Morse tapers sizes/Barnes tailstock

[meco3hp]

Hello,
I loaned my Machinery's handbook to a buddy last weekend and I need the dims for a MT1 and a MT2. I just got a new live center for my Barnes twin lead screw lathe. When I went to check the fit my new live center wouldn't go! When I first opened it I thought it was a little small for a MT2, but when I went to check it was too big! Tony's lathe site said they came with a MT2 tail stock. Any thoughts on this?

Thanks
Richard

 

[timekiller]

What size Barnes do you have?

#5 Barnes has a Jarno not Morse

Ray

 

[egpace]

Ray,
Just had the same thought, just might be a Jarno.

Here's the morse info anyway...

http://www.geocities.com/Axiom43/morsetapers.html

Good luck,
Ed

 

[machtool]

Richard

There a Table here that includes the Jarno tapers.
http://www3.telus.net/public/aschoepp/tapers.html

Regards Phil.

 

[meco3hp]

Hello,
It is a No. 4 1/2. Tony's lathe site called out a MT 2 for the tail stock. Anybody even make Jorno tapers/tooling anymore?

Thanks
Richard

 

[egpace]

Richard,
Centers, yes. Drill chuck adaptors, not sure.
Ed

http://www.geocities.com/Axiom43/morsetapers.html

http://www.jtsmach.com/jtswebshop/Workholding/LC017.asp

 

[meco3hp]

Hello,
I looked at the taper tables you guys sent me and I've measured an old center that came with the lathe and that fits it. For the large end I get .664 and on the smaller end I get .465. The closest I can figure it's a #5 jarno, but I'm not sure.
Any more thoughts on this?

Thanks
Richard

 

[meco3hp]

Hello,
I've been looking for a Jarno #5 taper live center. I've looked in all of the usual places. (MSC, Enco, J&L, Ebay, ect.) I've pretty much come up with either none or some that must of been made out of gold!(at least more money than what I paid for the lathe!)
What would you guys do? This is just a home hobby lathe, but I've put quite a bit of money/time into it the last few months and the bed has very little wear in it. Anybody have a Jarno #5 to MT #2 adaptor they'd part with? What about having a new tail stock barrel made to a MT #2?

Thanks
Richard

 

[timekiller]

Might consider modifing a #2 to #3 MT adapter sleeve to fit your application. I haven't researched it yet.

Neither have I found any inexpensive Jarno centers. I've read Grand Tool was a source, but haven't checked them out.

Ray

 

[Luke]

Are you sure the #2 doesn't fit? I have a 4 1/2 as well and my #2 morse fits. My shop is on the other side of town and I'll try and check this weekend to make certain.
I don't want to high jack your thread, but what is the value on these old Barnes lathes? I don't have a base on mine so it is just mounted to a bench with a DC motor and drive. I have the change gears, lantern post, and the steady rest. It also has a 3 jaw independant chuck (yuk).

Luke

 

[timekiller]

A Barnes #4-1/2 was original #1MT. However, sometimes equipment gets modified to better suit the tooling available.

I once ASS-U-MED that a Barnes #5 would be a #2MT since the Barnes #4-1/2 was #1MT and the Barnes #5-1/2 was #3MT. I didn't have a Barnes #5 at that time. WRONG!

As far a value as you know the buyer determines that. The closer it is to a complete pedal lathe the more valuable it is. Also the additional accessories will increase its value. Does it have the bench legs?

I saw a Barnes #4-1/2 sell on ebay with bench legs, steady rest, wood tool post, with both wood rest and a follow rest sell for $625 IIRC

However, the wood tool post with rest are rare, and the follow rest is very rare. In reality, the seller probably could have sold the wood rest setup and follow rest for that amount.

You wouldn't happen to have a Barnes tail stock turret attachment? With s Jarno taper? I'll give you $20 plus shipping for one! Bet shipping would would be a couple to several hundred dollars.

Ray

 

[meco3hp]

Hello, Ray,
Mine has every thing except a taper attatchment and a tail stock turrent attatchment. It's got 2 differnt face plates, steady & follower rest all of the change gears, wood rest, and it's got bench legs cast as one piece to the bed. I don't think it was a pedal lathe at any time though. I put a .0000 dial indicator on it and checked ALL of the bed surfaces and only came up with .001 variance. I put the mag base on the carriage and ran it back and forth to check the bed. Somebody took real good care of the lathe, although they forgot to oil the head stock bearings once and that screwed up the head stock spindle and bearings. I'm in the proccess of fixing that now. I stole it at auction for $350! I'll get my moneys worth out of it I'm sure.

Thanks
Richard

 

[timekiller]

meco3hp,
What size is your lathe? The size is cast in the lower flange below the head stock and usually stamped in the change gear chart

You have a rare piece with the follow rest. I have never seen or heard of them having a taper attachment. Does your lathe have a compound tool rest?

If you have the bench legs it likely wasn't ever pedal powered. The legs use a different mounting hole pattern. A lot of the time you find a Barnes on a bench it doesn't have any legs. One leg got broken so take the other one off and mount on a bench. Or if not a not a major brake cut the other legs to match.

Ray

 

[meco3hp]

Hello, Ray,
Mine is a #4 1/2 as far as I can tell. I'll have to go to the shop to confirm. I don't have a compound tool rest, (I'd like to find one though). I didn't know they made a turrent attatchment for them. I didn't figure they made a taper attatchment for them because I didn't see any place to attatch one. I'll just have to design one!

Thanks
Richard

 

[Luke]

Well Richard, Ray was correct. I went down to the shop today and measured my taper and I belive it to be a #1 Morse (not #2 as I mentioned earlier).
Although I could not find my dead center I used to use the center from my Craftsman wood lathe and it fit fine. Hope this helps. By the way, what color is youre lathe? Someone did a nice job of painting mine a nice deep green color. There is a spot on the back that it black -either primer or original???
Luke

 

[meco3hp]

Luke,
Mine is all black.

Thanks for the info.
Richard

 

[mmerrit2]

so is there a consensus as to what a barnes 4 1/2 screw cutter lathes tailstock taper is? I have what i believe is a barnes 4 1/2 screw cutter ( rebadged as a syracuse supply company circa 1885) and from one of the people at the company with a quick glance says this could be from 1890s to 1920s possibly. I have a drill chuck that i think doesnt fit in the tailstock. by the way i am an absolute beginner to this stuff so common terminology might put me behind everyone.

 

[mmerrit2]

i would like to get the correct answer to the tailstock taper for sure. I never got to ask the gentleman when i first talked to him mainly because i had no knowledge of tailstock etc etc. Now I cant get a hold of him.

 

[neanderthal mach]

http://www.lathes.co.uk/barnes/index.html I've no idea if it gives any information about your tail stock taper or not.

And there's further Barnes information here. http://vintagemachinery.org/mfgindex/detail.aspx?id=73&tab=3

 

[mmerrit2]

mine is black also. thanks mach, did quick look at pages and it doesnt seem to give up the info. will read deeper later. thanks