keeping the machine in warranty by NOT wrenching on it yet.I do get to once the warranty period is up, otherwise I have plenty to do elsewhere . If/when the owner says go I will go, until then we let Haas pay for repairs under their warranty. Admit defeat ? Are you serious? So tell the owner F off I'm doing what I want regardless ? I don't think that would end well lol.

 

[Speedie]

I understand it is not your machine. And you have limited access to repair. Being very practical from neccessity I am quick to repair myself in the past and not wait for a green light. No sense in me dragging you down here. But in my experience a discovery of an issue is the first stage of repair. Complaints without absolute answers to the issue are very wasteful of time. Carry on

 

[couch]

Travel limitations are in the Settings page and can be accessed without a service key.

 

[rwskinner]

Our ST15 kept dropping the activation codes when powered off, WIth the new update about half of our programs need to be altered or completely re programed for them to work.

Same here. The machine isn't sending the proper firmware version to Haas back home so it generates the incorrect codes. HFO can fix it pretty quick but it's happened to mine twice, on the weekend, and left me totally down. That sucked.

 

[smallshopwrench]

I understand it is not your machine. And you have limited access to repair. Being very practical from neccessity I am quick to repair myself in the past and not wait for a green light. No sense in me dragging you down here. But in my experience a discovery of an issue is the first stage of repair. Complaints without absolute answers to the issue are very wasteful of time. Carry on

Well after 2 weeks of downtime we finally got a tech in, luckily a pretty good one. Ended up having to replace the I/O board, the servo brake circuit had went bad and the brakes were not releasing. This also started happening on the tool changer carousel servo/brake too. On the bottom left hand side of the board there is a spare plug providing aux low voltage, when the tech switched the electric brake control wires to aux it worked fine thus isolating the issue . Just a tip for others down the road troubleshooting . Now we are getting low lube alarms twice a day after the "upgrade" we needed to purchase when changing our way lube grease canister out for the first time- despite it repeatedly passing the manual self check. Put another request in for service, meanwhile monitoring and running.

 

[Garwood]

Well after 2 weeks of downtime we finally got a tech in, luckily a pretty good one. Ended up having to replace the I/O board, the servo brake circuit had went bad and the brakes were not releasing. This also started happening on the tool changer carousel servo/brake too. On the bottom left hand side of the board there is a spare plug providing aux low voltage, when the tech switched the electric brake control wires to aux it worked fine thus isolating the issue . Just a tip for others down the road troubleshooting . Now we are getting low lube alarms twice a day after the "upgrade" we needed to purchase when changing our way lube grease canister out for the first time- despite it repeatedly passing the manual self check. Put another request in for service, meanwhile monitoring and running.

What did you expect buying a Tormach?

 

[smallshopwrench]

I expected problems when ownership bought 2 more Haas mills. Purchase was made due to 20 years of Haas programs already in existence was the official story there.
We have already switched to Okuma Mills for production and have always ran Okuma lathes. These last 2 VF4's were bought for job shop , the operators have 20+ years experience on Haas controls and zero on anything else. I argued for Okuma mills but in the end am just the lowly indirect labor company wrench not some highfalutin machinist who actually makes the company money lol.

 

[Garwood]

I expected problems when ownership bought 2 more Haas mills. Purchase was made due to 20 years of Haas programs already in existence was the official story there.
We have already switched to Okuma Mills for production and have always ran Okuma lathes. These last 2 VF4's were bought for job shop , the operators have 20+ years experience on Haas controls and zero on anything else. I argued for Okuma mills but in the end am just the lowly indirect labor company wrench not some highfalutin machinist who actually makes the company money lol.

I was just making an attempt at humor. How it's so beyond absurd that just about every owner of a Haas built in the last few years has pretty much the same complaints at every Tormach owner.

 

[smallshopwrench]

I was just making an attempt at humor. How it's so beyond absurd that just about every owner of a Haas built in the last few years has pretty much the same complaints at every Tormach owner.

Wasn't sure if you were cross threaded there lol. Well last Friday the operator was running a part (he already was 10 hours into) when after finishing up an op the spindle head started climbing away from part as usual then it suddenly dropped full force into the work piece breaking the tool and scrapping the part . Guess the I/O board wasn't the only issue. I'll update the saga when more news arrives. It's a real pretty shop ornament right now albeit an expensive one.

 

[Milland]

Forget the Haas technician - you need an exorcist.

 

[Mr. Atoz]

I expected problems when ownership bought 2 more Haas mills. Purchase was made due to 20 years of Haas programs already in existence was the official story there. end quote

How do I end smallshopwrench qoute?????? Holy crap, they are still running 20 year old programs? Written for tools that were used 20 years ago? Think of the huge advances in tooling in 20 years and imagine what the cycle times could be using the new tooling technologies. Are they still using fish oil for coolant?

 

[smallshopwrench]

we have a very strict rule of never ever updating our programs, they are actually bridgeport programs punched on tape we convert with a magic box to the Haas NGC. It's all out back in the shed behind the asbestos furnace filter building and the lead balloon workshop.

 

[thesidetalker]

Wasn't sure if you were cross threaded there lol. Well last Friday the operator was running a part (he already was 10 hours into) when after finishing up an op the spindle head started climbing away from part as usual then it suddenly dropped full force into the work piece breaking the tool and scrapping the part . Guess the I/O board wasn't the only issue. I'll update the saga when more news arrives. It's a real pretty shop ornament right now albeit an expensive one.

It dropped all on it's own? Or it was commanded to do that?

Usually a machine does what you tell it to do...

But it is a Haas. I've seen plenty of glitches too. Most notably the TCPC bs i've posted about somewhat recently, where under certain circumstances there is unexpected XYZ movement. It is fully repeatable too.

 

[Garwood]

"Holy crap, they are still running 20 year old programs? Written for tools that were used 20 years ago? Think of the huge advances in tooling in 20 years and imagine what the cycle times could be using the new tooling technologies. Are they still using fish oil for coolant?"

Brand new 2023 Haas barely meets the specs of better/mediocre MTB's from 2003.

Haas is about 20 years behind the times so it doesn't seem that big of a problem to me.

Haas can almost do the work of machines from top MTB's from the late 1980's. Big difference being those machines ran production for the past 35 years and are mostly still running. A new Haas is mechanically ready for the scrap bin after 5 years of the same work.

 

[smallshopwrench]

According to Haas, and they ARE watching every machine under warranty the operator hit "tool offset measure" and hit go . Of course the operator says he doesn't remember , must have been an accident due to the buttons location etc.... It hasn't repeated and they printed the whole incident out and their tech brought it to show us. He did however have 2 days in the lube system repair. I don't even know if i've mentioned that yet lol. So yes, I think you are correct in this case as far as machine being told what to do.

 

[smallshopwrench]

A new Haas is mechanically ready for the scrap bin after 5 years of the same work.

balderdash, no way man. 5 years is way to generous.

 

[Milland]

we have a very strict rule of never ever updating our programs, they are actually bridgeport programs punched on tape we convert with a magic box to the Haas NGC. It's all out back in the shed behind the asbestos furnace filter building and the lead balloon workshop.

Does your company still have the "cold-chisel-to-punched-paper-tape" converter? I need a copy if you don't mind...

 

[SeymourDumore]

balderdash, no way man. 5 years is way to generous.

OK, so let's not get stupid here and have a show off of who can trash Haas the most shall we?

Is Haas anywhere on par with it's better counterparts? Hell no!
In fact I'm willing to say that Haas of today isn't on par with it's own products from 15 years ago!
I have 6 machines from 4 different Japanese builders to prove that.

But to say that they are trash in 5 years ( or even less as stated in the bidding war ) is just stupid talk.
I have another 5 Haas machines to prove that too!

That said, the NGC is in fact trash straight out of the box, and I have 2 machines to prove that!

 

[Mr. Atoz]

Jeez, you guys are making me seriously depressed. It should be an interesting ride. Anyway, we have a 20 year old Haas SL-10. Small, plain vanilla lathe. No bells, no whistles. But for what it cost, and considering the tens of thousands parts that little fella made, it has paid back very well. But it is no 5 axis Haas. As I said, we do not have rainbows and unicorns expectations. We will be cutting mostly plastics and aluminum, so that is no real challenge.

 

[cwhuffman]

Jeez, you guys are making me seriously depressed. It should be an interesting ride. Anyway, we have a 20 year old Haas SL-10. Small, plain vanilla lathe. No bells, no whistles. But for what it cost, and considering the tens of thousands parts that little fella made, it has paid back very well. But it is no 5 axis Haas. As I said, we do not have rainbows and unicorns expectations. We will be cutting mostly plastics and aluminum, so that is no real challenge.

A lot of these older Haas machines can, in some ways, be better than the newer ones. I know a lot of people with early 2000 model VF2s, SL10s/20s, etc and they still make great parts (within reason obviously). I still think The 2010-2015 year haas VMCs are the best ones to get with the older, "classic" control.