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Need help with my new 10EE

Cal Haines

Diamond
Joined
Sep 19, 2002
Location
Tucson, AZ
... It seems there is one small hole towards where the gearbox would go, that doesn’t belong?

View attachment 370986
I've never figured out the purpose of that hole. I don't think that they would continue to drill the hole if it served no purpose, yet all machines with versions of that of base (which include piggyback-exciter round-dials, right through WiAD square-dials) seem to have it. Maybe it's a tooling hole, used during manufacturing? You definitely want to plug it, since oil can get from the drain pan area to that hole and drip into the motor compartment.

Cal
 

Cal Haines

Diamond
Joined
Sep 19, 2002
Location
Tucson, AZ
Cal

I’m going to wire wheel everything off, but I’ve scraped with a screwdriver, and don’t see it.View attachment 370985
Very interesting. (I've never seen that before.) I suppose that it's possible that the bushing is held in by a light press fit into the headstock. I would try making a drift that will bear only on the bushing and not the end of the shaft (basically a piece of tubing). Go in from the switch end and try lightly tapping to move the bushing and handle assembly out.

Note that the switch shaft rotates inside a cast iron bushing, which is usually locked in place with the setscrew pair. The switch handle and bushing are pinned together by the slotted piece on the end that operates the switch itself.

Cal
 

Cal Haines

Diamond
Joined
Sep 19, 2002
Location
Tucson, AZ
Who suggested that anyone was experimenting? This is an older machine. They may have used a press fit initially and later changed to the setscrews. Not having to machine the sleeve to the closer tolerance needed for the desired class of fit may have been something that was eliminated as a wartime cost/time reduction measure.

Cal
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
I've never figured out the purpose of that hole. I don't think that they would continue to drill the hole if it served no purpose, yet all machines with versions of that of base (which include piggyback-exciter round-dials, right through WiAD square-dials) seem to have it. Maybe it's a tooling hole, used during manufacturing? You definitely want to plug it, since oil can get from the drain pan area to that hole and drip into the motor compartment.

Cal
Thought so. I’ll be sure to plug it, as it was not. I wonder if that’s where my leak was?
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
Who suggested that anyone was experimenting? This is an older machine. They may have used a press fit initially and later changed to the setscrews. Not having to machine the sleeve to the closer tolerance needed for the desired class of fit may have been something that was eliminated as a wartime cost/time reduction measure.

Cal
Was thinking the same thing. I’m stripping paint off the base and bed right now, but dealing with the headstock is next on my list, once I get primer on those 2 parts. I’ll be sure to let everyone know how the drum switch is removed
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
Just some random updates
CCF5BE9A-AEB1-42DE-A6C4-44BA52D11456.jpeg40975287-25BF-4C35-801E-475B8EC06599.jpeg

And some interesting marks I found on the castings.
F1007854-0C6D-419D-9111-2F328A306911.jpegBEAB1EAC-FBC4-4704-96DD-524CB6429E40.jpegC8D5A550-A26A-46E5-BE77-FC6A89B1C2B0.jpeg
 

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Cal Haines

Diamond
Joined
Sep 19, 2002
Location
Tucson, AZ
Anyone have a secret to getting the original factory gray paint off?
To the best of my knowledge, the filler that they used was a mixture of powdered lead and linseed oil. The factory paint was probably lead-based as well. I used wire wheels on air die grinders to strip the chip pan and bed to bare metal. It's a very messy proposition and perhaps not the safest way to go. Assume that any dust you create contains lead an take the appropriate precautions. Once you get through the paint, the factory filler seems to dissolve with mineral spirits. Any areas where the original paint/filler is stable, I suggest sanding it smooth rather than trying to strip to bare metal.

Cal
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
Uh.. top layer(s) come off easily with a push-blade or razor-scraper. Wallpaper wide-blade one for big flat areas, like the hatch covers and base. Windshield-decal stripper size for tighter spots. Manual, not power wire bristle "scratch" brushes for curves. Manual brushes catch and cut well, end up faster. Powered ones tend to ride-over or smear instead.

Suggest wherever you find a patch or few of OEM paint still "tight" you LEAVE it and simply fair it in.. as part of primer-surfacer-filler.

You do not get a special place in Heaven just because you strip Old iron machine-tools "to bare metal". A 10EE doesn't have to deal with underbody road salt on a wintertime highway!

Modern fillers and primers will go on over top of that OEM residual and grip just fine, so long as you cleaned it first.

Acetone is good for an immediate pre-paint final wipe, but all old oil and grease and their "varnishes" should be loooong gone before you are ready for that final.

I start with 'goop' waterless hand cleaner to shed the MASS of the trash. No odor. Easy clean up. Won't harm yer health ... as much...

THEN solvents, after it is already fairly clean.

Needs far less solvent that way, and the shop is a more pleasant place to be.

2CW
So I should be able to prime right over the old stuff? That would be amazing!
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
To the best of my knowledge, the filler that they used was a mixture of powdered lead and linseed oil. The factory paint was probably lead-based as well. I used wire wheels on air die grinders to strip the chip pan and bed to bare metal. It's a very messy proposition and perhaps not the safest way to go. Assume that any dust you create contains lead an take the appropriate precautions. Once you get through the paint, the factory filler seems to dissolve with mineral spirits. Any areas where the original paint/filler is stable, I suggest sanding it smooth rather than trying to strip to bare metal.

Cal
This is good news and will save a ton of time. I was prepared to strip the entire machine to bare metal. Where the OEM paint is stable, o will leave and prime over. Then body filler, sand then color, seal, etc.
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
Drum switch mystery solve…..

Tapered pin, removes the back half of the switch, which is the only thing holding the rod and switch in.
E2EA57E2-911A-4E88-9619-0132DF40BCF2.jpeg

Then the rod comes right out.
F1190FB1-D2EE-4A07-B604-497684257320.jpeg86EFA602-391D-4E02-8BC9-515BE6A4BA70.jpeg

And there’s a plate that comes off.
D82C406A-9D0B-4202-A12C-C940791D7EEF.jpeg

Then there’s a spring that pushes a pin behind it. Anyone know what this is for?
028926E9-798A-4DB4-8372-4B9146718F23.jpeg
 

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Cal Haines

Diamond
Joined
Sep 19, 2002
Location
Tucson, AZ
Drum switch mystery solve…..

Tapered pin, removes the back half of the switch, which is the only thing holding the rod and switch in.
...
No, the bushing is just pressed in, as I suggested earlier (when we discovered that you don't have the setscrews found on later machines). You DON'T need to remove the headstock to get it out. The entire assembly could be pressed out from the switch side without removing the taper pin. However, your taper pin would have been a problem with the simple tubular drift that I suggested; you would need one with a slot to clear the pin. I doubt that pin was installed by the factory. Mine is filed flush with the slotted sleeve. I also note that your bushing is bronze vs. mine, which is cast iron.

Note to future readers: Depending on the tightness of the press fit, it might be possible remove the assembly, with bushing, with light pressure on the slotted sleeve on the switch end of the assembly. I would try that before making the special drift.

While you have it out, what's the OD of the bushing and the OD of the slotted sleeve on the end?

Cal
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
No, the bushing is just pressed in, as I suggested earlier (when we discovered that you don't have the setscrews found on later machines). You DON'T need to remove the headstock to get it out. The entire assembly could be pressed out from the switch side without removing the taper pin. However, your taper pin would have been a problem with the simple tubular drift that I suggested; you would need one with a slot to clear the pin. I doubt that pin was installed by the factory. Mine is filed flush with the slotted sleeve. I also note that your bushing is bronze vs. mine, which is cast iron.

Note to future readers: Depending on the tightness of the press fit, it might be possible remove the assembly, with bushing, with light pressure on the slotted sleeve on the switch end of the assembly. I would try that before making the special drift.

While you have it out, what's the OD of the bushing and the OD of the slotted sleeve on the end?

Cal
I didn’t intend on taking out the bushing.
 

Cal Haines

Diamond
Joined
Sep 19, 2002
Location
Tucson, AZ
No, the bushing is just pressed in, as I suggested earlier (when we discovered that you don't have the setscrews found on later machines). You DON'T need to remove the headstock to get it out. The entire assembly could be pressed out from the switch side without removing the taper pin. However, your taper pin would have been a problem with the simple tubular drift that I suggested; you would need one with a slot to clear the pin. I doubt that pin was installed by the factory. Mine is filed flush with the slotted sleeve. I also note that your bushing is bronze vs. mine, which is cast iron.

Note to future readers: Depending on the tightness of the press fit, it might be possible remove the assembly, with bushing, with light pressure on the slotted sleeve on the switch end of the assembly. I would try that before making the special drift.

While you have it out, what's the OD of the bushing and the OD of the slotted sleeve on the end?

Cal
I didn’t intend on taking out the bushing.
Why not? It look like you have it pushed out part of the way already. Then you can put everything back in as an assembly. ... And maybe we'll learn something that will help the next guy.

Cal
 

rakort

Hot Rolled
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Location
Central Wisconsin
No, the bushing is just pressed in, as I suggested earlier (when we discovered that you don't have the setscrews found on later machines). You DON'T need to remove the headstock to get it out. The entire assembly could be pressed out from the switch side without removing the taper pin. However, your taper pin would have been a problem with the simple tubular drift that I suggested; you would need one with a slot to clear the pin. I doubt that pin was installed by the factory. Mine is filed flush with the slotted sleeve. I also note that your bushing is bronze vs. mine, which is cast iron.

Note to future readers: Depending on the tightness of the press fit, it might be possible remove the assembly, with bushing, with light pressure on the slotted sleeve on the switch end of the assembly. I would try that before making the special drift.

While you have it out, what's the OD of the bushing and the OD of the slotted sleeve on the end?

Cal
Yes this is curious. My 41 had the set screw for the bushing (which was cast iron). Interesting that this one was a brass/bronze bushing and apparently pressed in with no particular method to retain it. This doesn't sound like the Monarch that we all know.

Somewhere in here the OP asked about the spring. It is for a detent ball that holds the switch in the off position. If I recall correctly it was a 3/16" ball.
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
Why not? It look like you have it pushed out part of the way already. Then you can put everything back in as an assembly. ... And maybe we'll learn something that will help the next guy.

Cal
Ok, the peer pressure got to me..... I'll do it this week and let you know.
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
Hey guys, any advice on removing the tachometer, to prep for paint? Easy to do? Worth it, or just tape and paint around it?
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
We’ll the brass bushing came out with an easy tap. So it looks like it was a light press fit that held it in? Between the drum switch pressure and the hub connecting to the drum switch, there’s really no chance of it coming out.
46BF4CA7-D758-4075-9C85-94AE75262312.jpegF265273B-9C09-410B-ABDA-A4600960D5F9.jpeg7F9664BA-B22D-4CCF-8F69-1BAC3389F6BC.jpegF5622034-91F3-43D7-BF4F-F3E460848A23.jpeg07D58B25-D48B-4BF4-96C8-51A5AD40394F.jpeg4A1035A8-C38A-4CDA-9707-3293A8CB9EFE.jpeg
 

grounding

Aluminum
Joined
Oct 1, 2021
oh by the way, I dropped most of the lathe off at the sand blaster. I have up on trying to remove all that old paint.
 








 
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